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Majority of autistuc men dont have a girlfriend?

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IsabellaLinton
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22 Jul 2024, 3:48 pm

cyberdad wrote:

Following red pill philosophy demeans women but rather than shield/conceal men, expose them to these systems of thinking (like racism, elitism, albelism (insert ism)). Otherwise how are they going to intrinsically change?


I don't know what red pill philosophy is, and I'm not sure I understand the question overall.

I wasn't raised with gender roles myself. Sure the media tried its best with toy commercials showing girls cradling dolls and boys exploding stuff, but my family didn't enforce anything like that. I think they knew I wasn't a "normal" girl anyway because I was nothing like my female cousins or my parents' friends' daughters. I was out driving boats and fishing from an early age. My mother actively kept me out of the kitchen and away from cleaning because she thought I was useless at stuff like that and she was embarrassed when I was around her with other women present.

My interests were mostly gender-neutral, like reading, writing, swimming, or playing with puppets. Animal from the Muppet Show was my favourite, more than the cute fluffy things. I liked drummers and listened to KISS albums.

Anyway sorry for the derail but it seems yet another example of how I didn't fit into either gender. That's why I consider my brain and my inner "self" to be non-binary.


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IsabellaLinton
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22 Jul 2024, 3:52 pm

cyberdad wrote:
TwilightPrincess wrote:
^^^ The problem is that Incel ideology functions a lot like cults. People who are liable to falling for such nonsense have a hard time finding their way out. Given that autistics are statistically more likely to becomes Incels, it’s an important thing to address when it comes up on this forum because it doesn’t seem like that way of thinking will lead to happiness or (successful) relationships..


Of course, there are echo chambers that cultivate extreme thinking and these are dangerous. But this problem exists with radical thinking when it comes to religion, race and politics too. How do you prevent people from joining incel groups? for that matter what is going in the heads of 75 million Americans (a bigger problem) who think Donald trump is a suitable person to lead their country? Apparently voting in sociopathic criminals is a democratic right?

Yes, maybe young autistic men are susceptible to incel philosophy, but it's like trying to enforce the internet with porn, ideally you don't want your kids to look at it but ultimately they will and you hope they make the right choices.


Honestly, I think the best way to stop Incel ideology is to have the government go hard against men who commit domestic violence and violence against women. Crack down on it. Shame it and prosecute it to the fullest extent of the law, so that other men will see how prevalent and wrong it is. With new generations of women feeling safer in their own homes or relationships perhaps they won't have as much PTSD or be fearful of dating men. Then the cycle that Incels perceive will be broken, and with luck there will be more harmony between the sexes.

I think violent men are to blame for starting this Incel trend, not women who don't want to date.


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22 Jul 2024, 4:33 pm

TwilightPrincess wrote:
I think it’s obvious to more people than you think.

With that being said, I think a lot of beliefs surrounding gender are built into society, and people absorb them from early childhood on up whether they are valid or not.

It seems like those in more conservative areas/cultures are more likely to adhere rigidly to/believe in established gender norms while others are more likely to question them and break the mold. I experienced that first hand having grown up in a conservative, fundamentalist religion, and eventually, leaving it behind as I questioned everything else in the process.

I was raised with a lot of erroneous beliefs surrounding gender.


I guess I'm unique in the sense that even though I'm conservative (politically), I think we should challenge stereotypical gender roles.



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22 Jul 2024, 4:36 pm

Graves Knight wrote:
TwilightPrincess wrote:
I think men and women are equal. That’s not to say that there aren’t any differences. I just think much of them are socialized or even nonexistent due to misinformation and confirmation bias.


That's a good take. In my personal opinion, I think men and women are different to compliment one another. I came to this conclusion because I'd prefer to look at actions and research before agreeing on what's being socialized. For example a person working with machines in factories vs being a teacher or a nurse. It seems like most women (not all) don't pick the jobs that men are mostly in. It's the same for men too. Most men seem to be more interested with things vs most women being more interested in the healthy upbringing of people.

Politically speaking, Women are more towards the left, and men more to the right; especially nowadays. That doesn't seem equal to me. As for the misinformation, something that could be true can be written off as misinformation as well.


