would you like to have amazing success with women?

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At least you have women at your college... the people at my college are mostly men... there's a 4:1 male to female ratio across the entire university...

Am I the only one who thinks that based on the title, this thread on this forum seems like the incestuous love child of Simon Baron-Cohen and Sacha Baron Cohen?

I wanna date the ZWINKY popup girl. The one with short brown hair wearing the black tank-top. She is HOTTTT!! !! !! !!

Exactly the same applies to females though. There is no shortage of female drug addicts, and unemployable females with mental health problems. This relates directly to the ever going 'debate' here where the males complain they can't get a date at all, whereas it's easy for the females. And the females complain that they can't get a *suitable* date. Picture the male and female ladders, the male ladder with 15-20% extra names on it at the bottom. When those males look across at the equivalent female, they see nothing. Nobody there. When the females at the bottom of their ladder look across they see lower order males, junkies, mental health problems. Given a free choice, nobody would choose a partner with such problems. However, we don't have a free choice.

What's odd is that in my wanderings around the city, I frequently see men who clearly look like unhealthy, drug addicted criminals. Yet they are always with a female partner. Every case of violence and rape I ever read about, there is always a 'girlfriend' or 'wife' who generally 'stands by' the man.



I used to think that. My dabblings on PlentyOffFish suggest otherwise, though. Sure they are a 'different', but in general no less fickle! I was shocked how many women in their 40's are still entitlement princess's looking for "knights in shining armour" and "prince charmings", still their first question is "what car do you drive?". They are looking for something different, but they don't lower their standards in any way. And there is still 10 men for every woman....


Come on!! I really don't believe that just having a full set of limbs is enough to impress *any* female! This whole forum wouldn't exist if that was the case. Neither would 90% of the world as we know it. The very few woman who are that desparate would be totally insane. "A full set of limbs" may be enough for a female to be attractive to most men, however it is wrong to assume females have the same low standards that we males have.


One of the often repeated most useless pieces of advice! Many of us are "going out" most of the time, but we aren't finding it. Why isn't 'it' finding us, anyway, if it is really out there? If there really are numerous available, single women all looking for a man with an OK income, stable lifestyle, no drug problems, no criminal record, good with children and animals, can cook, clean and generally fend for himself, then I wouldn't be bothered writing this I have realised that for one, there are hardly any available women and for two, there is always a single man with a better income, bigger house and sportier car not too far away.

Some details on exactly "where" to be going out to would help.


How come so many of them get it wrong, then? I'm sure we all know men who can repeatedly pull this trick off succesfully. It may be difficult for oft-rejected men to understand (and women generally keep it a closely guarded secret) , but maybe women just want sex to, sometimes



I agree! But not so much because you've lost your integrity. There is also a problem introduced in that as soon as you start to follow a 'game plan', you have put a huge amount of extra pressure on yourself. You have set yourself up for failure because you have this artificial construct that you have decided to live up to. "I forgot rule 7, oh how could I be so useless, of course I failed, I haven't worked hard enough on all 450 pages of The Guide...".

However, if I was writing a guide, i would make rule 1: "Abandon all ideas of honour, integrity, honesty and loyalty. It is a harsh, competitive game and you're gonna have to be prepared to lie, cheat, steal and deceive to succeed". "Honor" and "Integrity" are in that group of things that most women "say they are interested in, but aren't actually that bothered about". I know that you are a notable exception to that, though, Lotusblossom!


Yes, but those people are MEN and this confirms what we all know, that most men have no standards whatever. if there are any female goat fanciers, I fear my horns are neither long nor curly enough anyway.



I don't see 'complaining', just a lot more shared experiences. It's perfectly valid for someone to say "I tried that, it didn't work for me". Questioning is healthier than dumb acceptance. Is disagreement not allowed? Being an intelligent guy, presumably Alex posted here knowing full well his posts would get discussed, not lapped up indiscriminately. The only thing he specifically asked was that those with "no experience" didn't argue.


Me too. This is going way off tangent....My second rule : "A males attractiveness is inversely proportional to the amount of feminist idealogy he has absorbed".

Many dating guide authers don't realise how much of this fine-for-females-but-totally-inappropriate-for-males rubbish some men have to get rid of before they can even begin to think about getting involved with a female. Speaking from personal experience, this was the single main change I made that changed me from someone who really was never ever going to be in a relationship to someone who at least had some success.

I still fortunately have all of my limbs, but I have some nerve damage in my lower back that I received from a minor injury when I was in the Army. My nerve damage has kind of screwed up the way I walk and I sort of stagger along with my left leg kicked out to the side. It is quite noticeable and girls ask why I walk the way I do, and I think they corrolate that with the other aspects of my AS. Even though my gait was somewhat odd before my injury, now I walk with a very noticeable stagger. I think that girls assume that it has something to do with being mentally slow, even though I am very much mentally in the game.

