I met a really sweet girl. I feel guilty about dating her.
I should have clarified that when I said mature, what I meant was the ability to figure out your own relationship preferences. I see what you mean by safety, though - non-threatening as in not really future-oriented. Nothing wrong with that, depending on your long-term goals, and hers.
I've been thinking, considering that my next date with her is tomorrow, and I came to a realization that I'm seeing a lot of parallelisms between this girl I'm seeing and my first girlfriend (sort of) back in 2002. I'll illustrate it with a list.
Situations leading up to my interest in dating her after she showed interest.
2002: All the girls I've been meeting before her specifically wanted a guy with a car, which I didn't have. This girl was perfectly fine with buses, and we even took one on our date.
2016: All the women I'm meeting have very home-oriented interests, strongly want kids, and aren't very outgoing (excluding platonic friends in my social groups). This girl is too young to be worrying about kids or settling down, which lets me relax and focus on just enjoying her company, even if non-sexually.
My reaction to her.
2002: I was so enthralled by the fact that she didn't care about my lack of a car, that nothing else mattered, even when I later learned that she was one of the least outgoing girls I ever met.
2016: I'm so afraid of women who want settle down/marry/have kids, that this girl seems like a breath of fresh air. As a result, she's very non-threatening. Not to mention I like her youthful passion, innocence, and the way she took initiative in finding that Middle Eastern cafe for our first date.
Her lifestyle/interests that aren't what I expected.
2002: She only wanted to hang out on campus (college), and never wanted to check out new restaurants, museums, and neighborhoods. Even inviting her to a dance event was like pulling teeth.
2016: She was totally cool on our first date; our compatibility seems to be very good, despite an 11-year-age difference (my AS plays a role, perhaps). But she dropped a surprise bomb by bringing a friend on our second date. Fortunately, I not only handled it well, but leveraged it in my favor.
I'm not sure how to integrate her into my overall lifestyle.
2002: She wasn't conventionally attractive at all, to the point of me being uncomfortable being seen with her in public. Having her as a girlfriend her felt like somewhat of a let-down, although I didn't dare complain.
2016: She's 11 years younger that me. Although my friends will only compliment me, my family might have more ambivalent reactions. Not to mention they secretly want me to settle down, which I don't want to do, and it's the reason I'm attracted to someone younger. Which again, clashed with what's "normal" in the NT world.
Funny how things come full circle a lot of times.
I have an update, and it's not a very good one. I just felt too upset to talk about it until now. Me and her went to outdoor dance lessons. We danced like two high school kids at a prom. (I know: not the best example for an aspie support site, but I'm sure you've seen movies.) But later during our date, when I admitted to her I was looking to date, she started talking about being friends, and that the affection---despite being nothing close to how platonic friends usually interact---was just a way of having fun together. Which I agreed: it was very fun. After all, what's so bad about intertwining fingers, cuddling, dancing with full-body contact, and playing with her hair? (Not unlike the impromptu cuddle party I had on the dance floor with three women on a cruise.) She stopped answering my calls and texts ever since. I suppose that's preferable to being just friends while wanting more.
You know, it's the first time in almost a decade when I felt genuinely upset about a failed romance. I can usually just brush it off and move on. And in the last three years, I found myself feeling relieved when a woman lost interest in me. This girl, due to her unassuming presence and non-threatening personality, not to mention cute face and slender body, was a big change from that. I had briefly talked this over with both of my friends and even their girlfriends; while their words of encouragement sounded sincere, none of them told me anything I didn't already know.
I think one contributing factor for the failure is that a part of me tried to sabotage myself. The cognitive dissonance this girl was giving me was just too damn strong, and my mind couldn't process it. No matter how much my rational self insisted it doesn't have to be this way, I can only imagine myself dating one of these types:
1) A woman who constantly yells at me and emotionally abuses me.
2) A woman heavily obsessed with marriage, getting pregnant, and having babies.
3) A woman with highly boring interests she forces me to take part in.
4) A woman who's overweight and/or unattractive.
5) Any combination of 1 thru 4.
This girl was absolutely nothing like this, from what I know about her. But the worst thing about this failed romance, is that it made me even more terrified of women my age than before.
Ichinin
Veteran
Joined: 3 Apr 2009
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,653
Location: A cold place with lots of blondes.
You have made real progress here, it was a small risk, but they are sometimes worthwhile in life.
Alright this one just might have been curious about an older man; she is twenty something, with many options, but now you have found an age and traits in a woman that don't terrify you!
There is always a compromise from the ideal, this age group might be more about having fun than even you are.
Time to update/tailor your dating profile?
To be honest, I don't see your dalliance as being a total failure at all.
In fact, I see it as being somewhat successful.
It should provide you with confidence for the future. At least you had a woman who wanted to be affectionate with you.
I've had these same situations--and I felt like I was teased. But then I thought: better to be teased than to be totally ignored.
You should use this experience as "scaffolding" for the next romance.
Frankly, I hope you find a woman who's as much interested in railroad signs as you are.
