Nice Guys and Love, what's your take on the issue

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not me, not at all

being nice and a 'nice guy' isn't the same thing.

Most of the problems of being a self-identified "nice guy" is it allows you to transfer responsibility in the dating game to the other party rather than yourself.

I like to think I a nice person and I am not successful in the dating game but the fault lies with me not with everyone else. I don't play the same game as they do so how can I expect the same results. Every guy has to get out there and meet people and talk to people to let those people know what a great person they are and hopefully find someone else who will love them back. Sitting in your home festering about how nobody appreciates you and nobody asks you out will not work it will just create a sense of bitterness mixed with entitlement that doesn't do you any good at all. Indeed it will mask whatever positive characteristics you have.

I will *never* succeed in the conventional way of dating. I can't go into a pub and chat to people. If there isn't a social script to follow then I am lost. But I can self improve and do things to try and make myself as interesting as person as possible as well as trying to become self-aware of the most egregiously odd behaviours I have and work moderate them. As time passes I find that this is working (slowly!) and I am beginning to find friends who like me as a person and hopefully in time I will cross paths with someone who wants me as I am.

And then, being a good person will be to my advantage. Because, if they want to settle down then I can be the gentle, kind partner they want.

So, my take is for the "nice guys" is that being nice will, hopefully, be an advantage in a relationship but until then work on improving yourself, being an interesting person and putting yourself in situations where there are other people and hopefully you will cross paths with potential partners who will appreciate who you are.

I would never trade anything in the world to be with a NON nice guy again....

Nice guys RULE, ALL THE WAY!! !! !! !

All those jerks out there can go suck it!

After reviewing what the phrase, 'nice guy', truly means, I am most certainly not a nice guy.

Those articles should be put in the first post, or made a sticky! This thread is a headache.

Everything is all about perception, pure and simple. If a girl's interested in a guy and she says to herself, "He seems self-confident. He's successful. He's this and that.." Well, her perceptions going' to be that the guy's confident. In other words, if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's probably a duck.

I know that this discussion is kind of old, but as a woman I think we DO want nice guys.. It just takes many many MANY dates with huge jerks for people to understand what they really want! And if a girl doesn't like you for who you are -- she's not worth your time anyway!!

I don't post very often, it's kind of pointless and difficult to find where you left off amongst 5000 posts . But I just HAD to respond to this and the other posts by this poster of similar sentiment. I knew I recognized the stories, the tips, the point of view. You know why, because I've read this whole thing verbatim in at least one book, can't remember if it was online or not. But all this is basic information that follow the "alpha male" and other similar philosophies.

The funny part is I seem to remember this exactly coming word for word form somewhere else. At least if you're going to give some advice, be original with it lol. Don't copy from another source and make it your own Anyway, good advice to those who have no confidence (or clue) at all and need a pathway to getting better with women.

This can also create false hope for those that can't truly fill that role and are coming off insincere or fake. And you did happen to leave out some key components to demonstrating higher value to girls. Other things that make just as much difference in how females see you and what makes you truly interesting to them. Although I would suggest you pay more attention to understanding their needs and less to your own "theories".

But as another poster stated, there are no systems and every girl is beautifully different. Every female has their own complexities, small nuances, and amazing uniqueness that many guys won't see because they are so consumed with their obsesseion with the physical. But these things are truly meaningful to her. And they are extremely appealing to me as well. Open your heart/mind/soul and start appreciating females for the things that truly define them. Meaning if all you can do is objectify them, you are going to be very unhappy and left alone to fantasize about what you will never have.

You convey truly getting her on a deeper level by understanding these things that truly fascinate her or capture her heart. Showing her that her every facet compells you and is an amazing experience that you unlock and share. You either get things or you don't. And no "systems" are going to teach you what you can't project naturally and authentically from yourself in connecting with whoever you really like.

But there is so much more stuff that can be the difference between whether you get (and keep) the object of your affections but I'm not even going to mention them because this post is long enough and generally most guys are too egocentric and thickheaded to listen or follow anyway. They will make their mistakes and make them again. And again.

Here's the thing, you can draw up all the methods you'd like to appear to be that "type" of guy that is "genetically programmed" to be attractive to many girls. But she will always intuitively know if you are real or playing a role for her. Read as pretending. So not sure how long you will carry on your charade if you don't own it and are really not the type of guy you KNOW women to really want. Grouping them all together as the same is as senseless as thinking you are going to have any chance with just one if you don't see things from her perspective and apply it to how you treat her.

Anyone in some real need of true advice, let me know. And I will give you my own takes being I'm pretty unique and I didn't need to read a bunch of stuff to learn about females. I have a very good grasp of how they feel, what they want, need, and are attracted to. I genuinely know most things just by knowing. Of course I'm also very much into psychology, philosophy, romance, and a bunch of other things so I have read my share as well. It's a wonder I remembered anything given I go through other learning/reading issues that make it a challenge But good luck.

When I was younger (meaning, in my twenties), I knew I was different but didn't know why. I was always on the watch for being taken advantage of. I was a 'nice guy' with a chip on his shoulder, so I tried to act like a tough guy. But acting like a tough guy didn't mean I actually was a tough guy. So, things were screwy, since I wasn't being who I really am, which is a nice guy. I enjoy helping people. That is my personality and to deny it or act contrary to being a nice guy just doesn't work.

I'm now in my late fifties. I was diagnosed with AS about three years ago. Since then, I've been able to work on being who I am: a nice guy. I feel better about myself and I'm not putting on an act, trying to be what I think others want me to be.

