My problems with girls..

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yes.

It is mostly an american stereotype, thats origins can be somewhat linked to the hellsangels a biker gang that still to this day scares the crap out of people.

hyperlexian,

as*hole behavior and confidences can be connected

not saying all confident people are as*holes

not saying all as*holes are confident people

What I'm saying is that assholish behavior can put up a mask of fake confidence and masculinity
both of these traits will stand out.
While nice and personable traits are not going to stand out as much, which we both agreed on.
And unless a girl has developed the skills to distingush fake confidence from real confidences
theres a chance she going to find the as*hole more appealing, whom she will just see as a confident guy.
all the quotes you used of mine support this

however I never said as*holes are more successful dating, as*holes only attract women who are fooled by them. The women who found me appealing during my experiement were just like that, fooled.

Personally I don't think fooling a girl to date you is in anywhere near successful.

no, i didn't agree that nice and personable people do not stand out as much. i said that they are not marketable traits, which is completely different. i think you misunderstood what i was saying from the get-go. "nice" and "personable" are not personality traits - they are social expectations that have nothing to do with dating (though nice guys are actually considered better looking, as per the information i quoted). being an as*hole ALSO isn't a marketable personality trait.

as far as any evidence points, men who behave like as*holes do NOT have superior confidence, nor is it easier for them to behave confidently. look around the forum. you will see a few males and females who talk about the assholish things that they do in real life. these members may or may not also have a problem with appearing confident to the opposite sex. these things are not connected.

i think we will have to agree to disagree.

In bold is were I was compairing the confidence and masculinity and how it will stand out more than nice and personable. Saying that something is expected in society means its not going to stand out as much as other traits.
Assholish behavior does stand out but in a bad way, however for some women who are fooled by the fake confidence and masculinity, the behavior is not be apparent and doesn't become apparent untill something really noticable happens ie. cheating, physical abuse, etc.. If you want to disagree with me that fine. If you have always had the skill to tell the difference from fake confidence and real confidence then its understandable that you would disagree with me.

you're moving the goalposts which makes it difficult to discuss this. fake confidence, like regular confidence, isn't any different for people who are assholish as opposed to anyone else. anyone can have real or fake confidence. i really don't think most people are that easy to categorise anyways. some who is an as*hole to you might be an angel to his girlfriend.

Why doesn't anyone ever mention sociopath(ASPD) in threads like this? Being a "womanizer" is a proven ASPD trait. And people say aspergers is the opposite of ASPD which would explain a lot.

I defined what I think an as*hole is in another post allready



But I guess you could be right and it I could just be my perception,
and that women can find cheating, verbal abuse, and self-centerness to be angel like behavior

granted most women I have talked to would agree with me and say those are the traits of an as*hole

Where did this myth about girls liking as*holes come from? That is a fallacy

that's your personal definition of an as*hole, not a universal one. when you acted like an as*hole did you cheat and verbally abuse women?

Verbal abuse to an extent, mostly demeaning words, and objectification. All to assert a kind of domininces over others. I also acted with a mind set of self-centerness careing very little about the effects of my actions torwards others. The point was to mimic what other women had told me what they considered to be an as*hole(I had 20 women fill out a survey). With a focus on word play and conversation manipulation.

I actualy ended my experiement after one particual girl tried to have sexual intercourse, I stopped her as she started to remove her cloths and reveled to her the experiement and that I was just try to see if there was any truth to the "nice vs. jerk". She actually handled it pretty well, though afterwards there were abunch of rumors going around the school that I was gay and it was while before people talked to me again when people found out I was just doing an experiement the whole time. Experiement lasted about 2 months

ok, so now you are back to saying you acted like an as*hole, when for a while there you were saying that jerks aren't noticeably assholish but they just come across as confident. it isn't confident to verbally abuse people.

it's interesting. you've come full circle. you are adjusting your argument to suit your new point, but you adjusted so far that you are back to the start again.

Maybe these men you are thinking of actually are nice. But there is still a difference between "nice" and nice. It's also possible that you might mistake a "nice" guy for a nice guy though because in the context of your relationship with him, he is nice. But he is not trying to pursue a romantic relationship with you and probably perceives you differently than he would a woman he is actively pursing.

You could be right, or you could be wrong. What you purpose is a misstake in perception because I'm not in a women's shoes, but same could be said for someone who is and they could view any nice guy as "nice" simply because he uttered the words "I think im a nice guy, why do women seem to always go for jerks?"

And hyperlexian no I'm not back tracking, everything I've been posting since my original post has been trying to show that not all women percieve confidence the same way and it is possible for some women to percieve some of the actions of an as*hole as signs of confidences and that these sign could actual mask the other not-so-pleasant traits. Your nit-picking in each of your post you asked "what I did in my experiement" I say "verbal abuse and self-centerness, and that the fake confidence hide some of my assholish behavior" you say "its not confident to verbal abuse people" well duh, which as*hole trait do you think was being masked by the confidences....the verbal abuse.

Chronos does make a good point, but just like niceness can be a perception, assholish behavior can be a perception, confidences can be too. There are some women who view things like self-centerness as a sign of confidences and turn a blind eye to verbal abuse and many other traits that most people consider the make up what an as*hole is.

The point is "are there women who do fall for jerks?" yes, but if you and your friends don't consider you a jerk then why bother with them, there are plenty of women who like other qualities about a guy. So focus on them and stop worrying about the few women who happen to fall for the jerks out there.

you can't mask verbal abuse with confidence.

The main problem I have with girls is I tend to act like them too much that it puts me in the friend zone some times but at least we can have girl talk.