A Self-Made-Man girl discovers that life as a man is harder

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The_Face_of_Boo
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16 Jul 2015, 12:49 am

XFilesGeek wrote:
As someone who's experienced society being perceived as both a man and a woman, I can say that which is "harder" depends entirely on the situation at hand, and, on the personal preference of the one experiencing it.

I've also read enough articles by transmen who swear being male is way easier....so...opinions, man.


And where are these stories?

I've found nothing of this sort.

All what I' ve found are stories of the opposite, like this one:
http://www.libertyviral.com/is-living-l ... her-story/

But not sure how genuine is that, it can be some angry MRA agenda...

Norah on the other hand sounds very objective; and her indentity is verified; and her story doesn't sound to serve any agenda, whether some sort of feminism or MRA.



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16 Jul 2015, 1:24 am

I think aspie men have it harder in life than most people see. I think people don't see how much aspie men get harrassed or assaulted by other men. Especially because male culture is such where we don't talk about those things so much or expect support/sympathy as much as women seem to get from each other. Not to compete with women, but I think a lot of women are unwilling to see the issues vulnerable-looking disabled men men face.



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16 Jul 2015, 2:06 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
That's no secret, but from her interview, she also said she found out that many women out there, want a manly man - not the soft and emotional man.

Interestingly do these women clearly and unfront say that they want 'manly' men?
Since claiming they want one thing and expecting their dates to, somehow, work out that they want something else is likely to be especially difficult for aspies.

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So it's not only men who expect men to act manly.

It's PC to blame all social ills on 'men'. Even though the way in which social norms are pushed is far more complex and subtle than that.



The_Face_of_Boo
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16 Jul 2015, 3:41 am

Btw, there's one thing that I think Norah didn't get it totally right, is that sex is totally a bodily function for men, but it is not, in fact it's partly mental too, much more mental. I don't think that Norah checked the guys' pants to see if they were really aroused - hugging and kissing the stripper doesn't mean he's really aroused down there - so she got it all wrong.

When I went to a strip club once, and it was my only time, with a bunch of guys.... I didn't get aroused, not even a bit - the girls were simply so outrageously fake in their attempts of seduction. When walking home, the guys looked at each other and asked, 'did you even got aroused?' - and everyone were like "nah, not at all" - there were even who paid for sex and said they didn't even cum.



The_Face_of_Boo
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16 Jul 2015, 6:54 am

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“Dating women was the hardest thing I had to to as Ned, even when the women liked me and I liked them. I have never felt more vulnerable to total strangers, never more socially defenseless than in my clanking suit of borrowed armor.
But then, I guess maybe that's one of the secrets of manhood that no man tells if he can help it. Every man's armor is borrowed and ten sizes too big, and beneath it, he's naked and insecure and hoping you won't see.”

― Norah Vincent, Self-Made Man: One Woman's Journey Into Manhood and Back Again



Last edited by The_Face_of_Boo on 16 Jul 2015, 7:01 am, edited 2 times in total.

The_Face_of_Boo
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16 Jul 2015, 7:00 am

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“Ditto for the stereotype about men monopolizing conversations. Like Sasha, many of my dates—even the more passive ones—did most of the talking. I listened to them talk literally for hours about the most minute, mind-numbing details of their personal lives; men they were still in love with, men they had divorced, roommates and coworkers they hated, childhoods they were loath to remember, yet somehow found the energy to recount ad nauseam. Listening to them was like undergoing a slow frontal lobotomy. I sat there stunned by the social ineptitude of people to whom it never seemed to occur that no one, much less a first date, would have any interest in enduring this ordeal.”

― Norah Vincent, Self-Made Man: One Woman's Journey Into Manhood and Back Again


My goodness!! ! The horror!! Ned's experience is the same as mine!

I recall this one date who kept talking about her ex non-stop, about his family, his work, his brothers...I felt life I was on a date with him, not with her.



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16 Jul 2015, 7:10 am

I believe in women's oppression, but I've never related to the man-splaining stereotype. I've spent my life around loud, outspoken women. A lot of these women sound like they are not taking responsibility for being shy people themselves.



The_Face_of_Boo
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16 Jul 2015, 7:14 am

Indoor, women yelling at men (in every small matter) happen more often than men yelling at women.



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16 Jul 2015, 7:24 am

" I listened to them talk literally for hours about the most minute, mind-numbing details of their personal lives; men they were still in love with, men they had divorced, roommates and coworkers they hated, childhoods they were loath to remember, yet somehow found the energy to recount ad nauseam. Listening to them was like undergoing a slow frontal lobotomy. I sat there stunned by the social ineptitude of people to whom it never seemed to occur that no one, much less a first date, would have any interest in enduring this ordeal.”