My minor disability aside, I feel like when I look across the table, I don't see a ready female partner corrolated with me. I touched earlier on what you said about a large percentage of single females being unavailable for the same reasons many single men are unavailable(mental disability, obesity,) so the bottom 25% of men still are left without a match. Perhaps my problem is that girls out there will exhaust every effort to find a higher-quality guy and they won't settle for me until any chance of finding their "prince" has been exhausted. Yet, that same old advice of, "Just go out there and do it," is useless. A forum like this wouldn't even exist if it was that easy. For god sakes, normal guys have to go buy the dummies guide to dating, so it is 10X harder for AS guys.

It is wishful thinking to hope that women in their 30's and 40's start to lower their standards. From my personal experience, the vast majority of older women continue to wait for their "Knight in Shining Armor," and still keep getting burned by the Alpha males. They can be just as fickle as college girls only they have a greater guise of maturity. Dating is not going to get any easier as you age, especially if you remain inexperienced at sex and older women inquire as to why you aren't very good at pleasing them. Once you start to carry that virginal monkey on your back into your late 20's, girls sense that you have been unable to date and thus there must be something wrong with you, making them less likely to take a chance on you. Like I said earlier, girls run at the slightest hints of weirdness, and that whiff begins to turn into a stench. They might still keep you on their ladder for "friend" purposes, but I don't think anyone on here wants that.

Still, I will never understand why attractive women stay with losers, guys who beat them, alcoholics and the like. No explanation has ever made sense to me. I know it goes back to the ladder theory and how girls like novelty and bad boys, but just to think about it baffles me. It pains me to think that I am being beaten by Joe "NASCAR Six-Pack Wonderbread Wife-beater cheese-Whiz" the drywaller.

Finally, I have to just suck it up and embrace as much of the feminist and multiculturalist ideaology that I detest just so girls will think I am sensitive and dateable. Girls of the MILLENIAL generation HATE guys who are conservative, insensitive, or who voted for McCain. You will never date until you mirror the liberal values of today's millenial girls. Young girls these days love our plastic culture, diversity, and women's lib. Obviously, politics shoudn't be brought up on the first few dates, but you have to come across as very pro-feminist and pro-Barry the Clown(ugh)

Brusilov and ManErg,

Like I said -- I was coming from your POV before, barely any friends, no good female prospects, and everyone I knew or wanted was already taken or not interested. I had no hope of crawling out of the hole. But here I am, 10 years later -- still barely have any friends (my choice, for the most part, since I already have what I want and am unwilling to sacrifice my time), but have had an affair and multiple near-misses (which would have happened if I wasn't married), and cheated on my then GF as well in college. I still get hit on at work constantly. So something clearly changed, and I think the main factor was time and my role in life, as well as my attitude and confidence once I got a girl.

Regarding women in their 30s and 40s lowering their standards or changing their priorities -- it's completely true. ManErg, I'm not sure how old you are, but Brusilov, I do see that you are about 10 years younger than me.

In my 10 years in the workforce (and years in school on top of that), I've gotten to observe and know a wide variety of women across age groups. Everyone from women older than me hitting their early mid-life crisis in their 30s, desperate to get married and have kids, to very young women (who didn't go to college) who, in their teens, liked the cute bad boy type, but by the time they hit their mid 20s, their priorities change. A cute bad boy is no good if he can't hold down a job or keep from cheating. Ghetto denizens put up with that behavior because their pool is limited to that and their morals are perverted from bad childrearing --- it's not the norm. And women who put up with domestic abuse actually reinforce my theory, often because they are so dependent on support from that same man. And ManErg, you actually proved my point when you pointed out you saw a lot of women with hideous-looking men -- clearly some other factor is at work, no?

Hell, I even had the former homecoming queen from my highschool, who I ran into at work 10 years later as a coworker, all over me and trying to woo me. Back in high school, she probably wouldn't have even looked twice at me -- after all, I wasn't popular, barely had any friends, and didn't have great conversational skills. 10 years later I have a job, am more confident, and seem stable. It took a long time for her to get the message I wasn't interested.

Regarding the princesses in their 40s on the singles forums -- well, that's going to be a pretty self-selecting and biased group, isn't it? What kind of women do you think are going to still be single in their 40s? Dysfunctional, spoiled, or mentally unstable women who couldn't get or keep a guy. I've run into plenty of those, and in pretty much all cases, there was a glaring character issue that even an Aspie guy could smell a mile away. If it looks like a skunk, smells like a skunk, it is a skunk. Don't go looking in trash bins for diamonds. You're just going to find more trash.

Regarding what to do to meet people -- Well, they're not going to come to you, at least in this society, so you need to give them a chance to meet you. Join clubs, organizations, do things outside of work and solitary hobbies that give you a better chance to meet and get to know people. It's just simple networking. If you are isolated, you don't give the chemistry time to work, the same natural chemistry that works on a shorter time scale for other animals. It's mere exposure effect (look it up on wiki) -- you see something enough times, it grows on you.

Case in point -- in high school, there was this really popular girl I had a huge crush on. I had one class with her, but didn't sit near her, and I was a nobody, so I don't think she ever noticed me then. The next year I had 2 classes with her and sat near her, but still barely ever talked to her. But I sat near her, and we couldn't help but have some overlap in the people we dealt with. Apparently at some point she got a small crush on me, as she got friendlier and friendlier, and at one point, gave me a shoulder massage in the middle of class (after the lecture, during free time)! Needless to say, that was a sign. But I never acted on it -- she was way out of my league, it could have never worked, and I had another girl who also crushed on me who scared her away and got me for herself (very aggressively). So either way, it worked out.