Even though men tend to be more conservative (on average) among all generations, I hear the difference is extremely noticeable among Gen Z.

What's interesting (on the general topic of men being more conservative on average) is the fact men tend to be more sex-crazed (conservative and sex-crazed aren't exactly a combination you'd expect)



IsabellaLinton
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22 Jul 2024, 4:38 pm

We don't have to challenge imo. We just have to give people options. Some women are perfectly happy to fulfil traditional roles whether that's what their parents expected or not. They might want to cook and clean and be a full-time housewife who volunteers as a nursing assistant for babies every 3.5 days - or whatever it is women stereotypically do. Men might want to be "manly" and do the man thing.

There's nothing wrong with a person being whoever or whatever they want to be.

I think what you mean to say is that we should encourage people to be whoever or whatever they choose, assuming of course that they're good people who don't hurt others in the process.


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IsabellaLinton
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22 Jul 2024, 4:41 pm

SkinnyElephant wrote:
(conservative and sex-crazed aren't exactly a combination you'd expect)



Check funeralxempire's signature link for more info on this.

Edit: Darn. It's gone. FXE you might want to share that again.


Edit again: Oh look! I had it saved in my Bookmarks.


Here we go:
https://goppredators.wordpress.com/


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Last edited by IsabellaLinton on 22 Jul 2024, 4:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

TwilightPrincess
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22 Jul 2024, 4:44 pm

SkinnyElephant wrote:
Graves Knight wrote:
TwilightPrincess wrote:
I think men and women are equal. That’s not to say that there aren’t any differences. I just think much of them are socialized or even nonexistent due to misinformation and confirmation bias.


That's a good take. In my personal opinion, I think men and women are different to compliment one another. I came to this conclusion because I'd prefer to look at actions and research before agreeing on what's being socialized. For example a person working with machines in factories vs being a teacher or a nurse. It seems like most women (not all) don't pick the jobs that men are mostly in. It's the same for men too. Most men seem to be more interested with things vs most women being more interested in the healthy upbringing of people.

Politically speaking, Women are more towards the left, and men more to the right; especially nowadays. That doesn't seem equal to me. As for the misinformation, something that could be true can be written off as misinformation as well.

(conservative and sex-crazed aren't exactly a combination you'd expect)

Having grown up in a very conservative culture, I’d say that it’s exactly what I’d expect. It’s not just sex-crazed. It’s more about having sex urges like everyone else combined with a sense of entitlement and sexist beliefs regarding women.

We all get horny. It’s just that some folks believe that being horny is a good excuse to be an as*hole.

In my experience, the more conservative the culture the worse this stuff is.



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22 Jul 2024, 6:34 pm

TwilightPrincess wrote:
^^^ The problem is that Incel ideology functions a lot like cults. People who are liable to falling for such nonsense have a hard time finding their way out. Given that autistics are statistically more likely to becomes Incels, it’s an important thing to address when it comes up on this forum because it doesn’t seem like that way of thinking will lead to happiness or (successful) relationships.

Whatever the case may be, folks are free to address sexist nonsense when it arises here. Female members have to deal with a lot of it.


Perhaps the first step is to address why folks on the spectrum are more likely to become incels.



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22 Jul 2024, 6:35 pm

cyberdad wrote:
SkinnyElephant wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Why do boring people have so much contempt for people who prefer not-boring?


Pot, meet kettle. You complain about us supposedly having contempt for non-boring folk. Yet you're expressing contempt for "boring folk."

Many (perhaps most) spectrum folk are boring by normie standards. Apparently you're the exception (On another thread, you were celebrating marijuana and excess alcohol consumption. On this thread, you're complaining about how boring we supposedly are).

We don't have contempt for "non-boring" folk. All we're doing is acknowledging the fact a lot of normies aren't compatible with us.

Being on the spectrum, I'm surprised you aren't more sympathetic toward the fact a lot of us are "boring" (even if you personally aren't "boring")


I think you and I both know this is subjective thinking. What's cool/exciting for "normies" and what's likewise for "neurodivergent" is all in the eye of the beholder.


You're right. Subjective, eye of the beholder, etc.

For some reason, the poster I quoted appears to be more interested in normie stuff (despite being on the spectrum)



IsabellaLinton
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22 Jul 2024, 6:37 pm

What's the normie stuff?