Well, I have yet another update, a much nicer one, with a bit of a precursor to it.
On Friday night, I went to an escort convention. The ones I usually attend are like classy cocktail parties in conference rooms, with many strict rules. This one was more like a rave in a warehouse, where other than the "Clothes on at all times!" rule, it was "Anything goes!". Music, alcohol, and hormones flowed like Niagara Falls. Food consisted of dried-out hot dogs under infrared lamps and cut-up fruit trays of poor quality. I kissed four escorts, danced with most of them, and talked to nearly everyone, men and women. I was having so much fun, that I missed the last train out (they stop running around 1:30 AM), and had to pay $70 + tip for Uber to take me home. It was so worth it, though. The driver asked me why I was so happy, but I just mumbled back about a "private event", while starting at the warm amber glow of streetlights whizzing by outside.
After I got home around 3:30 AM, I found a text from the "really sweet girl" (sent around 11:00 PM), inviting me to brunch with a group of her friends. There were 3 girls and 2 guys, counting me. After some minor awkwardness at the beginning, me and her pretty much picked up where we left off. Some mild flirting still happened: little things like me acting more alpha than I really am, and light affections like hand-grabbing. I'm sure it's the escort convention that allowed me to enjoy this girl's company for what she is: an affectionate friend. As opposed to reading more into things than there really is. Throughout brunch, I was acting super-relaxed and smiled a lot, causing her and everyone else to reflect the happy vibe back to me.
So it looks like I'm going to be friends with this girl after all. Which is kind of what I wanted from the get-go, due to having felt guilty about dating her. (Dating is no longer an option, which, in all honesty, both me and her are better-off for it.) While driving back home afterwards, I found myself thinking: "Wow, what a cool friend!" Especially now, considering that my current female friends are in serious LTR's, so I don't get to see them often anymore.
I guess it's back to the "division of labor" for me. Escorts can't give a real friendship where affections are exchanged, and this girl can't provide a hard-charging sexual environment that I crave. And LTR's with women my age flat-out terrify me. But in conjunction, I can enjoy each interaction exponentially more.
I have yet another update. Me and the Tinder girl are good friends now. We've moved off the Tinder platform, so I don't know if she uses it for dating anymore. We've been hanging out for a few months already. One mildly annoying part about her is the all-over-the-place, jumpy texting style, but I just deal with it. That, and I found out she gets motion sick on trains (but not cars, interestingly), but maybe I can convince her to take an anti-dizziness pill and ride a train with me one day. I can totally see the friendship blossoming, with her soft, easygoing nature and compatibility with my own quirks. It definitely goes against the message that's been (unsuccessfully) drummed into me: "My interests don't matter, only feelings do."
The friendship boundaries are a little unusual, to say the least. A lot of flirting happens, both verbal/texting and physical. We've done anything and everything up to but not including French kissing. Namely, hug chest-to-chest, put arms around each other, hold hands with intertwined fingers, ask each other sexual questions, tease each other about the sexual tension between us, and gently play-wrestle. I attribute the playfulness to her age, as well as her personality and mindset.
One recent incident clinched my respect for this girl (notice I didn't say "love" or "desire for relationship"), and made her seem even more endearing. She invited me to hang out in a historic town I know she likes. I took a train from my home for 8 stops, and she drove to meet me there. While we were walking around, we took a shortcut through a brick-paved alley, that once functioned as a normal street, but is now used only by delivery trucks. We heard Latin music playing from a Puerto Rican restaurant that had its delivery door open. That's when she turns to me and says: "Didn't you say you know salsa?" We immediately started dancing to the music right there in the grungy alley, until a truck honked at us.
What's really ironic, even considering the above situation, is that I wouldn't want to change any part of my friendship with her, other than finding out if she's a good kisser or not . It would be like implementing modern, post-WWII zoning laws (which are meant for cars and not people) in a beautiul, well-planned, centuries-old, pedestrian-friendly town. It would ruin everything very quickly, plain and simple. Quirky girls make for incredibly fun friends, but a relationship would just ruin the fun element. Because while friendships are about having fun together, relationships are about "intimacy" and "sharing" (notice the quotes).
On top of that, after I did some soul-searching, I don't think I'd be a good boyfriend! Imagine that! It's a total opposite of how I thought of myself at age 18, when being a "great boyfriend" (read: Nice Guy (TM)) was how I presented myself to potential girlfriends. (The "great boyfriend" part was further compounded by the messages I received from my therapist and the teenage media.) Now, my need for freedom/independence, guardedness, and insistence on "fun" are just too damn strong for most women, who tend to insist on very intimate relationships, which I'm incapable of giving.
As much as I'd enjoy having her as a FWB, since I refuse to get into an LTR, my conscience won't let me. She comes off as somewhat innocent and fragile, despite being very secure in herself, enough to dance in an alley used by trucks. I'd probably have no qualms about being FWB's with a more hard-charging, abrasive girl. But she's not it. Plus, I'm 99.9% sure she would be against that kind of thing to begin with.
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