Autistic women in abusive relationships!
Another issue is that autistic women are at a disadvantage when seeking help from police. When I was dealing with ongoing physical / SA, I was gaslit so badly that I thought it was all my fault. I finally got the nerve to call police and self-advocate. I tried very hard to be calm and to provide proof in a logical, rational way. I was interrogated for hours because they didn't believe I would have put up with abuse as long as I did, especially since I was a well-educated professional. They asked to see bruises etc but I didn't have any at the time because they were brand new injuries. It takes a few days for bruises to be visible. I gave further evidence of injuries which had been reported to my doctor in the past. They said that didn't matter because they weren't current.
They decided I didn't appear to be in distress so I must be lying. Their body language person said I had a flat affect and didn't seem emotional enough to be telling the truth. I have a flat affect and I was dealing with Alexithymia as well as Stockholm Syndrome, so I don't know what they expected of me. In hindsight I realise they probably judged the fact that I wasn't making eye contact with them. Apparently that tells behaviourists that we're lying.
They sent me back to the person and told him I'd reported him but "We aren't going to do anything about this", which gave him false confidence and made him retaliate even more as punishment.
The next time I contacted police I was very emotional and crying. I had visible injuries. This time, despite having filed a previous report, they sent me home because they thought I was hysterical, unreliable, and faking it to overcompensate for the previous time when they'd said I was too calm. I showed them bruises, bite marks, disfigured body parts, and hair pulled from my head. They said I could have self-inflicted the injuries to substantiate this second, frivolous accusation against the perp.
In short, police failed to help me because I was autistic. Once, because I was serious and non-emotional, and once because I was "hysterical" and overcompensating for my lack of emotion the previous time.
It wasn't until a male friend and female employer intervened that this person was hauled out and arrested for DV and attempted murder. Their word was taken over mine.
Yikes! Yes, this a big problem for us as autistic people.
To one degree or another, it's also a problem for marginalized people of all kinds. Too many people, alas, including too many cops, have a tendency to dismiss anyone who is not ultra-mainstream and ultra-respectable as not being "credible."
This is a systemic problem that can eradicated only through political/societal activism/advocacy.
In the meantime, it's one of the many reasons why we, as autistic people, need to have friends.
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- Autistic peer-led groups (via text-based chat, currently) led or facilitated by members of the Autistic Peer Leadership Group.
Luckily I have not been in any seriously abusive relationships.
And I suspect that one of my autistic traits -- my love of talking in-depth about my interests -- has helped me avoid abusive relationships. It has impelled me to seek out people who share my interests -- and who share my love of in-depth conversation about same. This is a very different kind of conversation from the kind that I suspect narcissistic people are more likely to prefer, which would more likely revolve around mutual flattery.
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- Autistic in NYC - Resources and new ideas for the autistic adult community in the New York City metro area.
- Autistic peer-led groups (via text-based chat, currently) led or facilitated by members of the Autistic Peer Leadership Group.
Luckily I have not been in any seriously abusive relationships.
And I suspect that one of my autistic traits -- my love of talking in-depth about my interests -- has helped me avoid abusive relationships. It has impelled me to seek out people who share my interests -- and who share my love of in-depth conversation about same. This is a very different kind of conversation from the kind that I suspect narcissistic people are more likely to prefer, which would more likely revolve around mutual flattery.
Actually, abusers employ a number of tactics, including research of and engaging in the interests of their targets.
Yes, lots of people, likely including abusers, will temporarily engage the interests of other people.
But how persistent are they about pursuing discussion of a topic merely because someone they are interested in happens to be interested in that topic? Most people lose interest eventually, and I wouldn't expect most abusers to be an exception to that rule.
Also, I would expect most abusive people to be much more interested in the kind of conversation that revolves around either buttering someone up or tearing someone down (either the person they are talking to or third parties), and that their evaluation of people would be their main focus, no matter what the topic, rather than simply exchanging information and ideas about the topic itself.
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- Autistic in NYC - Resources and new ideas for the autistic adult community in the New York City metro area.
- Autistic peer-led groups (via text-based chat, currently) led or facilitated by members of the Autistic Peer Leadership Group.
Yes, lots of people, likely including abusers, will temporarily engage the interests of other people.
But how persistent are they about pursuing discussion of a topic merely because someone they are interested in happens to be interested in that topic? Most people lose interest eventually, and I wouldn't expect most abusers to be an exception to that rule.
Also, I would expect most abusive people to be much more interested in the kind of conversation that revolves around either buttering someone up or tearing someone down (either the person they are talking to or third parties), and that their evaluation of people would be their main focus, no matter what the topic, rather than simply exchanging information and ideas about the topic itself.
Abusers can be quite persistent, actually. It can be like a game/challenge to them once they obsessively zero in on a target.
Yes, lots of people, likely including abusers, will temporarily engage the interests of other people.
But how persistent are they about pursuing discussion of a topic merely because someone they are interested in happens to be interested in that topic? Most people lose interest eventually, and I wouldn't expect most abusers to be an exception to that rule.
