Why don't women ask out men?

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Shinku Tora
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26 Dec 2018, 3:56 pm

Fnord wrote:
cberg wrote:
... Nearly everyone is REALLY f*****g UNDERPAID...
No ... nearly everyone believes they are underpaid, when they are only living beyond their means.


I wonder who it is. The ones who spend on necessities, or those with thousands’ worth of makeup and shoes.


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26 Dec 2018, 4:05 pm

Shinku Tora wrote:
Fnord wrote:
cberg wrote:
... Nearly everyone is REALLY f*****g UNDERPAID...
No ... nearly everyone believes they are underpaid, when they are only living beyond their means.


I wonder who it is. The ones who spend on necessities, or those with thousands’ worth of makeup and shoes.


No, we are underpaid. I wouldn't expect anyone of your spoiled rotten generation to understand. Are you seriously telling me your juniors make the same salary as you do?


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26 Dec 2018, 4:30 pm

cberg wrote:
No, we are underpaid. I wouldn't expect anyone of your spoiled rotten generation to understand. Are you seriously telling me your juniors make the same salary as you do?
The issue I addressed is that women are paid less than men. This is a fact, even in these "enlightened" times.

The issue you seems to be upset with is that people with less experience and/or time on the job are paid less than people with more experience and/or time on the job.

As for living beyond one's means, I'm referring to those who buy things they don't need with money they don't have to impress people they don't know or like -- people who can barely afford to put food on the table once each day, yet who own 200-dollar pairs of designer sneakers, 500-dollar gaming consoles, and thousand-dollar smartphones.

When life hands you food stamps, it is not time to buy a Cadillac.



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26 Dec 2018, 7:01 pm

Well young people just aren't paid enough to get by, regardless of gender. Look at pretty much anyone under 40 with a job on this forum if you require proof as usual.


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26 Dec 2018, 7:35 pm

Fnord wrote:
cberg wrote:
No, we are underpaid. I wouldn't expect anyone of your spoiled rotten generation to understand. Are you seriously telling me your juniors make the same salary as you do?
The issue I addressed is that women are paid less than men. This is a fact, even in these "enlightened" times.

The issue you seems to be upset with is that people with less experience and/or time on the job are paid less than people with more experience and/or time on the job.

As for living beyond one's means, I'm referring to those who buy things they don't need with money they don't have to impress people they don't know or like -- people who can barely afford to put food on the table once each day, yet who own 200-dollar pairs of designer sneakers, 500-dollar gaming consoles, and thousand-dollar smartphones.

When life hands you food stamps, it is not time to buy a Cadillac.


It’s not a fact it’s a opinion based on questionable logic and studies.
Go watch shoe on head she’s done care more research then me.



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26 Dec 2018, 8:04 pm

sly279 wrote:
... Go watch shoe on head she’s done care more research then me.
Unfortunately, much of June Nicole Lapine's content consists of tired talking points and strawmen. For example, Lapine argues that feminism is unnecessary because women have the legal rights of men (and because Lapine hasn't personally felt oppressed). She portrays feminists as whiny SJWs competing to be the most oppressed. She further describes feminism as existing only to solve First World problems, and suggests that feminists uncritically accept all abuse and rape accusations. Lapine also believes that, because the commonly-cited "average wage gap" figure doesn't account for confounding factors, the gender wage gap itself does not exist. In short: if you've listened to any other anti-feminist, you've already listened to Lapine's arguments.

Lapine has downplayed the negative consequences of his presidency and has defended some of his controversial behaviour and policies. Lapine's video, "faux hate crimes", is a reading of several obviously fake hate crimes allegedly committed by Trump supporters after his election. Although Lapine cautions that "I'm not a psycho who enjoys hate crimes", the implication is that "the sudden increase of hate crimes " is not real. She repeated this on Twitter.

June Nicole Lapine is just another outspoken anti-feminist and anti-liberal woman with a YouTube channel, and a willfully ignorant attitude regarding social and political issues. She simply knows how to attract a crowd and pander to her fans.

No thank you.



The Grand Inquisitor
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26 Dec 2018, 8:10 pm

Fnord wrote:
The custom of men asking women for dates (and rarely vice-versa) may also arise from the fact that women earn less money than men for equal work, coupled with the Western custom that the person who asks for the date is the person who pays for the date. This may make women reluctant to ask for a date, knowing that they will have less money left after the date than a man working the same job.

