What do men want?
The_Face_of_Boo
Veteran
Joined: 16 Jun 2010
Age: 42
Gender: Non-binary
Posts: 33,106
Location: Beirut, Lebanon.
So, how do you explain how these traits were emphasized over the hundreds of thousands of years of human evolution before the "porn industry" ever got started?
They were emphasized over the hundreds of thousands of years of human evolution, I did say those women who are already seen feminine are more likely to be accepted in the porn industry (same for fashion, beauty contests...etc).
But the porn industry have emphasized those traits even more, maybe by 10000 years in advance .
So, how do you explain how these traits were emphasized over the hundreds of thousands of years of human evolution before the "porn industry" ever got started?
They were emphasized over the hundreds of thousands of years of human evolution, I did say those women who are already seen feminine are more likely to be accepted in the porn industry (same for fashion, beauty contests...etc).
But the porn industry have emphasized those traits even more, maybe by 10000 years in advance .
Totally true
it's a completely unattainable standard of beauty for most women and to be constantly judged against this standard is a crushing experience
I want the males/people doing all this judging to experience a little more of it themselves for a change
Unless Pitbull offers to date you, then you would throw your bra in a blink of an eye.
Maybe if I was being date raped? Or drunk? Never want to be drunk and have a man try and rape me.
Whoa! Who mentioned rape? No, not that.
Never mind.
Oh sorry I just meant I would never take off a bra in front of any man. That's just not the type of woman I am. If I was perhaps drugged or intoxicated then I may do it. But that's something I never want to know. Sure I may be tempted to do wild things like the women in the videos, but really I wouldn't do it.
_________________
Anna
If you're not happy with yourself, you'll never be happy with somebody else. (Don Omar)
Why do you demand women look so perfect when you do not is what I am saying
What are you yourself bringing to the table that entitles you to be so demanding and judgemental?
It is not logical to me at all
It seems to be a general masculine sense of entitlement that is totally unrealistic and directly fed by the media
Wow, that's a bit harsh. I know I'm no Gerard Butler or whatever, but I know I'm decent looking.
I'm not asking anyone to look perfect, in fact I didn't even really offer my personal opinion other than towards that one specific girl.. I'm not attracted to her, and even if I was, she's clearly not my type if her career is "Dances in horrible music videos". I was reflecting on the same cultural phenomenon you were, except I have a less jaded opinion than you do, the reasons for which I can guess but I won't bother stooping to your level.
My standards are not unrealistic, or "ridiculously judgemental".. especially since you're basing that assumption on my characterization of one woman as unattractive. I'm not attracted to her, want to sue me over it too? I'm mostly attracted to women with light skin tones.. caucasians (french, irish, german, russian.. doesn't matter really), asians, and "olive" skin tones from south america.. she does not fit in to what I am personally attracted to. There are clearly men out there who find her attractive, since they used her in this music video, but I am not one of them. Get over it.
I'm not going to get into detail, but I have been with enough women to know what it is I don't want anymore, and I am sticking to those standards because I know that if I don't, I end up very unhappy.
I think you may be viewing me as some kind of shallow pig, whereas you couldn't be further from the truth. I indeed was like that before, and had some very pretty women in my life, but I compromised for looks over everything else.. and I learned a lesson the hard way.
The only reason I have focused purely on looks is because that is where this discussion has been focused. I have many preferences and 'red flags' that are not physical in any way whatsoever.
Why do you demand women look so perfect when you do not is what I am saying
What are you yourself bringing to the table that entitles you to be so demanding and judgemental?
It is not logical to me at all
It seems to be a general masculine sense of entitlement that is totally unrealistic and directly fed by the media
Wow, that's a bit harsh. I know I'm no Gerard Butler or whatever, but I know I'm decent looking.
I'm not asking anyone to look perfect, in fact I didn't even really offer my personal opinion other than towards that one specific girl.. I'm not attracted to her, and even if I was, she's clearly not my type if her career is "Dances in horrible music videos". I was reflecting on the same cultural phenomenon you were, except I have a less jaded opinion than you do, the reasons for which I can guess but I won't bother stooping to your level.
