Do women simply just dislike Aspie men?
I’m a clerk. I deal with judges and attorneys all day.
They might be “better” than me in their educational accomplishments....but I am not less of a person than they are. And they know I think that way.
You must not let another person know that you feel you are less than that person......because it isn’t true.
The_Face_of_Boo
Veteran
Joined: 16 Jun 2010
Age: 42
Gender: Non-binary
Posts: 33,083
Location: Beirut, Lebanon.
I never even had a Long distance relationship in my life! Well, maybe only once when I was teen.
Kraftie, can you explain what he means? I can't understand him.
You used to regularly offer advice in these types of threads, often with quite a bit of snark for anyone who saw things differently.
And you're not, right? Look who's talking.
My mind just doesn't store unimportant stuff; like discussions in an online forum.
OK - most women are very calculating first. But how do woman see themself towards men? And whats really up with that social hierarchy BS that women are as much into? Without empathy for this it's rather hard to guess.
_________________
I am as I am. Life has to be an adventure!
Last edited by quite an extreme on 25 Apr 2020, 5:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
If I’d never let my flat mate in first year halls at uni drag me down to the student union on the first day there:
• I'd never have been press-ganged into the local metal scene by a bloke who liked my jacket and boots,
• Never been accepted as “he’s quiet and dreamy but he’s one of us” by the lads & lasses there,
• I’d never have met the first girl I took out on a date,
• Never have been invited upstairs by girl who asked me to walk her home after dark,
• Never met my first serious girlfriend...
and never had the knowledge that I could do this thing when I met the woman who’s now my wife.
That doesn’t happen in the culture I live in. If a man can’t get a girlfriend, he’s a “loser” in the eyes of other men and he’ll get belittled for it. Instead of getting taken along to social events, you will be told “Quit whining and do it!” and left to your own devices.
Same here.
Men will take the piss out of each other on any and every ground they can think of: and regard it as a slight against them if you don’t respond in kind.
To quote the prophet (the guy who press-ganged me as per above):
“Look mate, if you can’t think of a witty comeback just tell them to F off: at least it’s a response”
I did as I was told.
Of course occasionally I could think of a comeback.
It’s the lack of response in kind that confirms the notion that you’re a loser, not the thing they take the piss out of you for initially.
The fact it was a metal scene probably helped tbh: several of the folks already there had an ASD diagnosis, trauma from childhood abuse, bipolar disorder etc: a little clan of freaks and misfits of all types.
I also had to get there and enter on my own: which was terrifying every time.
I still did it: assumed it was the same for everyone else at the time.
There’s almost no middle ground regarding metal where I live. Depending on the perception, it’s “Satanic”, “neckbeard music”, or “bad ass” though they have to be bands like Five Finger Death Punch, Godsmack, Disturbed, Slipknot, and Avenged Sevenfold to be considered “bad ass” because anything that isn’t mainstream to these people isn’t “cool”.
Yeah, I’ve heard that American metal is “different” (that is, much more prone to ostentatious nastiness and macho nonsense than the rest of the world... )
European Metal tends to be much more melodic, romantic even at times.
Maybe that punk scene in Austin would be a better bet for trial & error socialising with whoever’s around and happy do to so with you: just don’t go getting tattoos and piercings to fit in!
(I’ve always found American Punk in all its varied forms preferable to your country’s Metal: I mean, what right-minded person would listen to Slayer when they can listen to Sonic Youth? Beats me ).
I call that sort of music “Fort Hood Metal” because those bands actually play at Fort Hood (I live about 40 or so minutes from there) and a lot of soldiers listen to those bands since they have that “We’ll kick your ass!” attitude to them.
I actually prefer Swans to Sonic Youth. I was hoping to finally see Bad Religion this month until COVID ruined everything. I can make conversations with people at those shows but they don’t form friendships. I sometimes wonder if it’s because I don’t drink or smoke.
Self-fulfilling prophecy.
I just don’t want to be considered a “creep” just because I struggle socially. It’s like being told I am something bad and need to be shut away.