By the way, there is such a thing as a "Pity Date", where a person dates someone they are not attracted to only because they feel sorry for that other person's unattractiveness, poverty, or lack of self-esteem.

You're not completely off the mark here, though I'd say it's more likely that the trend of men asking women out and not vice versa has more to do with the fact that women used to not work at all, and as such would have had no way to fund any potential dates, and because that's the established norm, women needn't ask out men unless no men are asking them out.

All evidence I've seen about the gender 'pay gap' points to it for the most part being an earnings gap rather than discrepancy between pay for equal work. Men work longer hours, do more overtime, often work more dangerous or higher-earning jobs, and women who are mothers are more often the stay-at-home parent, so with all this in mind, it's not surprising that men as a whole make more than women as a whole.

Now that's not to say that women don't face barriers in the workplace that men don't that may hinder their ability to climb the corporate ladder. In a male-dominated workspace, the men are more likely to form an in-group preference, and thus may form stronger connections with the other men (particularly those with authority to give raises and pay rises) than women, which can lead to them being promoted faster and the like.

There are industries within which there distinctly are pay gaps. Hollywood would be the best example, and there may be other salary-negotiated industries that are the same.

Male sports stars get more than female sports stars, but that's simply because more people watch male sports stars compete, and as such there is a higher demand for them. It's similar to how female models are paid more than male models for the same reason.

Industries where you won't see a pay gap epidemic are retail, hospitality, places like that. It seems the higher paying the industry, the more likely that there will be a gap between the pays of men and women. I haven't seen evidence to suggest that there are many industries where men and women aren't given equal pay for equal work though. Most, if not all of those industries that do though seem to give their employees negotiation-based salaries, and in those industries, people tend to not know what their colleagues are making. Though the gender pay gap may be a problem in a few of the higher-end industries, it's certainly not a problem faced by every woman in every industry. I'd dare say in most industries they're able to earn as much as their male counterparts, though like I said above they may need to tackle a few barriers that men tend not to even need to think about.



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26 Dec 2018, 8:21 pm

Fnord wrote:
Unfortunately, much of June Nicole Lapine's content consists of tired talking points and strawmen. For example, Lapine argues that feminism is unnecessary because women have the legal rights of men (and because Lapine hasn't personally felt oppressed). She portrays feminists as whiny SJWs competing to be the most oppressed. She further describes feminism as existing only to solve First World problems, and suggests that feminists uncritically accept all abuse and rape accusations. Lapine also believes that, because the commonly-cited "average wage gap" figure doesn't account for confounding factors, the gender wage gap itself does not exist. In short: if you've listened to any other anti-feminist, you've already listened to Lapine's arguments.

Lapine has downplayed the negative consequences of his presidency and has defended some of his controversial behaviour and policies. Lapine's video, "faux hate crimes", is a reading of several obviously fake hate crimes allegedly committed by Trump supporters after his election. Although Lapine cautions that "I'm not a psycho who enjoys hate crimes", the implication is that "the sudden increase of hate crimes " is not real. She repeated this on Twitter.

June Nicole Lapine is just another outspoken anti-feminist and anti-liberal woman with a YouTube channel, and a willfully ignorant attitude regarding social and political issues. She simply knows how to attract a crowd and pander to her fans.

No thank you.

Though I agree with Lapine on some things, she doesn't seem particularly bright or well-researched to me. Not the exemplary political commentator in my opinion. Her schtick seems to be "Hey guys, I'm a woman against feminism!", and all she seems to do is bring up talking points that dozens of other people have already covered better. She certainly seems like more of a panderer than a genuine political activist/figure.



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26 Dec 2018, 8:23 pm

I don’t care if female ceos make less then male ceos. They all have way to much money as is.
That’s the only place I’ve seen signs of a wage gape on a large scale and while it’s not fair I don’t care and i dont know all the reasons behind it. Some might be discrimination others might not.

A lot of people get crap pay in USA so some rich woman making slightly less millions then a rich man doesn’t seem like a important issue to fight for.

Wage gap isn’t a real thing it doesn’t account for women working less hours on average or taking more time off on average.



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26 Dec 2018, 8:47 pm

sly279 wrote:
A lot of people get crap pay in USA so some rich woman making slightly less millions then a rich man doesn’t seem like a important issue to fight for.

You get paid what you're worth to an employer, though I agree that the minimum wage is a little low in the US. If you want to be paid more, you need to find a way for your labour to be worth more, which generally means upskilling.