My standards are not unrealistic, or "ridiculously judgemental". I'm not going to get into detail, but I have been with enough women to know what it is I don't want anymore, and I am sticking to those standards because I know that if I don't, I end up very unhappy.
I think you may be viewing me as some kind of shallow pig, whereas you couldn't be further from the truth. I indeed was like that before, and had some very pretty women in my life, but I compromised for looks over everything else.. and I learned a lesson the hard way.
The only reason I have focused purely on looks is because that is where this discussion has been focused. I have many preferences and 'red flags' that are not physical in any way whatsoever.
If I was harsh I'd say you were equally as harsh towards the woman in the video
It seems to be ok for you to rip her appearance to shreds but not ok to do the same to you - why is that?
Are you somehow better than her?
If I have a jaded opinion it's because of a lifetime of obnoxious idiots questioning my gender and attractiveness to each other in the same vein as you yourself have done towards that woman
it's not often I get right of reply towards people with such unpleasant attitudes
I'm realistic about the way I look but you appear to be more than a little delusional
Your whole character is a 'red flag' before anyone even moves onto how you look!
Even though there were fewer women?
It's a cycle: Women with certain traits are already seen as feminine and those are more accepted to the porn industry, then with time, little by little, these traits were being emphasized/enhanced/exaggerated to attract more male viewers, which is in return altering the view of younger viewers.
And voila!!
Exactly!
and people seem oblivious to the effect all these media stereotypes are having on them
And with the use of cosmetic surgery increasing people aren't even competing with natural 'perfection' or femininity any more
The ideology that runs rampant in society that it is a "competition", as you've said, is the problem.
I've already discussed at great length the problems with the cosmetic industry and don't wish to repeat myself, you already seem to get the point anyway.. I just take it a step further and claim that excessive demand for women to wear makeup 24/7 in public has obliterated any regard for natural 'perfection' or true femininity.
Exactly. It's not the porn industry who initiated this perception, they are simply using what was already there. Clearly some aspects of pornography make the ideal much worse, with women having fake breasts and whatever... but I don't really know any guys who actually find that attractive honestly. I certainly don't.
Clearly there are different agendas found in society trying to advance what their view of "sexy" or "beauty" is, but the aspect of physical attractiveness labelled "femininity" is typically a very apparent one.. and usually just describes traits that make women, women... curves, hips, breasts, lips, long hair etc etc... These are pretty basic points, and rather silly to argue given that science can tell you that these are predictors of a healthy woman who can give birth to healthy babies etc..
Look at any old master painting of a nude woman for a start - I can guarantee the likes of him on here would be saying 'Eww! she's not even remotely attractive!' re most of them
What is classed as a feminine look has got narrower and narrower - it's a fact
It's what causes a lot of the unhappiness and misery people experience these days - not being able to achieve the levels of perfection 'demanded' by others
I hate it
It's also done by people who need to take a good look in the mirror themselves, which I find bizarre! Everyone has this 'demand for perfection' thing going on and I've always found it ludicrous. It doesn't seem to depend on how the judger looks themselves At ALL.
You are confusing the terms "Feminine" with "Beauty" or "Attractiveness". The latter are becoming classified in ways that are more narrow, yes... but femininity remains the same.
For example, here is a woman who I find to be Feminine, but I am not attracted to her.
As if I'm not ever judged for my appearance in my life... what a stupid thing to say.
It seems to be ok for you to rip her appearance to shreds but not ok to do the same to you - why is that?
Are you somehow better than her?
If I have a jaded opinion it's because of a lifetime of obnoxious idiots questioning my gender and attractiveness to each other in the same vein as you yourself have done towards that woman
it's not often I get right of reply towards people with such unpleasant attitudes
I'm realistic about the way I look but you appear to be more than a little delusional
Your whole character is a 'red flag' before anyone even moves onto how you look!
I can't offer my opinion on anything to do with women around here without being ripped to shreds... it's really f*****g annoying.
I do not find her attractive, she looks manly to me in her features.
Does that make me better than her? No. What kind of stupid question is that? Where do you get off calling me ugly, then telling me I'm an as*hole who thinks he's better than people for offering his opinion on how they look? f**k off lady.
So basically I'm getting all your grief and BS because I made a comment.. go talk to a shrink or something, I don't need your BS.
