Blog post on the epidemic of forced celibacy in males

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What Hyperlexian is arguing comes down to "since there is no such thing as 100% perfect information then my ideology must be right."

As for my own experiences, the majority of the time spent is chatting away. I prefer independent girls who set their own schedules and get to keep everything they receive as part of the arrangement. Ironically in one session we spent most of the time explaining how things work to each other. I explained computers in depth (mostly the office suite programs and basics of Internet privacy) while she explained the dynamic nonverbal communication of a nightclub. I've also hired my regular for mandatory social events so as not to appear to "spergie". It's not that I didn't try hard enough prior to seeing an escort. I read Louis and Copeland and RossJeffries(garbage BTW) and I was getting nowhere. I upgraded my
Appearance but simply couldn't put it all together. I was sick of the repeated LJBFs that got me
Nowhere. When I saw my first working girl, I felt like a huge weight was off my shoulders. Guys are under huge pressure by their biology and subsequently their society to appear as if they can attract women. Now being a slave to societal approval is stupid because most people couldn't care less about you in the long run but some
Element of keeping up an appearance is required for the rewards social acceptance brings. Hence the reason for social escorts. Frankly as for that whole
Shaming bit about "buying friends etc", we "buy" friends and acquaintances all the time. Not being a lazy monkey at work buys you the acceptance of your boss. That gym membership and fancy clothing and high end cologne buys you increased odds of attracting women to you. Buying books on social skills in turn buys you increased odds of getting along with people that you need to optimally function in society. Everything is a transaction whether we want to admit it or not.

Also sex tourism is a no-no for me for reasons of security and major lack of certainty that the girls are not trafficked.

Poverty sucks all the way around. It is disgusting to see people losing their jobs while some wall street banker gets bailed out. Poverty is also something in the eye of the beholder as well. One trap sex workers have to watch out for is getting addicted to the fast money.

I admit to being somewhat spoiled by these experiences since the reward cycle that motivates men to conventionally date is short circuited.

As somebody living in Vancouver, where Canada's oh-so-awesome "system" set the stage for Robert Pickton to murder 49 prostitutes, I hardly think Canada's "system" has been a success of any sort. I cannot imagine a more dismal failure.

In Vancouver there is a two-tier prostitution system. There is an expensive system of "escorts" working for businesses that rent commercial space and pay municipal taxes. Men who can afford to hire these women don't have to worry about the police. Then there are the women working the streets: drug addicts, women on welfare looking to make their lives a little less dire, women too young to work in the legal businesses; women who have to hide in corners where the police can't find them to turn their "tricks" and whose working-class customers will get busted by the police if caught (whether you euphemistically call it "education" or not, it's being busted by the police, taken to court, threatened with jail unless the man recites what he's told to recite, and no, I'm just repeating how it's been described in the newspapers, and what can be read between the lines). Pickton's 49 victims came exclusively from these women. After all, women working for the escort services would have been missed immediately, and the services would have known whom the woman was last seen with. Whereas drug-addicted prostitutes? After they'd been missing 6 months the police would say "Eh, they must have moved to another city."

AFAIK the system is the same across Canada: same criminal laws, same organised crime, when I lived in Toronto the same mix of "escort services" in the Yellow Pages and Now and women working the street. It's an utterly morally bankrupt system of favored privilege and pointless deaths, from completely preventable drug overdoses as well as the deaths on the street.

Prostitution should be legalized immediately, along with heroine and cocaine (not just for sale anywhere, but by medical prescription, to be used in supervised facilities, in order the break the monopoly organised crime currently has on the stuff). I don't have any illusions that the results would be anything nice middle class people would want to see. But the results could be pretty ugly and still be far, far better than what we've got now.

And no, this isn't about me. If I wanted a prostitute, which I don't, I could find the money for the escort services. But I've been down and out (financially, not in terms of trouble with the police) and lived in Vancouver's Lower East Side, and I'm not blind that I couldn't see what goes on there. And there's been far too many deaths already. It's heartbreaking if you've actually known women like them, and I don't want to see any more die.

Sounds like she's a friend . (No, not an eternal soul mate, but a friend.)

And incidentally I doubt that she, and others like her, will ever show up in the studies Hyperlexian quotes. Prostitutes don't want to be found, to come to the attention of law enforcement or be interviewed by nosy, much less preachy, academics. She'll be happy if she goes her whole career without being noticed, and the ladies who succeed in that won't be reported in those studies.

Me and RICKY5 share the same things: He, like myself only go to independent women who get to keep everything they make and he, like myself avoid sex tourism where the women may be trafficked.

And people called me all sorts when I told them that I paid for sex! If people took the time to listen to me, then they would see that I am not an evil person. I am just an Aspie who can't get none who took this route so I could get some.

You should be blaming the women who pointed me in the direction that I took. Yes, women can refuse me love and things and I can get saddened by that, but their behaviour does ultimately dictate to a man what happens next in the subject of sex. Man has always been a highly sex species, nothing will change that. Women have to realise that.

Damn straight.

Another good post.

So hyperlexian, what's wrong here in your eyes with Ricky and craigs solution to their situations? We know the not-having-sex-for-umpteen-years, getting-a-gun-and-shooting-people-approach has been proven to not be a very good one, so we have to discard that option.
Or would you prefer they were miserable and frustrated instead?

nostromo, RICKY5, Craig28: i provided alternatives for lonely men about 11 time in this thread alone. i also already refuted every single one of your points already. about 17 page ago i even provided evidence to back up my statements. i can see clearly that you have not really read what i have written, so if you do not have anything new to add, i do not see the point of debating the same points again.

