The Nice Guy Dileema

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Maybe I am wrong. Maybe women really do like ars*holes. I think its the confidence or fake confidence, I don't know.

I think they like bad boys.

Do you personally like them?

I guess I'm out of luck then... I just don't like going out at all, other than to my church or the occasional movie. No, I'm not some fundamentalist bible-thumper. I just want to stick to places that I know will accept me or where socialization isn't a factor.

As for sex, it's not even on the top of my priorities list of what I want from a partner. I need the companionship and respite from the loneliness more than anything else. Yes, I know I just basically said before that I tend to avoid people, but in this case I need someone that I can trust with my life.

Am I just too *boring* to get a girlfriend? I'd love to be able to just give up, but in case you haven't noticed there's a part of me that is excessively stubborn and just doesn't ever stop...

have you ever considered that the women were "lying" to allow you to retain your or her dignity and feelings? the majority of women DO NOT WANT to hurt a guys feelings. yes, they will reject them with a white lie. its easier for both parties, usually. a woman would rather tell you she is going out of town for the weekend than make herself uncomfortable or possibly embarrass or hurt you by telling you the absolute truth.

and i think that absolute truth right there can be part of the problem. autistics like truth, bold hard truth without niceties. women are taught to protect others' feelings. how an autistic man and a non-autistic woman would see that rejection is completely opposite.

as for the "friend bin", all 3 serious relationships ive had as an adult started with the guy as a friend. in fact, none of them ever actually asked me out on a date until we were already pretty much seeing each other, and then it was more of a mutual agreement to meet.

dont reject friendship status if offered, it opens the door. in fact, i would think that for someone who has difficulty with reading social cues, starting as friends with a solid base and the ability to talk to and be comfortable with each other would be much much easier than asking out someone you dont know and trying to figure out if they are interested.

The woman is going to hurt the guy's feelings whether she likes it or not. That is what happens when someone rejects you. It is embarrassing and emotionally stressful to ask the girl out in the first place. There is no way around causing him pain. What she could do is say, "Sorry, I don't feel the same way." 1) it is probably honest, 2) it doesn't go into further specifics which could cause further pain for the guy, 3) it doesn't sound like a lie.

You aren't out of luck but you have given yourself a demographics problem. If the only place you go is to church, that is necessarily the only place where you will meet women. However, you have said before that this church is mostly married couples and their kids. That's how you wound up with your first girlfreind. She was one of their kids. If what you have to offer a woman for a fun thing to do on a date is "church-based activity", then what's what you will need to go with. The woman who will be attracted to you is the woman who is religious (yet not a fundamentalist) who sees going to church activities as a fun thing to do on a date. I am here assuming that your church has activities- suppers, game nights etc. that would constitute a date to a religious woman. But where will you meet her if all the women in your congregation are married? Clearly she will have to be from another congregation and then you can go to each other's church activities as a date. But you will have to find a point of intersect between your congregation and other congregations so you can meet her- whoever she is. You said you sing in the church choir and that this is sometimes a rather large thing. You said that once you performed in front of 3,000 people. One of these church choir events is your most likely place to meet somebody- it also lets you showcase the attractive quality of a good singing voice.




You can't meet somebody and avoid people simultaneously unless you are doing online meetings. You have to either bite the bullet and mingle with people after a church concert or at a church activity or you will have to go online. There have just got to be online dating services for religious people.



You are just too boring for a woman who finds church boring (that would be a lot of women, including me). However, you are just right for a woman who finds church and church activities interesting. Such a woman is best met through a religious dating service or church activities that are geared to young singles or are inter-congregational.

Some of you just don't get it. The whole purpose of the "Mystery Method, etc." is to give a man the social skills needed to meet and interact with women socially. It doesn't matter if you are just looking to get laid or find a long term girlfriend or wife. You still need to have the social skills to make that first impression. It takes a lot of work but once you get the hang of it it is not that difficult. You have to step outside of your Aspie comfort zone and do the work. Women won't come looking for you because they don't have to.

Mystery is a poser. In the book "The Game" he wanted to kill himself over a woman, had a classic case of bi-polar disorder, and was owned by the other men he lived with.

Key word "was". He did what he had to do to stop being a loser.