"I recall this one date who kept talking about her ex non-stop, about his family, his work, his brothers...I felt life I was on a date with him, not with her."

this describes a couple of women I have dated. Luckily, I have also known women who were more clear headed and able to put their past to rest - or at least bring it up when relevant without obsessing over it. Better conversation and more two sided.



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16 Jul 2015, 7:49 am

Fnord wrote:
Maybe it's closer to the truth to say that for some things, men have it easier than women, and vice-versa.


Pretty much this.

And what counts as "hard" comes down to personal preference. And, from my own perspective, I've found that being a man can totally suck at times, which is why I don't believe in "male privilege."


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XFilesGeek
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16 Jul 2015, 7:54 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
XFilesGeek wrote:
As someone who's experienced society being perceived as both a man and a woman, I can say that which is "harder" depends entirely on the situation at hand, and, on the personal preference of the one experiencing it.

I've also read enough articles by transmen who swear being male is way easier....so...opinions, man.


And where are these stories?

I've found nothing of this sort.

All what I' ve found are stories of the opposite, like this one:
http://www.libertyviral.com/is-living-l ... her-story/

But not sure how genuine is that, it can be some angry MRA agenda...

Norah on the other hand sounds very objective; and her indentity is verified; and her story doesn't sound to serve any agenda, whether some sort of feminism or MRA.


Usually, these stories can be found throughout transgendered websites/discussion groups/chatrooms/ect.

If you're not inclined to hang around those places, you likely haven't encountered them.

Oh, and then there's my own personal story, which leads me to believe modern society has some pretty screwed-up expectations of both sexes.


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16 Jul 2015, 8:48 am

There really is no benefit or privilege to being a straight man in 2015 other than we can take a piss anywhere really conveniently, there just isn't. I don't think most women can appreciate that I could probably go the rest of my life without a single member of the opposite sex ever showing interest in me, it's on me totally to find anyone and I imagine its the same for a lot of men. Being on the spectrum it basically handcuffs in us what most other men and women consider masculine, I'd say most of us are in store for very lonely lives. I've thought about how things would be different if I were gay or a woman and it just seems like a much less miserable existence, there are still some barriers but at least then you don't feel totally unwanted to the world. I'm not a sociopath, I can't manipulate or trick anybody.

Men are the disposable sex, if we cut the male population by half and it wouldn't make a difference and would probably increase the quality of life for the remaining men.



Last edited by Jacoby on 16 Jul 2015, 9:00 am, edited 1 time in total.

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16 Jul 2015, 8:56 am

This might sound like the most simplistic advice ever:

But you HAVE to put yourself out there.

You have good intellect. Girls/women will respond to it, especially as they proceed through their 20s.



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16 Jul 2015, 11:17 am

Simple as it may sound, "putting yourself out there" has proven well beyond my ability so far.

Jacoby wrote:
Men are the disposable sex, if we cut the male population by half and it wouldn't make a difference and would probably increase the quality of life for the remaining men.


That's what war is for.


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16 Jul 2015, 11:32 am

Spiderpig wrote:
Simple as it may sound, "putting yourself out there" has proven well beyond my ability so far.

Jacoby wrote:
Men are the disposable sex, if we cut the male population by half and it wouldn't make a difference and would probably increase the quality of life for the remaining men.


That's what war is for.


Pretty much. I heard someone say that war is inevitable in any country when the ratio of men becomes to high, maybe that's what should really scare people about China.



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16 Jul 2015, 11:40 am

I like how these posts always go in a direction in which you'd think there are no autistic women...after all, all women are the same even the ones with autism and other neurological and/or mental conditions have it 100 % easy, all they gotta do is look pretty and a viable boyfriend will come along...obviously this is how it is for all women.


Anyways remember there are autistic women and women with other conditions who struggle just as much if not more with relationships than your typical male. And what the f*** is a self made man girl? Did she undergo a sex change...or just dress like a dude....maybe her uh 'costume' wan't very convincing and that has something to do with the difficulties she found in picking up females whilst digusied as a male. Sure historically it has been males who make the first move, that trend can be seen even today...though its not unheard of for a female to initiate anymore...but its been ingrained in society so long its still more or less a 'norm'.

Sure might be hard for your typical autistic male to find a model quality, drop dead gorgeous blonde with lots of friends and an impressive social life that wants them for a boyfriend, but no it is not impossible for autistic males to 'get girlfriends' might not get one that will serve to hide your akwardness and raise your social status by being 'hot' but you could look for someone with some common interests you actually enjoy spending time with or attempt to meet people in venues that cater to your interests.......But of course I know many guys would rather have a drop dead gorgeous blonde with large boobs who dresses sexy and is ready to drop them as soon as something better looking, with more money or offers a better time comes along then someone they really bond with who maybe isn't as visually 'satisfying'. Of course i am generalizing some...but this thread is already full of generalization.


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