There only two ideal choices for a man to get sex: have a relationship or pay for it. The 3rd and most grotesque option. which is obvious, is the one that is the most heinous for a women.

Hperlexian, its obvious that we have different views on the same subject: your a women and I am a man, we've been brought up in different environments with different opinions and visions for what our eyes have witnessed as we progress through life.

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what i am talking about are the japanese males who travel to poorer asian countries for the purposes of sex tourism. i am not trying to characterize men in japan as worse than men elsewhere by any means. i was just wanting to clarify that they have their own issues with prostitution which extend beyond their own borders, so if we only considering the prostitution within japan compared to other regions, it would seemto be a well-contained and civil arrangement, which is not accurate.


yes, i don't support it from an feminist moral or ethical standpoint (there are multiple feminist standpoints on this issue). however, if a government created a framework with all of the conditions i listed a couple of pages ago, i would accept that my ethics would no longer be based on actual harm done to the women, and i would either change my opinion or step aside and stop arguing against it. right now, even in the best systems, women are still harmed by the profession, even where it has been regulated or legalized. that goes beyond ethics or morals.


sort of. it is an improvement, but it has been shown to still be damaging to the women, and in places like amsterdam it is still largely run by pimps and drug lords. there are some small benefits it is true, but that doesn't mean that the women are not still in a physically and emotionally damaging situation, and that is my main focus. please note women already have the same legal protection under a criminalized system.


sex trafficking started before legalization, and increased after legalization. it's true that the reasons are still being debated, but it does not change the fact that it has happened - which absolutely does demonstrate that legalization doesn't reduce sex trafficking (the main argument for legalization is that elements like this will be reduced).

there are many studies that support my points, but i have been mocked in this thread and others for using actual evidence to support my point-of-view. some are presented by activist organizations, but they are not the authors of the studies.

EDIT: about it being the best alternative solution... sweden is trying a different approach - keep it legal for the prostitutes, and illegal for the customers. and one region in canada tried re-education of Johns (99% non-recidivism success rate, so change is possible), and social and psychological services for the women.

I do have to agree those are the most honest ways. There is always deception. Whether it's just flat out lying, or salesman-type coaxing and seduction. Never paid for a prostitute myself, but I'm not opposed to the idea.

There was a great quote from a movie that said "you don't pay a prostitute to have sex with you, you pay them to leave". I've found this to be true over the years. When you have sex with someone because they want to and you have no intention of a relationship, there's a very good chance you're leading them on.

i forgot to address your comment about friendships costing money, RICKY5... it is a new argument so i will talk about it with you.

first of all, i was taught that a friend you have to buy is no friend at all, and anybody who buys their friends is not worthy of respect. but maybe not everyone was raised like that.

if you truly are purchasing your friends through some kind of real or imagined transaction, i actually feel sorry for you because that is sad. i have real-life friends with no money or gifts required. we care for each other emotionally and altruistically, and support each other even without expecting anyhing in retrun. i feel bad for you if you have never experienced that.

just because you don't have friends for free does not mean that the rest of the world is having the same experience. your opinion is based on your experiences, which seem to have been filtered through a layer of cynicism, and it dismisses the experiences of other people.

basically, is a gift the same thing as a purchase? no.


have you ever tried therapy to learn to respect yourself and women? your posts in WP again and again point to the fact you do not respect women. in one place you blamed it on your mother, but have you ever worked at fixing your actual problems? because disrepecting women is not a trait of asperger syndrome - that is your own issue, and women do not want to date a man who is that hateful or bitter. you chose to pay for sex, but as soon as you start 'selling' the idea on WP, i am going to continue to argue against it - your choice seems to have been made out of bitterness, and it colours your promotion of sex services.



p.s. you have no way of knowing whether the woman you see is an independent contractor or not. who does she rely on for protection if things go south? that will point to any pimp who may be taking a cut. does she do her own bookings or run her own website? from the sounds of it she does not, because you were having to explain the workings of computers to her.

Ricky and Craig can do what they want, I've got nothing against guys who pay for sex.

I don't think anyone should be "blamed" for it though, stop trying to make out everything in your life is other peoples fault. Sorry, but I have no tolerance for guys who shift all their blame onto girls who won't date them. No-one is entitled to date whoever they want. Everyone has(or should have) a choice. The fact I had to go to the police about one probably makes me biased. The guy was psycho.

I'm not actually blaming women, I am just saying that the constant rejection can lead a person into the opposite direction where they pay for sex and say a big "F it" to a relationship. After so many let downs, you begin to analyze why a relationship is important and thats where I begin to see the negative sides of being in a relationship.

I don't see anything wrong with that personally. It's a lot more respectful and right to pay for sex than it is to grab a woman and rape her. I wouldn't worry about defending what you do. A lot of people don't see it as a problem.. some will go "Why cant he just go without?" But its a personal choice of him and the person he pays; none of anyone elses business.

people who buy prostitutes are not less likely to rape women - going to a prostitute doesn't prevent women from getting raped. and some people even specifically target prostititutes to rape them.

in fact, incidences of rape have actually risen in some places where prostitution has been legalized. i don't know the exact cause of the rise in rapes, but prostitution has definitely not prevented it.

it isn't a personal choice in countries where it is illegal, anyways.

As soon as experiences come up that disagree with your ideology(secular religion) you immediately go to the "lalalalalala can't hear you!" track of argument.