Last edited by Marknis on 25 Apr 2020, 5:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
funeralxempire
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Swans are great. Teenage Jesus and the Jerks might be up your alley too.
I wonder if it's because you don't drink or smoke, or if it's because you only see them at shows?
_________________
I was ashamed of myself when I realised life was a costume party and I attended with my real face
"Many of us like to ask ourselves, What would I do if I was alive during slavery? Or the Jim Crow South? Or apartheid? What would I do if my country was committing genocide?' The answer is, you're doing it. Right now." —Former U.S. Airman (Air Force) Aaron Bushnell
The_Face_of_Boo
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Age: 42
Gender: Non-binary
Posts: 33,083
Location: Beirut, Lebanon.
I can relate to Marknis in this actually:
Well, at least in my community, stereo-typically speaking, religious and devout people are by far less likely to drink alcohol (like drinking too much) and smoke week, even the Christians. Yet, normally you still disagree with a lot of their ideas because you're atheist.
While the strong-headed Leftist atheists, are far more likely to be into : strong alcohol, drugs, tattoos , shrooms and stuff like that; and you still can't fit wit them.
Most NT people often fall in either camp, it's rare to find people who are in-between
Swans are great. Teenage Jesus and the Jerks might be up your alley too.
I wonder if it's because you don't drink or smoke, or if it's because you only see them at shows?
I’ve actually met Michael Gira and got a signed CD from him.
Both things seem to be a requirement for socialization beyond just passing conversation. Outside of shows, the only time I encounter these people would be at the record stores in Austin but I don’t really approach people in these situations anymore. I go for CDs instead of vinyl, though, so I wonder if maybe that makes me an odd man out in that avenue.
Well, at least in my community, stereo-typically speaking, religious and devout people are by far less likely to drink alcohol (like drinking too much) and smoke week, even the Christians. Yet, normally you still disagree with a lot of their ideas because you're atheist.
While the strong-headed Leftist atheists, are far more likely to be into : strong alcohol, drugs, tattoos , shrooms and stuff like that; and you still can't fit wit them.
Most NT people often fall in either camp, it's rare to find people who are in-between
I live in a largely Baptist area and many of them get biblically themed tattoos as well as blast Ted Nugent’s music.
Last edited by Marknis on 25 Apr 2020, 5:55 pm, edited 4 times in total.
Swans are great. Teenage Jesus and the Jerks might be up your alley too.
I wonder if it's because you don't drink or smoke, or if it's because you only see them at shows?
Yeah, finding a bar which has a weekly dj night of the music you like is a better place than a big gig: you see the same (often small subset) of folk each week after a while.
OK - most women are very calculating first. But how do woman see themself towards men? And whats really up with that social hierarchy BS that women are as much into? Without empathy for this it's rather hard to guess.
To be more clear - beside of eye contact and behaviour is this what people who lack deep empathy do struggle most with. And they may not get why love doesn't counts for women except a girl crushes at a look in your eyes...
_________________
I am as I am. Life has to be an adventure!
If I’d never let my flat mate in first year halls at uni drag me down to the student union on the first day there:
• I'd never have been press-ganged into the local metal scene by a bloke who liked my jacket and boots,
• Never been accepted as “he’s quiet and dreamy but he’s one of us” by the lads & lasses there,
• I’d never have met the first girl I took out on a date,
• Never have been invited upstairs by girl who asked me to walk her home after dark,
• Never met my first serious girlfriend...
and never had the knowledge that I could do this thing when I met the woman who’s now my wife.
Dude,
Not every aspie, nor NT, is "designed" for a significant-other relationship.
You are aiding and abetting the establishment, with its misleading social propaganda campaign, man.
Be an individual,
Know yourself,
Know the social circumstance you have been "dropped" into,
Reevaluate your personal situation,
Toss out the indoctrinated social garbage not relevant to you,
And, if necessary,
Use the opposable thumb that the gods gave you.
Power to the single guys, or gals, dudes and dudesses.