A little more than delusional? Please, I see women checking me out all the f*****g time and I've had my fair share of sex partners, and I have flat out turned down more than a handful (not based on physical appearance).
First of all, someone would see me before they got to know my character, so that's a pretty dumb thing to say.
And my character is just fine, thanks.. I have strong opinions about a lot of things, and there are also a lot of people out there in the world who agree with me. I'm also well aware that there are people who do not, and they are typically those more prone to initiate name calling and insults when they don't get their way.
I haven't said anything here that was a "red flag" on my character, you're just blowing this way out of proportion because I have become the scapegoat for all the men you've wanted to yell at in your lifetime. It's not like I would walk up to this woman and tell her she looks like a man (TO ME). The difference is that you're telling me (online, but the point stands) to my face. In fact, I would be respectful to her just as any other woman. Especially since I would be aware that yes, other men would find her attractive... I can't be attracted to every god damn woman on the planet, but I still treat them as human beings.
A woman could be 800 pounds with gravy all over her mouth and there is a guy out there who would find her attractive.. so get off my case about this s**t, its ridiculous.
Like really, get over yourself if you think you have the right to say these things to me just because I offered my opinion about the way a woman looks..
Last edited by uwmonkdm on 18 Mar 2013, 10:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
It's a cycle: Women with certain traits are already seen as feminine and those are more accepted to the porn industry, then with time, little by little, these traits were being emphasized/enhanced/exaggerated to attract more male viewers, which is in return altering the view of younger viewers.
And voila!!
Exactly!
and people seem oblivious to the effect all these media stereotypes are having on them
And with the use of cosmetic surgery increasing people aren't even competing with natural 'perfection' or femininity any more
The ideology that runs rampant in society that it is a "competition", as you've said, is the problem.
I've already discussed at great length the problems with the cosmetic industry and don't wish to repeat myself, you already seem to get the point anyway.. I just take it a step further and claim that excessive demand for women to wear makeup 24/7 in public has obliterated any regard for natural 'perfection' or true femininity.
Exactly. It's not the porn industry who initiated this perception, they are simply using what was already there. Clearly some aspects of pornography make the ideal much worse, with women having fake breasts and whatever... but I don't really know any guys who actually find that attractive honestly. I certainly don't.
Clearly there are different agendas found in society trying to advance what their view of "sexy" or "beauty" is, but the aspect of physical attractiveness labelled "femininity" is typically a very apparent one.. and usually just describes traits that make women, women... curves, hips, breasts, lips, long hair etc etc... These are pretty basic points, and rather silly to argue given that science can tell you that these are predictors of a healthy woman who can give birth to healthy babies etc..
Look at any old master painting of a nude woman for a start - I can guarantee the likes of him on here would be saying 'Eww! she's not even remotely attractive!' re most of them
What is classed as a feminine look has got narrower and narrower - it's a fact
It's what causes a lot of the unhappiness and misery people experience these days - not being able to achieve the levels of perfection 'demanded' by others
I hate it
It's also done by people who need to take a good look in the mirror themselves, which I find bizarre! Everyone has this 'demand for perfection' thing going on and I've always found it ludicrous. It doesn't seem to depend on how the judger looks themselves At ALL.
You are confusing the terms "Feminine" with "Beauty" or "Attractiveness". The latter are becoming classified in ways that are more narrow, yes... but femininity remains the same.
For example, here is a woman who I find to be Feminine, but I am not attracted to her.
As if I'm not ever judged for my appearance in my life... what a stupid thing to say.
It seems to be ok for you to rip her appearance to shreds but not ok to do the same to you - why is that?
Are you somehow better than her?
If I have a jaded opinion it's because of a lifetime of obnoxious idiots questioning my gender and attractiveness to each other in the same vein as you yourself have done towards that woman
it's not often I get right of reply towards people with such unpleasant attitudes
I'm realistic about the way I look but you appear to be more than a little delusional
Your whole character is a 'red flag' before anyone even moves onto how you look!
I can't offer my opinion on anything to do with women around here without being ripped to shreds... it's really f***ing annoying.
I do not find her attractive, she looks manly to me in her features.