The other thing is that as an older guy with a good career and assets, you are more than competition in terms of getting younger women. Lots of younger women like older guys -- don't feel bad about raiding the younger age groups (legal adults only though, of course). If you play your cards right, you should be very attractive and mature, especially compared to a guy who is in his early 20s. So this is why the ladder comparison is false -- you're not accounting for the female ladder being loaded into from the bottom, and your rising status in the male ladder. You're assuming that your position is fixed, which is not fair to yourself or true.

Btw, ManErg, it's "mentally ret*d," not "mentally delayed" (I saw you "corrected" my quote above -- if that wasn't you, I apologize). Delayed would imply they could still have forward progress, which in most cases is completely false. Mental Retardation is a proper term describing stunted mental development: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mental_retardation

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i think we need to stop over analyzing stuff and just share our factual experiences.

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im lazy otherwise i'd be i the club picking up women all the time, i think our problem most people with aspergers is motavation. most of us have had tramatic bullying when we were little discouraging us. but i havent really tried, and usually get tied up in whatever im intrested in at the moment.

what ever happend with that one artist girl you were seeing? you shouldnt have let that one go

About 10 years older than you. Not inexperienced, and that experience has been hard gotten & took extreme effort.


No doubts on that! The debate is exactly what that factor is To clarify, these men are not technically 'hideous looking', but of an appearance that makes it obvious they are not upstanding, respectable members of the workforce


I wasn't going to go that far. It's very common for reasonably normal women in their 40's to get separated too! Just like the men, the most attractive get snapped up quickly though.


I'll keep that in mind, thanks! I shall hang outside the local university gates with my investment portfolio proudly on display


No, it wasn't me.


Thinking about the implications of Alex's second post, he has a good point here. It led me to thinking that no person should be ashamed of having sexual desires. I believe the "mysterious factor" mentioned above is that if you are so ashamed, you hide them away, then you cease to be viewed as a man at all and aren't even on the scale. So all that stuff about having a "good job, nice house, OK looking, not overweight, non-aggresive etc etc" means nothing when most women are looking for a MAN with those attributes. You can have those attributes, but if you have been shamed into behaving like a gender-neutral eunach, then you are not considered as a 'possible' for 1 second because you have fallen at the first hurdle. You are not a man. Even the lowest of the low junkie who is not afraid to hide his sexuality ranks higher. At least he his a man and in the target group, although ranked low.

This explains the 'nice man' syndrome. By 'nice', too many of us mean "I am not overtly sexual with women" and/or "I make it clear to everyone that I do not see women as sex objects at all". This may be 'nice', but it is not 'man'. It is quite ill.

Knowing that this is probably the biggest single cause of "males who appear to have the right credentials yet are perennially unattractive to females" syndrome is one thing. Changing it is a lifetimes work. The key is the balance between being overly sexual and non-sexual at all. Because it is so difficult to get right, it is easier to tend to be totally non-sexual. You'll never get slapped, never shock or appall, but then you'll never be viewed as a sexual i.e. 'real' man either.

I think on the inside I feel like I'm "doing the right thing", showing how much "nicer" I am than all those other men with their low down desires they can barely control, showing how much "I respect you as a person first and a female only second" because I'm interested "in your mind, not your body". On the outside, however, it comes across as an unreal, pathetic, gender-neutral weirdo with half of the normal male mind missing. (and the speculation is on what parts of the normal male physique may be missing to cause such problems). (Whoever heard of a lonely female reading intellectual books to attract a man? They go to the gym, they buy new clothes, they get new hairstyles. Think through what this means about what is important to a woman. And by being interested 'in her mind' and feigning disinterest in her body, you have, to her, dismissed all her hard work, what is important to her. And it was all a lie because unless you have faulty hormones, you were really much more interested in her body all along)

So even before you have a chance to, as Alex said "be sexual with a female", you actually have to show in some way that you are actually capable sexually. How are they to know you have an interest when you can't even admit it to yourself? This is the other extreme to b9's friend and no better a place to be.

The cure? I don't know But it could begin with making an effort to get over this shame about being a male and the way we are made. One thing I've seen repeatedly is that male chauvinists get far more female attention than male feminists. The will get slapped more, they will get more hostility, they will get overtly disliked by some females, but they always have a woman or two. An emasculated male is safe, steady, never slapped and can have many good friends, but at they end of the day his perceived sexlessness will make him of interest only to asexuals.

these threads are depressing as hell. The whole L+D forum could go in the trash, it's just one bad thread after another.

i agree

Joke with them that your stagger is because of an "old war wound" and you'll seem more heroic than pitiful to women.

If you want to meet women with your same conservative views, perhaps you should seek them where they gather: Young Republicans meetings, Rush Limbaugh book signings, Concerned Women for America rallies, "teabagging" protests, and the like.