This has been a community announcement by:
"Timewarp" and "The Sexual Relief Centre".
If I’d never let my flat mate in first year halls at uni drag me down to the student union on the first day there:
• I'd never have been press-ganged into the local metal scene by a bloke who liked my jacket and boots,
• Never been accepted as “he’s quiet and dreamy but he’s one of us” by the lads & lasses there,
• I’d never have met the first girl I took out on a date,
• Never have been invited upstairs by girl who asked me to walk her home after dark,
• Never met my first serious girlfriend...
and never had the knowledge that I could do this thing when I met the woman who’s now my wife.
Of course, a man would still have to be the kind of man around whom other men feel comfortable, so the usual advice for going out in public would still apply (i.e., good hygiene, nice clothing, upbeat attitude, et cetera).
Cue the "Yeah-Buts", the "What-Ifs", and all the other excuses some men seem to live by ...
<satire mode activated>
Yeah but,
You are "Assuming The Position",
To be violated by the establishment, man.
You are assuming the social propaganda expectations.
What if you have a different perspective on the life situation?
What if your personal circumstances make it impossible to conform to social expectations?
Dude.
<satire mode deactivated>
I wish I had the time, money, and credentials to do some real research on this. Unfortunately, it would take all of those to wade through each and every "I Can't Get A Date" post and thread on WP to prove even the slightest correlation.
But it makes intuitive sense.
So gents, if you have trouble getting acquainted with the ladies despite your best efforts, then maybe you should first try being friends with men -- that's friends, nothing more. You don't have to become a redneck, a punk-rocker, or a bad-assed alpha male -- just make a few male friends and hang out with them. Once women see that other men like you and get along well with you, they may be more likely to accept you as something other than a creepy loner with a bad attitude.
Anyway ... just sayin' ...
Maybe that's true now,but only because I haven't even tried to bother socializing in a couples of years and been focusing on just my hobbies.I had some male friends throughout most of my life,so lets not act I been a loner throughout my entire life. I had atleast 2 male friends back during my Middle School,High School and College years and even after as well until I was in 26/27 years old. Also had atleast one male friend until a almost a couple years ago when we had a fallout with one another.The problem is not women seem necessarily see me as loner creep.It always seem girls/women were way more interested in my friends than they were towards me.Most of my former friends had atleast 1 girlfriend throughout their life and others have gotten atleast attention from women. One of my former friends even mocked me because while he was getting date and get to fu*k several of females,I can't even get females to have long conversations with me. While it's likely true that males that have no friends tend to be seen as losers/loners by females,it doesn't explain why I NEVER got girls/women to like me at any point in my life.
First mistake.
Don't generalise.
Not all women are the same.
Not all men are the same.
Not wanting to trigger anyone,
But,
Let me just say that life is predominantly a "Mating Game".
Virtually everything is oriented around this evolutionary fact.
It is a harsh game,
With winners and losers.
That's the fact, Jack.
But not everyone wants or has a need to engage in "The Game".
Not everyone wants to embrace the absurdity.
The reproductive/sexual *instinct* is strong,
But it *doesn't* make it *right*.
Simple clinical/objective evaluation of life's circumstances will show a rational/logical person, that.
The trouble is,
Wisdom is achieved through personal life experience.
Young people simply don't have the experience, usually, that will allow them to transcend the social propaganda/indoctrination/mind-rape, and instinctual drives.
"Such is life", man.
There are lot of hints and many are right. But many of this is just to try to match they way that calculating women judge men for. Guess it's better to cause a girl has a big crush on you at first sight. Otherwise you'll mostly attract the ones who aren't really better then hookers but much more likely to hurt you. Better to become aware of empathy and feelings. Am I wrong?
Hey girls - how do you think about this?
_________________
I am as I am. Life has to be an adventure!