Does that make me better than her? No. What kind of stupid question is that? Where do you get off calling me ugly, then telling me I'm an as*hole who thinks he's better than people for offering his opinion on how they look? f**k off lady.
So basically I'm getting all your grief and BS because I made a comment.. go talk to a shrink or something, I don't need your BS.
A little more than delusional? Please, I see women checking me out all the f***ing time and I've had my fair share of sex partners, and I have flat out turned down more than a handful (not based on physical appearance).
First of all, someone would see me before they got to know my character, so that's a pretty dumb thing to say.
And my character is just fine, thanks.. I have strong opinions about a lot of things, and there are also a lot of people out there in the world who agree with me. I'm also well aware that there are people who do not, and they are typically those more prone to initiate name calling and insults when they don't get their way.
I haven't said anything here that was a "red flag" on my character, you're just blowing this way out of proportion because I have become the scapegoat for all the men you've wanted to yell at in your lifetime. It's not like I would walk up to this woman and tell her she looks like a man (TO ME). In fact, I would be respectful to her just as any other woman. I can't be attracted to every god damn woman on the planet, but I still treat them as human beings.
Like really, get over yourself if you think you have the right to say these things to me just because I offered my opinion about the way a woman looks..
How very interesting!
You get very angry about having your looks criticised yet you feel fine with giving out your judgements on how others look quite freely
there's a direct equivalence there but you don't like it
You felt her looks were up for debate so in my opinion yours were too
Only it seems it's not a two-way process is it?
You want the freedom to judge but not be judged
Well you get over yourself!
If you deal it out you should be prepared to take it back!
I was giving my free opinion on your looks to show how unpleasant it is to be on the receiving end of such harsh judgement and having to read others doing it all the time on here
You didn't like it - no one does!
It can be unsettling to some women watching men nitpick over women's appearances because that's what we tend to get pressured about more than anything - appearance. So, it's easy to start feeling insecure and defensive about it.
I guess the flipside equivalent would be watching women nitpick a bunch of men about their confidence and career success, since that seems to be what they're pressured about more. It would probably make some guys unsettled to watch.
I know that many women nitpick other women's appearance all the time too. These women will find things to nitpick about other women that I doubt the average guy would even think of... and it's damn annoying!
You get very angry about having your looks criticised yet you feel fine with giving out your judgements on how others look quite freely
there's a direct equivalence there but you don't like it
You felt her looks were up for debate so in my opinion yours were too
Only it seems it's not a two-way process is it?
You want the freedom to judge but not be judged
Well you get over yourself!
If you deal it out you should be prepared to take it back!
I was giving my free opinion on your looks to show how unpleasant it is to be on the receiving end of such harsh judgement and having to read others doing it all the time on here
You didn't like it - no one does!
No s**t no one likes it.. the question of her attractiveness was brought up, and I offered my opinion. Do you think that woman is going to be reading every thread on WrongPlanet to see if she's mentioned?
That's not a direct equivalence, I have the decency not to put someone down to their face, or even behind their back really. I only offered my opinion because it was part of the discussion.
I'm not really that angry about your comment about my looks, I know you're full of s**t anyway.. I'm quite confident with the way I look
I'm more annoyed about the fact that I can't say anything on this board about women, even when it's the topic in discussion, even if other people agree with me.. without getting torn a new ass hole.
If someone with your aggressive and destructive tone doesn't find me attractive, I believe that means I'm better off
Here's some clearer pictures of me, feel free to judge my appearance all you'd like.
I'm aware I'm a scronny pale white boy, with a big nose and big ears. I have a high hairline that makes me look like I'm balding, and I walk funny. Feel free to add anything else.
Last edited by uwmonkdm on 18 Mar 2013, 10:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
I guess the flipside equivalent would be watching women nitpick a bunch of men about their confidence and career success, since that seems to be what they're pressured about more. It would probably make some guys unsettled to watch.
I know that many women nitpick other women's appearance all the time too. These women will find things to nitpick about other women that I doubt the average guy would even think of... and it's damn annoying!
I agree, women do the nitpicking thing too
I don't do it about appearance usually as I know how bad it makes a person feel, having had it done innumerable times to
myself by others
Sometimes though I think people need to get a taste of it right back and guess what - they don't like it one bit! Funny that...
So perhaps they need to keep their nasty opinions to themselves a bit more
You get very angry about having your looks criticised yet you feel fine with giving out your judgements on how others look quite freely
there's a direct equivalence there but you don't like it
You felt her looks were up for debate so in my opinion yours were too
Only it seems it's not a two-way process is it?
You want the freedom to judge but not be judged
Well you get over yourself!
If you deal it out you should be prepared to take it back!
I was giving my free opinion on your looks to show how unpleasant it is to be on the receiving end of such harsh judgement and having to read others doing it all the time on here
You didn't like it - no one does!
No sh** no one likes it.. the question of her attractiveness was brought up, and I offered my opinion. Do you think that woman is going to be reading every thread on WrongPlanet to see if she's mentioned?
That's not a direct equivalence, I have the decency not to put someone down to their face, or even behind their back really. I only offered my opinion because it was part of the discussion.
I'm not really that angry about your comment about my looks, I know you're full of sh** anyway.. I'm quite confident with the way I look
I'm more annoyed about the fact that I can't say anything on this board about women, even when it's the topic in discussion, even if other people agree with me.. without getting torn a new ass hole.
If someone with your aggressive and destructive tone doesn't find me attractive, I believe that means I'm better off
The question of her attractiveness was brought up - by you!
So having done that, why can't I do the same to you?
Again, why are you some kind of protected species that no one can have an opinion about?
The point I am making (without getting through) is that you can say what you like about women but don't be too surprised if someone decides to say what they like about you in return!
You are saying it's ok to have an opinion on a person's attractiveness so why can't the same be done on yours?
This is like you punching someone in the face but saying they can't hit you back
Why?
It's cowardly imo and proves what I've always thought about the type of people who so freely dispense such nasty, judgemental opinions - it's not 'allowed' to be done back to them
You get very angry about having your looks criticised yet you feel fine with giving out your judgements on how others look quite freely
there's a direct equivalence there but you don't like it
You felt her looks were up for debate so in my opinion yours were too
Only it seems it's not a two-way process is it?
You want the freedom to judge but not be judged
Well you get over yourself!
If you deal it out you should be prepared to take it back!
I was giving my free opinion on your looks to show how unpleasant it is to be on the receiving end of such harsh judgement and having to read others doing it all the time on here
You didn't like it - no one does!
No sh** no one likes it.. the question of her attractiveness was brought up, and I offered my opinion. Do you think that woman is going to be reading every thread on WrongPlanet to see if she's mentioned?
That's not a direct equivalence, I have the decency not to put someone down to their face, or even behind their back really. I only offered my opinion because it was part of the discussion.
I'm not really that angry about your comment about my looks, I know you're full of sh** anyway.. I'm quite confident with the way I look
I'm more annoyed about the fact that I can't say anything on this board about women, even when it's the topic in discussion, even if other people agree with me.. without getting torn a new ass hole.
If someone with your aggressive and destructive tone doesn't find me attractive, I believe that means I'm better off
And saying that woman looked like a man and that you'd been sick in your mouth wasn't destructive and aggressive?
It was pure misogyny
You get very angry about having your looks criticised yet you feel fine with giving out your judgements on how others look quite freely
there's a direct equivalence there but you don't like it
You felt her looks were up for debate so in my opinion yours were too
Only it seems it's not a two-way process is it?
You want the freedom to judge but not be judged
Well you get over yourself!
If you deal it out you should be prepared to take it back!
I was giving my free opinion on your looks to show how unpleasant it is to be on the receiving end of such harsh judgement and having to read others doing it all the time on here
You didn't like it - no one does!
No sh** no one likes it.. the question of her attractiveness was brought up, and I offered my opinion. Do you think that woman is going to be reading every thread on WrongPlanet to see if she's mentioned?
That's not a direct equivalence, I have the decency not to put someone down to their face, or even behind their back really. I only offered my opinion because it was part of the discussion.
I'm not really that angry about your comment about my looks, I know you're full of sh** anyway.. I'm quite confident with the way I look
I'm more annoyed about the fact that I can't say anything on this board about women, even when it's the topic in discussion, even if other people agree with me.. without getting torn a new ass hole.
