Female or male making the first move?

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too many people, sadly, unfortuneately, make the argument that relationships are doomed for failure if they are initiated by the girl, in which the girl approached the guy or made the first move, I love to disagree with those people

With my first husband, I had to make the first move, repeatedly. To be perfectly honest, he was a very passive guy and definitely not ready to get married (24 yr old virgin, etc.) His extreme passivity became a problem in our relationship. Ultimately I lost respect for him as a man and a partner.

I'm married to someone else now who did make the first move. My experience will not generalize to everyone, but if a guy is unable to make the first move, ask yourself and look for evidence whether he is just pathologically passive.

Sounds sexist.

Guys shouldn't have to be the initiators all the time. That's sort of what this thread is about. If a man doesn't want to adhere to an outdated concept, that doesn't mean he's "pathologically passive." You sound like you're belittling men with that post.

I guess you can say a degree of passivity which is pefectly normal in someone who can afford it (generally a woman) is "pathological" in someone who can't (always or nearly always a man).

Or, she's describing someone who is passive in everything he does, including not approaching women, and that is not what she wants in a partner. If I were a gay woman or a straight man I would not want to be with a pathologically passive woman either, because it would not work with my personality. Perhaps she just knows herself well and knows that a passive man is not a good match for her personality.

I'm an old, old lady ... and a much better judge of character than I used to be.

In psychology classes they always tell you, the best predictor of future behavior - is past behavior.

If someone is pathologically passive perhaps one would notice in other important things rather than thinking if back in the day he did the first move or not, which could also be explained by simple shyness. Excuse me but the whole thing seems kind of stupid and pointless, and I believe is likely to have no other effect than put the shy guys in a bad light.

Shyness can be overcome. I'm not trying to put shy guys in a bad light, but shy guys shouldn't complain about all the women they can't get because they don't make the first move. Instead - learn to make the move!

Hey Jude, don't let me down
You have found her, now go and get her
Remember to let her into your heart
Then you can start to make it better

The subtle point is, only one of the members of the potential couple can test the other to make sure they're not "pathologically passive" by letting them make the initial approach. If both decide the other has to do it or is "pathologically passive", they'll conclude each other is, indeed, "pathologically passive" and never get together.

Maybe a good testing criterion should be to keep tests balanced: if you're always testing me, and I don't have a chance to test you, I want nothing to do with you.

As a male I'm fine with making the first move so long as it's already clearly a mutual situation from the get-go.

I don't want to be one of those guys who continuously approaches females and tries to hit-on/pick them up if it's not already established that it's mutual.

Because then I feel like I have to 'impress her' and 'earn' her time and attention - but if it's mutual it makes conversation easier and more comfortable knowing I've already got her attention at least physical-wise.

I also don't just take random chicks phone numbers but prefer to have at least a short 5-10 min conversation to get to know them a little bit already before asking for the number or would even do one of those 'instant date' thingies where you go on a date immediately after meeting them.

But, if ever in public and if i have the time/opportunity to approach when things are mutual, what should I be looking out for?? What signs/do shyer females tend to show interest or not? Even just eye contact and a smile or something, right?

I know many females don't approach due to shyness/anxiety or whatever, but what about just even expressing interest if they see an attractive male in general? Can they at least do that or as a male do I have to be extra vigilant/observant (read: will come across as creepy) just to try and pick-up N.T. women's cryptic clues.

Why we still center dating culture around mythology about genders? -beats me. Why do we need a dating culture anyway? Why can't people just have fun and be themselves?

Guys here are complaining that they are most often the ones expected to do the first move whereas girls can be approached more often, which on a forum with many people with subpar socialization skills doesn't seem to be such a baseless complaint.
You are telling girls that if a guy is shy to do the first move maybe there is something seriously wrong with him. You are perpetuating gender stereotypes and I believe that your words could potentially hurt many of the guys here.

Last edited by Peacesells on 29 Dec 2015, 8:54 am, edited 2 times in total.

Even if males are to be approaching, I think you as a female should at least make an effort to express interest if you find a male attractive.

I only approach so long as there's a green-light.

You don't have to be dead obvious (e.g. winking, blowing kisses, etc.) but a simple smile and/or wave hello and clear eye contact will get the message across.

It's different for all people but most males, possibly even many aspie males will assume a female finds them attractive or is at least willing to strike up a conversation if she intentionally goes out of her way to smile and wave directly at him.

Most women, if they like you, will show that they like you.

If a woman starts undoing your button-down shirt, then you know she wants you!

It's totally reasonable for you to make the first move in this case. I had to ask my boyfriend out because he was too afraid and oblivious to do anything. We went to high school together(never dated) and then reconnected in college. I was really surprised that he never had a girlfriend considering the amount of people I knew who think he's really attractive. My mom and I both think he's on the spectrum, so he was most likely completely unaware when women found him attractive. IF you're saying this guy is on the spectrum, he will likely be more oblivious to flirting than NT men, so you will have to give an a really obvious hint by asking him out.