Is it ever okay to look at a women's breasts?

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Here's an idea: Why don't you go find a rich guy, marry him and live happily ever after.

I think that what you are saying is valid and very real. I will however point out that although you are living in a culture that produces fear you should still be careful to distinguish real fears from false fears because those false fears lead to misunderstanding and animosity between the sexes.

I think that a man might glance at a woman's chest because to them women are very beautiful. Apprehending that beauty makes a person feel good and gives them a sense of connection to a person's femininity. Its not always about objectification.

thanks for this.

to me, in a sense it isn't about boobs - it's about men wanting to retain the right to sexually dehumanize women in a public way. this is the exact opposite of feminist progress. if a man were to feel that he is somehow entitled to stare at my body, why would i not fear that he could take further action?

if a person walked up to another individual and slapped/assaulted them for no reason, it could be understood if the victim defended themselves. but if a person intentionally objectifies another individual (knowing full well that it may be upsetting to said individual), then they have every reason to expect that individual to retaliate. i don't condone violence, but i imagine that it is more likely for a person to get slapped if they stare at an individual in a way that deeply offends them, upsets them, or makes them feel unsafe.

just for the record, i have never never stared at a man's body parts. it is just not acceptable. i consider myself highly sexual, but it belongs in a bedroom, not out in the street. it isn't right for an individual person to try to publicly turn another person into a sexual object - regardless of gender.

there isn't any such thing as a false fear. read the statistics:

http://www.paralumun.com/issuesrapestats.htm

Um, no thanks. I'd rather earn my own way in life.

And you haven't addressed my points. For all that you call yourself a bully hater, you behave like a bully yourself.

Not if you were the last woman on Earth babe. That's alright your prince charmings out there somewhere.

"My attitude isn't acceptable": Why?

"You clearly haven't thought": Yeah I have thought about what being a woman would be like. You'd be surprised at how much I think.

"When did you have to worry about your safety when a woman looks at you": If she's looking at my wallet and judging me by my money

"When did you have to worry about sexual assault": Not from a woman, but from gay men.


"Nevermind if we find it intimidating": Divorce court is intimidating for some of the bravest guys out there. They lose their homes, kids, wife and much of their life savings that day. That intimidating enough?


"All the time": No, it doesn't happen all the time to any one person. Period. You aren't as hot as you think.


"It's very easy to feel uneasy when one looks at your boobs": Then wear something else. Rich guys dress down and drive old cars to deter gold diggers. If you don't like it, cut your hair or wear something less revealing. Otherwise, don't be surprised if guys stare or at least look.

Last edited by bullyh8ter on 31 Jul 2010, 2:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

what? where is there an invitation in this? she said you behave like a bully, she didn't try to get into your pants.

Your attitude is wrong because you refer to women as if they have no right not to be treated as sex objects.



Then you're useless at perspective taking. For a man, it may well be a compliment to have a woman check you out. For a woman, it's different, unless she is very large and strong or trained in martial arts. That guy is bigger than you, stronger than you, and if he wants to do more than just look, he can, and they often do.



Lots of female muggers where you live then?



And you have to worry about that walking down the street, do you? You have to live your life according to what these f***s might do, watch what you wear, where you go, make sure you don't go out alone?



Non sequitur. How does divorce have anything to do with this issue? How does it give men the right to dehumanize women?

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I don't wear tops that reveal my boobs. Never. And why should I cut off my hair? Why should I structure my whole life around avoiding being sexually harassed? Not showing cleavage is one thing, cutting off my hair is way extreme.

I've gotten harassed even when wearing LOOSE clothes than make me look androgynous (and believe me, I can look androgynous when I want to. I've been mistaken for a male). It works...until they hear me talk in a normal female voice. And then they start up touching my ass, wrenching at my neck, because they can. It's why I don't go out at night any more. It's not about how you look. It's more likely about anger and the desire to dominate.

You actually thought that was an invitation? Don't make me laugh. I wouldn't let you touch me. I'd cut out your eyes.

Wrong planet. Home of the domesticated mysoginist

I think that if a woman dresses in a low cut top and her cleavage is on show, then there must be a reason for it. I don't understand why a married woman also has to dress sexy - she has a husband and is not looking for anyone, so I guess its all about showing off or an exibition of her behaviour before she took the vows, one which she can't shake off because its burnt into her brain.

because your attitude is shared by men who commit sexual crimes against women.



i don't actually care what you *think* being a woman would be like, because your statements are demonstarting that you lack the ability to empathize emotionally, physically, socially,or mentally with women.



this is assuming that any women would overlook your rampant misogyny to get to your wallet.



what you are actually saying is that even YOU are afraid of other men, which proves our point. the common denominator is that MEN are the most frequent rapists by an astronomical margin. it isn't just gay men who rape other men either - it's also straight men who want to experience the feeling of power. rape is not usually truly a sexual act, but an act of domination.



this point is moot, as women lose the same things in divorce court. in fact, on average, men enjoy a higher standard of living than women after divorce, so your anecdotal sh*t-slinging is highly inaccurate. here is one source of information regarding that, with multiple scholarly studies backing it up:
http://www.aifs.gov.au/institute/pubs/RP23.pdf



suffice it to say that women are more often objectified than men, and it happens on a regular basis. women are also 11 times more likely to be sexually asssaulted than men.



women don't have to be dressed in a sexy manner to be stared at. as well, if it 40'C outside, neither men nor women should be expected to remain completely covered up. your argument seems to imply that if a woman dresses in a sexy manner than she deserves to be objectified. if that is truly what you think, that is a sick point of view.

here are some examples of non-sexual reasons why a woman may wear a revealing top. it's all i can think of off the top of my head, but it's a start:

1. breast size I - a woman with large breasts can find that a shirt with a regular neckline, even a t-shirt, naturally stretches and shows her cleavage. a turtleneck would stretch and appear even more sexy without any intention on her part.
2. breast size II - a woman with small breasts may not fill outa shirt as much and it will gape and sag at the front, resulting in unintentional amounts of flesh showing
3. fashion choice - during the summer, most clothing selections are very low-cut at most popular clothing stores. also, formal dresses are usually lowcut - try to find an elegant evening gown that *doesn't* show cleavage
4. bras - bras naturally elevate the breasts and create cleavage. women who go braless show way less cleavage by default. but then men would stare at the bounciness under the shirt... no way to win here.

in summary, the low cut top may have nothing to do with men at all. some women may want to appear sexy (even just for her husband), but your assumption that women are intentionally wearing clothes to appear sexy may be misguided.

Then she should have changed her clothes when she was no where near her husband. This is one way for a marriage to break up, because a woman sends out flirty signals to other guys.

Yes, I would think so.