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27 Dec 2018, 10:30 am

The Grand Inquisitor wrote:
You get paid what you're worth to an employer ... If you want to be paid more, you need to find a way for your labour to be worth more, which generally means upskilling.
There is no denying this reality -- if your skills are worth more, then you deserve to be paid more; and if your skills are worth less, then you deserve to be paid less ... or not at all!



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27 Dec 2018, 12:15 pm

Frankly, Lapine is more logical than 90% of frequent members on women’s boards.

Except Chronos, Amity, hurtloam and very few others.



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27 Dec 2018, 12:23 pm

The Grand Inquisitor wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Unfortunately, much of June Nicole Lapine's content consists of tired talking points and strawmen. For example, Lapine argues that feminism is unnecessary because women have the legal rights of men (and because Lapine hasn't personally felt oppressed). She portrays feminists as whiny SJWs competing to be the most oppressed. She further describes feminism as existing only to solve First World problems, and suggests that feminists uncritically accept all abuse and rape accusations. Lapine also believes that, because the commonly-cited "average wage gap" figure doesn't account for confounding factors, the gender wage gap itself does not exist. In short: if you've listened to any other anti-feminist, you've already listened to Lapine's arguments.

Lapine has downplayed the negative consequences of his presidency and has defended some of his controversial behaviour and policies. Lapine's video, "faux hate crimes", is a reading of several obviously fake hate crimes allegedly committed by Trump supporters after his election. Although Lapine cautions that "I'm not a psycho who enjoys hate crimes", the implication is that "the sudden increase of hate crimes " is not real. She repeated this on Twitter.

June Nicole Lapine is just another outspoken anti-feminist and anti-liberal woman with a YouTube channel, and a willfully ignorant attitude regarding social and political issues. She simply knows how to attract a crowd and pander to her fans.

No thank you.

Though I agree with Lapine on some things, she doesn't seem particularly bright or well-researched to me. Not the exemplary political commentator in my opinion. Her schtick seems to be "Hey guys, I'm a woman against feminism!", and all she seems to do is bring up talking points that dozens of other people have already covered better. She certainly seems like more of a panderer than a genuine political activist/figure.



She’s a youtuber, not a candidate for the senate elections.



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27 Dec 2018, 12:53 pm

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
The Grand Inquisitor wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Unfortunately, much of June Nicole Lapine's content consists of tired talking points and strawmen. For example, Lapine argues that feminism is unnecessary because women have the legal rights of men (and because Lapine hasn't personally felt oppressed). She portrays feminists as whiny SJWs competing to be the most oppressed. She further describes feminism as existing only to solve First World problems, and suggests that feminists uncritically accept all abuse and rape accusations. Lapine also believes that, because the commonly-cited "average wage gap" figure doesn't account for confounding factors, the gender wage gap itself does not exist. In short: if you've listened to any other anti-feminist, you've already listened to Lapine's arguments. Lapine has downplayed the negative consequences of his presidency and has defended some of his controversial behaviour and policies. Lapine's video, "faux hate crimes", is a reading of several obviously fake hate crimes allegedly committed by Trump supporters after his election. Although Lapine cautions that "I'm not a psycho who enjoys hate crimes", the implication is that "the sudden increase of hate crimes " is not real. She repeated this on Twitter. June Nicole Lapine is just another outspoken anti-feminist and anti-liberal woman with a YouTube channel, and a willfully ignorant attitude regarding social and political issues. She simply knows how to attract a crowd and pander to her fans. No thank you.
Though I agree with Lapine on some things, she doesn't seem particularly bright or well-researched to me. Not the exemplary political commentator in my opinion. Her schtick seems to be "Hey guys, I'm a woman against feminism!", and all she seems to do is bring up talking points that dozens of other people have already covered better. She certainly seems like more of a panderer than a genuine political activist/figure.
She’s a youtuber, not a candidate for the senate elections.
Which only serves to illuminate the fact that using June Nicole Lapine as a source of referential data is more ridiculous than relying on the campaign promises of a Senatorial candidate.

Again, No thank you.



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27 Dec 2018, 2:55 pm

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Frankly, Lapine is more logical than 90% of frequent members on women’s boards.

Except Chronos, Amity, hurtloam and very few others.

My feelings are hurt! :cry: ( :wink: )



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27 Dec 2018, 3:30 pm

AnneOleson wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Frankly, Lapine is more logical than 90% of frequent members on women’s boards.

Except Chronos, Amity, hurtloam and very few others.

My feelings are hurt! :cry: ( :wink: )


Sorry, you’re not one of those few others. :mrgreen: