Is it unfair of me to ask my gf for a prenup in this case?

Post Reply New Topic

You seem like a reasonable and fair person Nurse, hope you find your hunny.

Personally, I don't believe in prenups, but if one person has money problems and always spend all their money during the month, having separate accounts is a must. This is how I and wife arranged it (she was the one always spending her money). Without that, we would never have money for unforeseen things. I'm also the one that owns the house, but since we have children, that really matters little.

Still, I think that if you trust each others, you don't need a prenup, so I'd still argue that requiring this is a trust issue. It could be legitimate given her reactions, so maybe this girl is somebody you shouldn't trust?

i can remember the last thread you did, OP....in that thread you described your relationship as "95% perfect and that she's a wonderful person etc" ...cept for the money issue which was the "5%" that bothered you. or words to that effect.

i honestly thought after that thread and the mention of prenups, you would have both split up, but, here you are again...

unlike the majority of people, i think you are bang out of order. a prenup for the sake of 200k? that's the value you place on the "95% of your relationship that's perfect"? on her? seems cheap.
no wonder she's retaliated as she has. you've already issued an ultimatum by suggesting a prenup so i'm not surprised at this turn of events.
she's hurt. and that's on you.
you aren't just heavily weighting the income disparity between you and making her aware of your dissatisfaction with how little she has by comparison to you, you are, by suggesting a prenup over a paltry 200k, telling her loud and clear what you value more.

there are ways to protect oneself and to my mind, your way isn't it. if you have doubts over her. end it. you are both on very different sides of the equation on this one and i can't see a way forward that will ever reassure her, or you.

she deserves better than this.

Things probably could have been handled a little differently, but you are definitely not out of line. The important thing to remember is that she is probably not reacting this way out of malice or greed -- she has just been socialized to think a prenuptial agreement reflects negatively upon the relationship, instead of being a sound financial decision on your part. It is tough to break that kind of prejudice, but discussing it with her in a few weeks when she has had some time to think it over or going to counselling would be a good idea.

For right now, don't take the whole "I'm never going to have a kid with you" thing too seriously. It sounds like a kneejerk reaction and not a carefully thought out conclusion. Sometimes people say some pretty hurtful things in the heat of the moment. You two can touch upon the subject again in a few weeks / after counselling.

Stick by your guns on this, but also be patient with her.

If she wont sign a prenup she is most likely planning to fleece you. You've been warned, OP.

My advice is not to get legally married at all, however I'm guessing neither of you would like this idea.

I suggest you handle this differently.

If children are the issue then ensure that is contracted so you come up with something that is reasonable and forward thing.

Don't just go with the lawyer's first suggestion go together and come up with something that is fair.

I think the whole financial legislation around marriage is flawed IMO.

I think the state should have minimal interference in private life. We have a responsibility to our offspring this has nothign to do with marriage.

Okay thank you everyone for the responses. I have looked them all over. It seems that a lot of people are split on whether I was fair to her or not.

It was not my intent to hide the attorney from her at all, I just wanted to meet with one before I brought up the prenup to her, cause I wanted to know what I was talking and wanted to know how to explain something to her that could have been an issue with her. So I just wanted to have more knowledge of how it works, before telling her that is all. She just happened to accidentally sign into my email by mistake and saw the email with the title heading prenup on it, that was emailed back to me from the lawyer, and she became upset.

But it seems everyone is split on the issue. Some are saying it's completely fair of me to want a prenup before getting married, and others are saying that 200k is not a lot of money and I am being too materialistic about the issue, over love.

I even asked my two friends on their opinion. I told them that because of my past experiences, I vowed to get a prenup, after I have had been taken advantage of in the past.

One friend said that she agrees that if I break my how, I'll end up loosing my self respect, since it's the vow I made to myself, and your vows make you who you are to yourself, she said.

The other friend disagreed and he said that I am letting my past experiences put my gf in the same category as those other women before, and that's not fair to her, and I am putting too much emphasis on the vow, rather than love and happiness together. But the other friend disagreed saying that by keeping the vow, I am not putting her in a category and it's not about her.

But when I made the vow, I didn't say I only vow to let certain people of a lower category not be in a position to take advantage of me. I vowed never to let anyone period.

Was this bad or unfair of me?

As for going to counseling, my gf is very upset and angry about this, and I did promise to marry her before, saying we would get married this summer. So I do not have time to go counseling and have to make a decision quick to move forward or not.

I love and feel I cannot live without her. But at the same time, I feel like in my relationship experiences, I have given in on other people's terms too much, to the point where it effected me before, and I feel I for once need to have a term for myself out of principle. Is this being unfair to her, or putting her in a bad category? Of course I trust her, I just feel it's my turn to get something on one of my terms for once in my dating life.

Is that unfair of me to think that way?

Handy Repost:

Myth #1 – Prenuptial agreements are only for the wealthy. No. Prenuptial agreements are for ordinary people. Given the high legal fees and stress involved in a divorce, the frequency with which relationships end nowadays, as well as peoples’ increasing financial sophistication and independence, a prenuptial agreement can benefit just about everyone.

Myth #2 – Prenuptial agreements are only useful if your relationship breaks down. No. Prenuptial agreements can be useful estate planning tools. Without a prenup, your spouse may be able to invalidate your carefully thought out estate plan. A prenup can be especially helpful if you have children from a previous marriage or have family heirlooms that you want to keep in the family.

Myth #3 – Prenuptial agreements are unromantic. No. Being able to sit down and discuss with your partner both of your future financial plans and expectations for the relationship will lead to a more solid foundation for your relationship than simply expecting your love to take care of everything.

Myth #4 – Prenuptial agreements won’t be upheld by the courts. No. Although courts occasionally do invalidate prenups, these are normally ones prepared without the help of attorneys, or ones where there was coercion in getting one partner’s signature. If you have a properly drafted prenup, and there was no duress, it is likely that your prenuptial agreement will stand up in court.

Myth #5 – Only men want prenuptial agreements. No. Prenuptial agreements are a useful way of setting out your and your partner’s expectations for the relationship. There’s no need for a prenup to be biased in either partner’s favor. For instance, a woman may insist that if she is going to stay home and raise children, that her prenuptial agreement include provisions to compensate her for this interruption in her career through spousal support.

Myth #6 – Prenuptial agreements are expensive. No. Compared to the cost of an average wedding or an average divorce, prenuptial agreement are a bargain. The best way to think about it is like buying insurance: it’s a small one-time cost for something you never hope to use, but if you ever need it, you’ll be glad you have it, and it will save you a lot of money.

Okay thanks for the input. It was also pointed out in another post, on whether or not my gf would have to pay for a lawyer and pay for part of the prenup. I actually told her that I was going to pay for her lawyer, and pay for the whole prenup myself. I told her that she can have things in the prenup that are completely in her favor as well and we can sit down and come up with an agreement together, and I am paying the fees for it for her.

But I don't think she is going to become more interested in one. She told me that it's either marry her without a prenup or do not marry her at all, cause she is not going to sign one no matter what is in it at all. She is willing to do other things for me in the finances, and made suggestions such as having separate bank accounts or things like that. But she will not marry with a prenup, no matter what it is in it, and will not see a lawyer to talk about it, even if she doesn't have to pay. And no couples counseling is going to change her mind either she says.

So with this in mind, assuming she is not bluffing and this is the worst case scenario, what should I do? I have to make a decision here, and I can either break my vow I made to myself and feel I would be losing my self respect if I do so, or I can choose love. Or do I let my dignity rule over me too much and am being too self-righteous and materialistic?

Her reaction is a red flag and pretty immature, but not necessarily a deal breaker. So let me ask some questions. How old is she? How old are you? How many years have you been dating? Are you genuinely happy? Do you have common interests? Do you have both have interests outside each other? Besides this, how often do you two fight? What do you usually fight about?