If someone with your aggressive and destructive tone doesn't find me attractive, I believe that means I'm better off
Here's some clearer pictures of me, feel free to judge my appearance all you'd like.
I'm aware I'm a scronny pale white boy, with a big nose and big ears. I have a high hairline that makes me look like I'm balding, and I walk funny. Feel free to add anything else.
You still don't get it do you?
You get very angry about having your looks criticised yet you feel fine with giving out your judgements on how others look quite freely
there's a direct equivalence there but you don't like it
You felt her looks were up for debate so in my opinion yours were too
Only it seems it's not a two-way process is it?
You want the freedom to judge but not be judged
Well you get over yourself!
If you deal it out you should be prepared to take it back!
I was giving my free opinion on your looks to show how unpleasant it is to be on the receiving end of such harsh judgement and having to read others doing it all the time on here
You didn't like it - no one does!
No sh** no one likes it.. the question of her attractiveness was brought up, and I offered my opinion. Do you think that woman is going to be reading every thread on WrongPlanet to see if she's mentioned?
That's not a direct equivalence, I have the decency not to put someone down to their face, or even behind their back really. I only offered my opinion because it was part of the discussion.
I'm not really that angry about your comment about my looks, I know you're full of sh** anyway.. I'm quite confident with the way I look
I'm more annoyed about the fact that I can't say anything on this board about women, even when it's the topic in discussion, even if other people agree with me.. without getting torn a new ass hole.
If someone with your aggressive and destructive tone doesn't find me attractive, I believe that means I'm better off
Here's some clearer pictures of me, feel free to judge my appearance all you'd like.
I'm aware I'm a scronny pale white boy, with a big nose and big ears. I have a high hairline that makes me look like I'm balding, and I walk funny. Feel free to add anything else.
I think you look great. You aren't ugly by all means. I can show you ugly, but I may gag. In my opinion I find PSY to be very very unattractive. Cute dog btw, what breed?
_________________
Anna
If you're not happy with yourself, you'll never be happy with somebody else. (Don Omar)
You get very angry about having your looks criticised yet you feel fine with giving out your judgements on how others look quite freely
there's a direct equivalence there but you don't like it
You felt her looks were up for debate so in my opinion yours were too
Only it seems it's not a two-way process is it?
You want the freedom to judge but not be judged
Well you get over yourself!
If you deal it out you should be prepared to take it back!
I was giving my free opinion on your looks to show how unpleasant it is to be on the receiving end of such harsh judgement and having to read others doing it all the time on here
You didn't like it - no one does!
No sh** no one likes it.. the question of her attractiveness was brought up, and I offered my opinion. Do you think that woman is going to be reading every thread on WrongPlanet to see if she's mentioned?
That's not a direct equivalence, I have the decency not to put someone down to their face, or even behind their back really. I only offered my opinion because it was part of the discussion.
I'm not really that angry about your comment about my looks, I know you're full of sh** anyway.. I'm quite confident with the way I look
I'm more annoyed about the fact that I can't say anything on this board about women, even when it's the topic in discussion, even if other people agree with me.. without getting torn a new ass hole.
If someone with your aggressive and destructive tone doesn't find me attractive, I believe that means I'm better off
The question of her attractiveness was brought up - by you!
So having done that, why can't I do the same to you?
Again, why are you some kind of protected species that no one can have an opinion about?
The point I am making (without getting through) is that you can say what you like about women but don't be too surprised if someone decides to say what they like about you in return!
You are saying it's ok to have an opinion on a person's attractiveness so why can't the same be done on yours?
This is like you punching someone in the face but saying they can't hit you back
Why?
It's cowardly imo and proves what I've always thought about the type of people who so freely dispense such nasty, judgemental opinions - it's not 'allowed' to be done back to them
You're an idiot.
Feel free to judge me all you like, I even posted some better picture above.
Your opinion won't change anything.
It was pure misogyny
The "sick in my mouth" comment was actually about how creepy Pitbull looks.. the whole picture just turned me off completely.
Last edited by uwmonkdm on 18 Mar 2013, 11:00 am, edited 1 time in total.