Some questions for Incels after the Toronto van attack

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Actually, a fair amount of women fantasize about serial killers and such. It's called hybristophillia, and is again way more common among women than men.

Many women, have equally sick and disgusting desires as many males.

That's not going to help the men not be incels, which is ultimately where their grievance lies. For as long as they are incels, they are going to feel disenfranchised, and the ones on these forums will probably continue to spread toxicity. As someone who is an incel who does not harbour negative views of women, I can tell you that I've had male friends, and I've been to therapy, and none of that has made me feel better about my status as an incel. And nothing will except CHANGING IT. Failing that, there will always be a part of me that will dwell on my issues attracting women.


Once again, if their problem is their status as an incel, how do they go about fixing it themselves? If they can't then nothing else is going to work and they will continue feeling however they feel right now. If they knew what to do to 'fix' themselves, don't you think they'd have done it by now?

That is still a tiny percentage of all women, and a small percentage of women with ravishment fantasies. As I said, for most it is about their partners finding them so desirable it drives them wild.

If what you say is true, then where are all the female serial rapists and murderers? If we equally fantasize about such things, then why does it lead to violence so much more frequently in men than in women?

For as long as their minds are so messed up that they think that sex will solve their problems, they will be this way. That is how therapy and friendships can help them, by changing their mindsets.

And if you really think sex would fix them, I suggest you research what happens to men who belonged to the incel community who actually did eventually find sex and relationships with women: they were ousted by the community instead of being allowed to remain to help others by giving advice on how they improved their situations. There is a forum on reddit called "r/inceltears" that is mostly about mocking incel forums, but there are also former incels who post there who talk about their experience of being kicked out when they improved their lives and tried to pass on what they learned and how they made their lives better. It's like a cult environment, and they ex-communicate anyone who questions the hateful negative self-fulfilling dogma of utter social rejection.

I'm not even going to bother responding to the other post responding to this comment of mine that was straw man after straw man. I can't make a dent in such cynical black and white thinking and misrepresentation of what I said, and I'm not even going to bother trying.

How can I get your PGP Private key?

ie. The crushing commercial success of 50 Shades of Grey. A movie/book which I know no man who liked it.

So, what's the answer?

Apparently, therapy won't help them, other men can't help them, and they can't help themselves. Do we then force women to have relationships with these idiots so they don't go out spree kills?

Inquisitor, we may not be thinking about the same group of men. I'd like to clarify it so I'm sure I'm answering your question the right way.

If you're talking about men who aren't able to find healthy relationships, and so they're not having any sex and it bothers them - whether they're bothered because they lack companionship or just because dang it, they're horny and it's frustrating - yes, I have sympathy. Loneliness can be devastating, and even if it's just a backlog of sexual frustration that can cause a lot of angst as well.

If you're talking about the self-identified incels who plot to rape or mass murder women, who think spraying acid in a woman's face to ruin her looks so she'll have to have sex with incels (their line of reasoning, not mine), and who hate and blame women for their lack of access to sex...no. Zero sympathy. No woman exists to be an on-demand sex-based painkiller dispensary for a man who feels entitled to the use of someone else's body.

I have read incel boards. There are a few posters here who want to believe there are no men like this. There are men like this, and they frighten me.

So: lonely guys who want healthy relationships? Heck yes, by all means, and I wish every one of them the best of luck with it. Angry men spurring one another to acts of violence and murder because they don't get on-demand sex from women and they think they're entitled to it? No sympathy - I wouldn't expect any woman to get anywhere near those people.

Did that make sense?

That's exactly what the incel groups want.

Editing to add a link. I won't link to actual incel message boards, this is an article from someone who's been tracking them for years. We Hunted the Mammoth

Last edited by MissChess on 01 May 2018, 3:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

So now it seems everyone is expert on incel online forums.

I know, which is why I addressed the forum with the question.

Several posters have indicated that neither therapy, nor male friendships, nor self-improvement will help these men. So, what's the answer?

Doesn't require much else besides reading what they write.

Are there "hidden depths" that we are unaware of?

Sorry, I missed that you knew - taking a rhetorical question, or one designed to spark conversation on a topic, as a literal query is a particular failing of mine. It always seems obvious in hindsight, but I never see that curve coming.

I wish I knew the answer. Both therapy and self-improvement require individual effort and buy-in from the person involved, and I don't see that as terribly likely.

I do think it's harmful for men who are lonely and frustrated to start reading these boards. We're social creatures, and we crave contact and affirmation from our fellow humans - but just as with food, there's stuff that's good and healthy, and stuff that's toxic and unhealthy, and these incel boards are poison.

Getting the boards shut down is harder than you might think. It took a long time just to get one site, reddit, to shut down the main subreddit they were using, and they almost immediately popped up again under a different subreddit I won't name. (I know people can do their own research and find this junk, all too easily, but I'm not going to send traffic their way.)

It's toxic and dangerous.

The incel communities are pretty tightly interwoven with a lot of other flavors of MRA and PUA groups, along with alt-right and white supremacy cells. They provide support, company, and praise for miserable lonely guys and all it costs is your humanity.

I sometimes get compared to Elliot Rodger when I express my struggles in getting a girlfriend and it's a terrible comparison. My feelings are more like "Have I fallen too far behind? How much longer until I finally meet the girl of my dreams? Is she here somewhere? Will I have to become like the jerks to be successful?" while he was more angry that women weren't bowing down to him and also having complexes about being half-Asian. He and I are worlds apart.

I was referring to males teasing other males about their lack of sex life, not to incels egging each other on. Big difference.

No man teases another man about not getting laid with the intent of spurring him to commit murder.

Unhinged incels on a forum of their own? They encourage that behaviour, apparently. And they openly encourage it. They're not doing a little light hearted teasing and having unintended consequences.