Also, I would expect most abusive people to be much more interested in the kind of conversation that revolves around either buttering someone up or tearing someone down (either the person they are talking to or third parties), and that their evaluation of people would be their main focus, no matter what the topic, rather than simply exchanging information and ideas about the topic itself.
Before an abuser can butter you up or tear you down, they first have to learn about who you are. They act all nice and considerate and safe, so you open up to them. They ask you all about yourself in the hopes you'll pour your heart out to them, so they can then use it against you. To more effectively do this, they are quite adept at performing various roles. The Charming Listener, The Concerned Friend, The Guy Who's Deeply Interested In You, The Emotional Support Pal - all designed to earn your trust, and learn your personality.
And in that regard, they can be amazingly persistent and patient. It takes time to earn trust, takes time to build a connection, time to build enough of a "relationship" to make it that much harder for the target to simply "walk away". They learn all about what others like or want or enjoy, not because they care about others, but in the same way a fisherman collects and learns about all different kinds of hooks lures and baits, and what fish they work on.
They may not care about Victorian art or books by Janet Evanovich or soft jazz, but they DO care about getting what they want, and doing what it takes to get it. Even if that means pretending to be interested in humming birds or David Bowie, or w/e their latest victim says they like.
That same time investment on their part also gets used against their targets - "So you're saying that the TIME we spent together means nothing now?!" - "We can't just THROW AWAY what WE have TOGETHER!" - "If YOU can just WALK AWAY from ME, then I guess you NEVER CARED!" Making the victim the bad guy yet again, for trying to leave an abusive situation.
They are willing to patient, cos once they have you, they can let it all drop and do whatever they want. And the same BS can be used again and again on future victims, should they also happen to like music by Pink or random facts about tapirs. It's part of their bag of tricks to lure people in, appear interesting or interested, and get their victims to see the abuser as a normal person instead of a parasite.
As easy as it is to think of abusers and narcissists as obviously overtly self-indulgent people who can't stop being self-absorbed, need every moment to be about them, and are perpetually only concerned with themselves and their image, this mostly represents a trope set by pop-culture, to make it easier to identify a scumbag within the 90 / 60 / 30 minute confines of a movie or show, and the 30 / 10 / 2 minutes of screen-time they might actually receive.
In the real world, few abusers are so easily spotted - those that are don't have much luck, as they're so obviously full of themselves.
The most dangerous abusers aren't narcissistic, so much as they are predatory. They don't think they're special, they aren't in love with themselves, they aren't hyper-focused on their image and how great they are, and they don't care about flattery or preening - there's something they want, and they're going to get it. They are "hungry", and you are "food".
Not cos they think they're awesome and therefore deserve things for being so awesome - but because they can. To them, if there's something they want, and they can get it, can just take it, then why shouldn't they? They can either get / take what they want, or they can't. That's all that matters to them. "I want something / how can I get it?", with no concern for all those pesky "rules" and "social conventions", which are just another obstacle to overcome, another problem to be solved, for them.
nick007
Veteran
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Joined: 4 May 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 27,769
Location: was Louisiana but now Vermont in capitalistic military dictatorship called USA
^^^People who are well intentioned can also be abusers. I've been one in my two previous relationships. I really loved them & majorly cared about them but I also had bad anxiety & bad OCD that causd me to be very controlling & unstable. My 1st girlfriend had problems with drugs & alchohol & cheated on me 1ce with her ex who gave her drugs. I was really worried about worse happening to her & was upset that my input did not seem to matter. I couldn't really trust her & started beleving things were going on that weren't. I picked fights & lashed out at her not because I was wanting to blame her or gasslight her but because I was trying to keep her safe & I thought I had major reasons to be worried. Things were a bit better in my 2nd relationship but we were very incompatible in some ways & I still had some problems.
Being on anxiety & OCD medication in my 3rd relationship helps a lot. It also helps that she's more clingy & needy cuz I'm the same way. However I do have one behavior that seems like a classic major abuse sign to others who don't understand the situation. Cass has a very codependant relationship with a couple family members who guilt trip her. One is demanding about her spending time with him & he's very controlling when she does. He accuses her of not loving him & threatens suicide sometimes when he cant get his way. Cass gives in because she will feel very guilty if she doesn't. She also has a lot of credit card debt partly cuz he wanted her to spend money on him & she is unable to tell him No. She also might make a major decision like moving based on him pressuring her instead of my input despite the fact that I would be moving with her. She gets very upset with things & turns to me for support. I often encurage her to try & set boundaries with him which to others it could seem like I am trying to isolate her from her family but he insists that I'm cheating on her because me & her don't have sex & I sometimes spend a lot of time on computer. It could seem like I'm the abuser for pushing Cass to set boundaries, spend a little lees time with him, & to consider my input before she spends more money that she does not have but my behavior is due to concern for her. I could also argue that her behavior towards me is abusive because she'll make a major decision that affects the both of us without me being on board with it & when she reachers her breaking point with things she'll get angry & take things out on me or she'll shutdown with me. Abuse may be a matter of perspective here & isn't that black & white. Perhaps all 3 of us are abusers but neither me nor her believe that we should break up over this. Any relationship we could get in would have problems & me & Cass both majorly try to discuss things & work together.
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