I agree with your points though, Metal Man, and unfortunately I don't think many autistic men have it in them to turn into the kind of guy that women want. I have no problem admitting that I don't.

I could fake the funk for a while - based on a woman being physically attracted to me and what I've learned - but sooner or later the facade would become obvious.

As much as I want to change, my exterior is that of a "nice guy" even though I'm anything but.

Don't get me wrong, I'd like to be able to break out of this church-centric thing I've found myself in, it's just that my church is a lot less hostile to me than the rest of the world. Singing in front of thousands of people becomes possible because it's thousands of religious (or at the very least spiritual) people. (Also because I was one out of about a hundred or so on the stage). It's not so much of a religious requirement to me either... I don't need a religious (or even spiritual) woman in my life, as long as she's capable of respecting the fact that I have my own beliefs. But the hostility factor is a real problem for me. I can expect any mainstream church to at least be accepting of my presence, but the rest of the world has no such need imposed on it.

Amen, Metal Man. You get it, and you're right, a lot of people don't get it. They hear or see "Mystery Method" and they already are skeptical about it because it does involve some slight manipulation. But you know, most importantly it teaches you the social skills to interact with women.

The Mystery Method is merely a means to achieve a desirable end. There are those who will use it to get laid, and there are those, like myself, who plan on using it to meet girls, make new friends, and possibly start a romantic relationship. The intent depends entirely on the person.

The Mystery Method is just a tool, a game plan to be able to socialize with women. It is merely an option that is available to you to achieve a goal. You don't HAVE to use it, but it is at your disposal if you desire and want to use it. It is no different than reading a book on how to interact with women. In my opinion, if you have a good heart and the right intentions when trying to look for someone romantically, SOMETIMES the means don't matter as much as the intent and desired result. I believe in the idea of virtue ethics.

For instance, if a guy uses the Mystery Method to meet women, manipulate them into liking them, and sleeps with them because they can, I consider that immoral, cruel, and unacceptable. I would judge the guy as a manipulative jerk based on his intent, and his intent was to use such knowledge to fool around and play with women, and use them for his own pleasure.

But say another guy uses the Mystery Method to meet women he is attracted to, to try and make new friends with his newly acquired skills, and to possibly start a committed, honorable romantic relationship with a gal, I don't mind that at all. The means might have been slightly deceptive, BUT the intention was good on the part of the guy, so it would be justifiable in my opinion.

The intention is what I believe in most. I do not ALWAYS believe that the ends always justify the means, but in this case, if the intention is good, it is justifiable.

You'd be surprised what you're capable of doing if you feel the desire to do it. I'll tell you personally, I've dealt with so much crap trying to find a girl to be romantically involved with. I asked out girls left and right, I did online dating, did online match-making services, and was involved in things that I'm not proud to admit. My desire to be in a relationship was so strong for a while, and since I've read a good portion of the Mystery Method, it gives me the confidence to try something new. It teaches you how to react with attractive women, what their nonverbal body language says, their Indicators of Interest, their protection shields, their attempts to blow off guys etc.

I see only ONE major flaw with the Mystery Method, and that it assumes that you are only going after the MOST physically attractive women, who are used to getting hit on by guys all the time. It does not take in account women who aren't pursued actively by guys all the time. I believe women like this don't have huge protective shields, and they are more accessible through conversation and getting to know them better than using the devices of the Mystery Method. But then again, one general system got attracting women can't be applicable to ALL women.

But I honestly believe, given enough reason and motivation, a guy can decide to employ the Mystery Method via much practice and preparation. I also believe that if an autistic guy has a taste of success, his self confidence in the system will be infinite, and he'll have much more confidence employing it.

It doesn't matter. Manipulation is manipulation. The ends don't justify the means...

i actually really agree with this. i could act like a simpering pushover (for example) to get a certain kind of guy to notice me, then let my real self come out once i have his attention. this would be a very crappy thing to do - he would think he is getting Girl B, and really, he is getting Girl A.... and eventually, he would notice who i am really am - outspoken, strongminded, stubborn. and i would end up alone all over again and back to square one.

i don't agree with manipulation for ethical reasons anyways. and i agree that these kinds of strategies are manipulative in nature. self-improvement is one thing, and acting like someone else to impress the opposite sex is another thing altogether, in my opinion.