If I’d never let my flat mate in first year halls at uni drag me down to the student union on the first day there:
• I'd never have been press-ganged into the local metal scene by a bloke who liked my jacket and boots,
• Never been accepted as “he’s quiet and dreamy but he’s one of us” by the lads & lasses there,
• I’d never have met the first girl I took out on a date,
• Never have been invited upstairs by girl who asked me to walk her home after dark,
• Never met my first serious girlfriend...
and never had the knowledge that I could do this thing when I met the woman who’s now my wife.
That doesn’t happen in the culture I live in. If a man can’t get a girlfriend, he’s a “loser” in the eyes of other men and he’ll get belittled for it. Instead of getting taken along to social events, you will be told “Quit whining and do it!” and left to your own devices.
Same here.
Men will take the piss out of each other on any and every ground they can think of: and regard it as a slight against them if you don’t respond in kind.
To quote the prophet (the guy who press-ganged me as per above):
“Look mate, if you can’t think of a witty comeback just tell them to F off: at least it’s a response”
I did as I was told.
Of course occasionally I could think of a comeback.
It’s the lack of response in kind that confirms the notion that you’re a loser, not the thing they take the piss out of you for initially.
The fact it was a metal scene probably helped tbh: several of the folks already there had an ASD diagnosis, trauma from childhood abuse, bipolar disorder etc: a little clan of freaks and misfits of all types.
I also had to get there and enter on my own: which was terrifying every time.
I still did it: assumed it was the same for everyone else at the time.
<satire mode on>
Man, oh, man,
You were the puppet of "Da Man".
You bought into the whole social hierarchy gig, dude.
Psychedelic machismo-ism
<satire mode off>
You seem to be less autistic than most of us.
funeralxempire
Veteran
Joined: 27 Oct 2014
Age: 40
Gender: Non-binary
Posts: 29,475
Location: Right over your left shoulder
Swans are great. Teenage Jesus and the Jerks might be up your alley too.
I wonder if it's because you don't drink or smoke, or if it's because you only see them at shows?
I’ve actually met Michael Gira and got a signed CD from him.
Both things seem to be a requirement for socialization beyond just passing conversation. Outside of shows, the only time I encounter these people would be at the record stores in Austin but I don’t really approach people in these situations anymore. I go for CDs instead of vinyl, though, so I wonder if maybe that makes me an odd man out in that avenue.
What I'm suggesting is that by not cultivating any sort of relationship with any of them beyond bumping into them at shows or similar, you're staying an acquaintance with similar tastes, or at least that it will be easier for them to keep you in that box instead of the next one closer. I'd imagine many of them have other people they see regularly, but aren't actually close to. The ones who are more outgoing and social will tend to have bigger circles and sometimes be the bridge between those less social people, but if you're not being dragged around by the hand by one of those people it's easy to witness others forming social bonds without participating, so you gotta force yourself to participate. That's one of the reasons people drink socially, to make it more likely they act contrary to their nature and reach out to someone else. You don't gotta drink, but you do need to act at least a little bit like the people who are, at least sometimes.
I just had two conversations with two strangers I've encountered before. I don't know if either will become friends, but the more often you're seen having friendly interactions with others, the more confident potentially interested strangers are likely to feel that you're approachable and able to have friendly conversation. On the other hand, if you're the guy who every interaction becomes a debate with, that'll hurt you except for potentially attracting other folks who love to argue just because they can.
The guy with a slammed Golf on old Corvette wheels isn't likely to introduce me to a potential partner, but no matter how unlikely it is now, it's more likely than it was when I was just some stranger who had commented on his car once. Building rapport with people just for the sake of building rapport is sometimes a useful skill that has the potential to be of benefit because the more people who know you and know you're decent, the more people who might be willing to help you if the opportunity arises. To quote someone neither of us respects, 'What have you got to lose?'
_________________
I was ashamed of myself when I realised life was a costume party and I attended with my real face
"Many of us like to ask ourselves, What would I do if I was alive during slavery? Or the Jim Crow South? Or apartheid? What would I do if my country was committing genocide?' The answer is, you're doing it. Right now." —Former U.S. Airman (Air Force) Aaron Bushnell
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