Every time I think pickup artists can't stoop any lower...

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I've noticed most of the women and men attacking me are from the UK or somewhere else. My beef is with American women and the men who defend them. I don't know enough about women of other nationalities to make a judgement.

Extremely well-said

I wish I had a more discipline in this regard...

It's not you that's being attacked really, it's your views and attitude. They are separate, but easy to confuse.

That's because they count on him only being abusive to others(which they like). Then the woman starts whining and complaining as soon as it doesn't work in their favor.

The United States is an extremely diverse nation with many, many different subcultures and is influenced heavily by British culture too. If you can't make it in your own country, you won't make it anywhere else unless you just want a woman to act as your pet.



Yes; indeed.



Indeed; they never look at how this guy treats others and think to themselves: "if he treats others like this, how's he going to treat me when something doesn't go his way?" - of course, some thuggish types often don't even need an excuse, no matter how tenuous.

With women like that, there's nothing anyone can do. They want trouble and more often than not they'll find it.

I've read pick-up material, and I think it is neither right nor wrong, it is simply information. It's not as simple as making a woman feel bad about herself, that's just something that immature guys use, it is much more complex than that in my opinion.

I think the key to PUA stuff even working, and making it a win/win for you and a lady, is being a man who has integrity and confidence enough to know what he wants from life, and from other people, and is not dishonest or disrespectful about this. Maybe lower-level PUAs are like this, I don't know, I haven't really met any.

I will say though, that I don't particularly identify with all that a PUA stands for, just that the material and suggestions they have, aren't necessarily wrong or right (negging is obviously an exception, and generally some of the top PUA material doesn't really advocate it)

Just my thoughts on this particular issue.....

f*****g PUAs. They are scum and deserve to die alone. :/

I don't think all of them are. I think some of the things that PUAs teach aren't exclusively PUA material, but something that they've studied as being more attractive to a particular portion of women on this planet, through behaviour of men who are generally more attractive to women than most guys. That's my own personal observation really.

I think most guys would learn PUA material because they want to be able to better interact with women (and even people in general) rather than be socially inept or awkward and end up not living a life deemed satisfactory to them. I understand this as although I am adept at socializing, I do fall short in the dating area.

I have no wish to be a PUA, but there are subtle nuances in socializing that I wish to learn lol

I'd rather be alone than use some of these stupid pick up lines.

same.....its better to be able to make up your own. Using your imagination works wonders (if you have the balls)

Frankly, I see it as a guy lying about who he is or putting the woman down in order to manipulate her for sex. If you aren't successful with a particular group of women, work on yourself and move on. No need to put on a facade to score with some girl in the sack. If you're such a great guy, you shouldn't need to resort to dishonorable tactics in order to find someone. Sometimes all one needs is time and to be at the right place at the right time. Go out, find a hobby, practice socializing with friends and eventually things should look up for these guys. Bitching about women on the internet isn't going to help.

Yeah...I know....seeing as how I LIVE THERE. Or are you just trying to say that British women are like American women? In which case, I'll stay away.



I don't want a woman to act as a pet, but if women from developing countries would treat me better, I'm definitely up for that.



How so?

What I'm trying to say is that women are women. People are people, and each have their individual personalities and quirks. Some women are very submissive, others are very dominant. Others are people-pleasers, others won't take any nonsense from anyone. Some are extremely social, others are like hermits. Others like danger, while further others are very risk averse. Some are dirty and horrid looking, others are clean and very well-groomed. Women are fat and thin (and everywhere in between), young and old, are a range of races, religions (of all kinds and none, some virulently so) and have all kinds of different interests in life. Some are very, very selfish.

You could end up with a woman who horribly victimises you, cheats on you, cleans out your bank account, publicly humiliates you, regularly beats you to a pulp (or, worse, gets other members of her gang that she's involved with to do it), and bullies you into horribly debasing yourself. Do you want that? Because I wouldn't.

You need to stop thinking "I need a woman". That's likely to lead to rejection and if not, abusive characters homing in on you and robbing you and harming you. You need to think "what is the right woman for me?" and tune a lot of the more unsuitable women out.



Most often they're looking to use you either as a springboard until a 'better', wealthier husband comes along or they are using you in order to feed their extended families. With the language barrier, this is often a doomed liaison. What's more, the women doing this know this and are keeping you sweet so they can look after themselves first and foremost. Think of that as a business arrangement.

You want someonr to love you for you, and that can't happen while you're in such a self-loathing state of mind. Think positive. Think how much Quality you have. More than a lot of other guys, trust me.

I didn't say anything about "dishonorable" tactics, and I certainly don't subscribe to or condone dishonesty or disrespect when dealing with anyone. I think you misunderstood what I posted. Otherwise, I agree with you, and there are a lot of guys who do this, whether they are PUA or not.

OP, I believe the term for what those guys were talking about is "negging", which I personally think is manipulative, and only works on someone with low self-esteem, so it's kind of predatory in that respect (which kind of proves Erisad's point)

I err on the side of the proverbial fence, in that I can see what Erisad is saying, yet I also have gleamed positives out of what I learned from reading some of the PUA stuff I have read. In my personal opinion, you have to be able to filter out the bad stuff when it comes to handling information, as information is neither good nor bad, it just is. However you interpret or apply that information is up to you.

Fair enough.

Negging is a very crud form of hypnotic fractionation. Hypnotic fractionation is used in a non manipluative manner in both neuro-linguistic programming and Ericksonian hypnotherapy.