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SkinnyElephant
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22 Jul 2024, 6:39 pm

IsabellaLinton wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
TwilightPrincess wrote:
^^^ The problem is that Incel ideology functions a lot like cults. People who are liable to falling for such nonsense have a hard time finding their way out. Given that autistics are statistically more likely to becomes Incels, it’s an important thing to address when it comes up on this forum because it doesn’t seem like that way of thinking will lead to happiness or (successful) relationships..


Of course, there are echo chambers that cultivate extreme thinking and these are dangerous. But this problem exists with radical thinking when it comes to religion, race and politics too. How do you prevent people from joining incel groups? for that matter what is going in the heads of 75 million Americans (a bigger problem) who think Donald trump is a suitable person to lead their country? Apparently voting in sociopathic criminals is a democratic right?

Yes, maybe young autistic men are susceptible to incel philosophy, but it's like trying to enforce the internet with porn, ideally you don't want your kids to look at it but ultimately they will and you hope they make the right choices.


Honestly, I think the best way to stop Incel ideology is to have the government go hard against men who commit domestic violence and violence against women. Crack down on it. Shame it and prosecute it to the fullest extent of the law, so that other men will see how prevalent and wrong it is. With new generations of women feeling safer in their own homes or relationships perhaps they won't have as much PTSD or be fearful of dating men. Then the cycle that Incels perceive will be broken, and with luck there will be more harmony between the sexes.

I think violent men are to blame for starting this Incel trend, not women who don't want to date.


Here's the thing though: A lot of abusive/dangerous men have no trouble getting a girlfriend/sex partner.

On the other hand, the vast majority of incels will never hurt anyone (the Elliot Rodgers and Alek Minassians are the exception, not the norm)



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22 Jul 2024, 6:40 pm

SkinnyElephant wrote:
For some reason, the poster I quoted appears to be more interested in normie stuff (despite being on the spectrum)
By “normie stuff,” do you mean things that you aren’t personally interested in? It seems like autistics often share similar interests as other people and vice versa which makes sense considering we’re all human. Autistics don’t all have the same interests, too.



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22 Jul 2024, 6:45 pm

Quote:
Having grown up in a very conservative culture, I’d say that it’s exactly what I’d expect. It’s not just sex-crazed. It’s more about having sex urges like everyone else combined with a sense of entitlement and sexist beliefs regarding women.

We all get horny. It’s just that some folks believe that being horny is a good excuse to be an as*hole.

In my experience, the more conservative the culture the worse this stuff is.


I guess I was thinking from the standpoint of my upbringing in the Catholic church. I had a very conservative priest who told us any sort of intercourse outside of marriage was wrong.



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22 Jul 2024, 6:46 pm

SkinnyElephant wrote:
Quote:
Having grown up in a very conservative culture, I’d say that it’s exactly what I’d expect. It’s not just sex-crazed. It’s more about having sex urges like everyone else combined with a sense of entitlement and sexist beliefs regarding women.

We all get horny. It’s just that some folks believe that being horny is a good excuse to be an as*hole.

In my experience, the more conservative the culture the worse this stuff is.


I guess I was thinking from the standpoint of my upbringing in the Catholic church. I had a very conservative priest who told us any sort of intercourse outside of marriage was wrong.

People can be as*holes about sex in marriage.



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22 Jul 2024, 6:47 pm

IsabellaLinton wrote:
What's the normie stuff?


Funeralxempire likes marijuana, likes to drink to excess, etc.

That was what I had in mind. Those interests are more common among normies. Most ASD folk prefer a quieter lifestyle.



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22 Jul 2024, 6:49 pm

TwilightPrincess wrote:
SkinnyElephant wrote:
For some reason, the poster I quoted appears to be more interested in normie stuff (despite being on the spectrum)
By “normie stuff,” do you mean things that you aren’t personally interested in? It seems like autistics often share similar interests as other people and vice versa which makes sense considering we’re all human. Autistics don’t all have the same interests, too.


I mainly mean party animal stuff when I say normie stuff.

I've noticed normies act shocked at the idea that I have no desire to be a party animal.

Most ASD folk have no interest in being party animals.