MrBigEcks has it right: just be who you are and be confident and happy in yourself. Do nice guys finish last? Having dated many nice guys I'd have to give a loud and resounding "no way!"

Let me be blunt: Are "bad boy" types attractive? Yes, sometimes. And it's usually temporary. There is a thrill of having someone that's a bit dangerous and unpredictable. That can be a lot of fun. But in a long-term relationship, that can be exhausting. Who has time for Mr. Irresponsible when you're trying to pay your mortgage or raise your family? I sure don't.

Bottom line: I'd rather have a fun-loving, responsible nice guy for a committed relationship. Being a "bad-boy" in the bedroom is something one can always learn.

There's a lot of stuff in this thread about nice guys/not nice guys, and it's time for a rant!
I'm touching on some stuff in this thread and some personal stuff too.

'Jerks' and 'Nice guys' ARE NOT mutually exclusive with respect to their success attracting ladies, and actually there are some traits of 'Jerks' that the 'nice guys' can learn from! The main thing is confidence, specifically the ability to take action and make decisions without hesitation. The girl likes that you're comfortable being in charge of a situation. Also, a little bit of teasing is fun, as long as it's light and harmless. You can do this stuff with a kind attitude, without being an as*hole.

There are some guys here who are on a high horse about their morality, and it might prevent them from being assertive with ladies. It's almost as if this 'assertive' behavior with girls is avoided completely because it's perceived as immoral! Yeah, so jerks are assertive...but doesn't mean you shouldn't be. Again there are some lessons to be learned from the 'jerks'.

I've known some guys who go on dates and they don't make any of the decisions. They'll ask the girl "...where would you like to eat?" or "...what would you like to do now?" ...Do these guys think they're being respectful to girls by asking these questions? Because they're actually showing her that they're not comfortable making decisions for the two of them...which is not cool! I think they're afraid of making the wrong decisions about where to go, because they fear that she might not enjoy her time out. That fear needs to go, right now. She's not going to have a sh***y time if you do your homework and find a nice place!

I've also heard stories about guys who won't touch girls EVER, even after a couple of dates. They say it's out of respect for the girl, and they don't want to be a misogynist by going in and holding her hand. ...Really? If you're getting signals and you're into her, don't be hesitant. Girls get frustrated by that hesitance. You might cite your respect for women as the impetus for you not taking any actions at all with her, but it's pretty extreme if you ask me.

Don't blame the standards of society for you being unable to act. Get out there and make stuff happen and have fun.

End of rant

Yes, this is very accurate. The problem most "nice guys" have is that they think they are perfect as they are, and that's what separates them from other people that aren't resistant to change. Nice guys are cowards, and nobody likes a coward. As for not touching the girls, most of these nice guys, if you sit down and ask them, are not Christians that are waiting till marriage, so then then question becomes what it is they are waiting for. I think they are waiting for her to make the first move physically, because that way, it's her that is the skank, not him. The focus should not be on impressing her, but rather letting her be herself. They are so fixated on their impeccable morals that they forget that girls like sex too. The only way to do it is to relax, be yourself, whoever that may be, and let the chips fall where they may. If you've already decided that she is the one before getting to know her, then you are setting yourself up for failure.

Bolded. Italicized. Underlined. Why? Because it's so freaking true.

This right here is the secret. When a girl can truly relax and not feel like she has to put on any front, that's when she can also connect with you. Let her feel accepted for who she is.

Yeah, I agree with many folks here. Essentially if you are self describing yourself as a "nice guy" you are saving your self esteem and justifying failure with women. Generally "nice guys" end up resentful and sometimes dangerous to women. Being a "nice guy" is the last thing anyone should want to be or self identify with. They put women on some weird pedastal and fall in love with some image of a person that exists solely in their own minds. I think most people understand when someone percieves them as something far removed from their true reality and it freaks most people out.

The goal is mutual acceptance , a little fun, a feeling that the person you are with is worthwhile and valuable and cares for you. Most of the as*holes that good guys bad mouth are actually very good partners for women. "nice guys" are kinda fond of pointing out infidelity of some "as*holes" but the truth is that everyone who likes and feels comfortable with sex and has opportunities with infidelity will likely stray under the right circumstances. My partner and I have an open monogamous relationship. Neither of us has sex with others but we realize that our love is stronger than sex and that unless we blow it up into something huge sex is a small part of life. "nice guys" have no difficulty with fidelity because no one wants to f**k them or they are afraid of failing in the sex department.

The term "Bad Boy" has nothing to do with a "type" of guy it has to do with how a woman feels when she is with a guy she is into. All that evolutionary talk of Alphas Betas etc is really a waste of time because the repertoir of behaviours that might allow a guy to be a societal alpha is so broad as to be virtually indicernable and therefore there is no set of characteristics to clearly emulate (even if we could). Womens understanding and evaluation of men as potential mates is far more subtle and sophisticated than the seduction racket gives them credit for.

It depends what someone means by a "nice guy". If that means you arent making passes at women then that's a problem. You probably want women, so let's not pretend otherwise. That should have nothing to do with nice/bad.

Sometimes you'll hear people saying that AS people can't do these things and maybe that's true for some but I learned how. I lived it and I know how hard it was for me. I was very delayed. But I'm very grateful to the earlier version of myself who took those hits in order to try to learn. He embarrassed himself over and over and over and paid for those skills with his pride. I'm grateful to that clueless guy. He handed the me of today a baton and I don't have to worry about those things the way he did. And all of those failures are just something to laugh about. They don't embarrass me in the least.

Think about yourself in 10 years. That guy is expecting you to pass him better life skills. If you don't fight that fight today, he has to fight it.