02 May 2011, 2:10 pm
Sallamandrina wrote:
I see, I'm sorry I haven't seen your location. Out of curiosity - in your perception - is it expected in the UK than men pay for everything or most and do women expect to be financially supported? I only visited UK, I couldn't grasp such details. No offence but I would be shocked to hear people still live in the '50s over there 
Different women have different views regarding women's role in the UK. On average, though, I'd say women want equality in the workplace, but they want more traditional social roles (though not as extreme as the 50s).
02 May 2011, 2:17 pm
02 May 2011, 2:20 pm
02 May 2011, 2:27 pm
Lilya wrote:
Another_Alien wrote:
Lilya wrote:
Another_Alien wrote:
Sallamandrina wrote:
Wait a second Another_Alien I might be missing something here. Are you trying to say that "marriage is collapsing" because more women want to be educated and financially independent? 
No, please read what I said. It's collapsing because, generally, they won't marry much less successful men. And most young African American men are less successful than their female peers.
Though I'm bound to add that a woman who won't marry a less successful man doesn't really want to be independent does she?
I think you're putting a little bit too much blame on a woman here. I wouldn't have a problem marrying a less succesful person, but especially foreign males seem embarrassed, if a woman makes more money than he does, and also e.g. seem less reluctant to take her family name.
Is it common for men to take a woman's name in Finland?
Yes, it is very common. However, it is also common to take the man's name or create a combination name.
What ethnicity are the Finns? From what I understand they are not part of the Germanic family found in the rest of Scandinavia and northern Europe.
02 May 2011, 2:29 pm
Suomalainen
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Joined: 22 Mar 2011
Age: 39
Gender: Male
Posts: 53
Location: Finland
02 May 2011, 2:32 pm
Lilya wrote:
Another_Alien wrote:
Lilya wrote:
Another_Alien wrote:
Sallamandrina wrote:
Wait a second Another_Alien I might be missing something here. Are you trying to say that "marriage is collapsing" because more women want to be educated and financially independent?
No, please read what I said. It's collapsing because, generally, they won't marry much less successful men. And most young African American men are less successful than their female peers.
Though I'm bound to add that a woman who won't marry a less successful man doesn't really want to be independent does she?
I think you're putting a little bit too much blame on a woman here. I wouldn't have a problem marrying a less succesful person, but especially foreign males seem embarrassed, if a woman makes more money than he does, and also e.g. seem less reluctant to take her family name.
Is it common for men to take a woman's name in Finland?
Yes, it is very common. However, it is also common to take the man's name or create a combination name.
YLE (link) claims that in 2005 only 1.4% of Finnish grooms took either their bride's last name either as only last name or combined it with their own last name as second last name.
Last edited by Suomalainen on 02 May 2011, 2:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
02 May 2011, 2:37 pm
Sinestro wrote:
Lilya wrote:
Another_Alien wrote:
Lilya wrote:
Another_Alien wrote:
Sallamandrina wrote:
Wait a second Another_Alien I might be missing something here. Are you trying to say that "marriage is collapsing" because more women want to be educated and financially independent?
No, please read what I said. It's collapsing because, generally, they won't marry much less successful men. And most young African American men are less successful than their female peers.
Though I'm bound to add that a woman who won't marry a less successful man doesn't really want to be independent does she?
I think you're putting a little bit too much blame on a woman here. I wouldn't have a problem marrying a less succesful person, but especially foreign males seem embarrassed, if a woman makes more money than he does, and also e.g. seem less reluctant to take her family name.
Is it common for men to take a woman's name in Finland?
Yes, it is very common. However, it is also common to take the man's name or create a combination name.
What ethnicity are the Finns? From what I understand they are not part of the Germanic family found in the rest of Scandinavia and northern Europe.
Officially Finns belong to the Eastern Baltic race with notable Scandinavian features. There is a surprising link to Dutch heritage as well. Compared to the rest of the Scandinavians there are higher proportion of blonde people in Finland and the Finns have higher cheekbones and more delicate features and build. E.g. the Swedes tend to have low cheekbones and very "square" like features and very prominent jawlines.
02 May 2011, 2:39 pm
Suomalainen wrote:
Lilya wrote:
Another_Alien wrote:
Lilya wrote:
Another_Alien wrote:
Sallamandrina wrote:
Wait a second Another_Alien I might be missing something here. Are you trying to say that "marriage is collapsing" because more women want to be educated and financially independent?
No, please read what I said. It's collapsing because, generally, they won't marry much less successful men. And most young African American men are less successful than their female peers.
Though I'm bound to add that a woman who won't marry a less successful man doesn't really want to be independent does she?
I think you're putting a little bit too much blame on a woman here. I wouldn't have a problem marrying a less succesful person, but especially foreign males seem embarrassed, if a woman makes more money than he does, and also e.g. seem less reluctant to take her family name.
Is it common for men to take a woman's name in Finland?
Yes, it is very common. However, it is also common to take the man's name or create a combination name.
YLE (link) claims that in 2005 only 1.4% of Finnish grooms took either their bride's last name either as only last name or as second last name.
I actually doubt that, and especially in the later years the numbers have gone up.
Anna minun nyt vähän kiusata tuota yhtä, sen sovinismi ottaa pannuun
02 May 2011, 2:40 pm
02 May 2011, 2:47 pm
Lilya wrote:
Another_Alien wrote:
Sallamandrina wrote:
Nobody's saying anything about eliminating the differences between sexes - if I understand correctly what Lilya said was that gender roles(not differences) are highly relative and that social construct will play a big part in the way they are defined.
Maybe you could explain what you see as gender roles so we can see if we can find a common ground. For instance, the way I understand what you said until now I wouldn't even have a reason to want a man. I'm highly educated and can comfortably provide for myself, I'm repulsed by the idea of leeching off someone and I don't want children. Would that mean - in your view - that having a partner would be futile?
Edit: LOL, I'm not attacking you, I'm just curious. Your views are quite unusual for me.
Maybe you could explain what you see as gender roles so we can see if we can find a common ground. For instance, the way I understand what you said until now I wouldn't even have a reason to want a man. I'm highly educated and can comfortably provide for myself, I'm repulsed by the idea of leeching off someone and I don't want children. Would that mean - in your view - that having a partner would be futile?
Edit: LOL, I'm not attacking you, I'm just curious. Your views are quite unusual for me.
I believe everyone - male or female - should be able to live as they want. I support a society without restrictions by gender.
But I also believe an enlightened society must tell the truth. If men are better than women at maths - on average - and women are better than men at reading/writing - on average - resulting in more male engineers and more female journalists - we should acknowledge that reality and not try to pretend that gender is entirely socially constructed.
And, most importantly, no-one should be forced to do something they don't want to do in the name of gender social engineering.
I don't think you actually realize how minor these differences actually are. 0,2% doesn't equal to majority.
I know male nurses and female engineers. I know plenty of men and women who want to pursue careers in sector that have traditionally been dominated by the other sex. I am not fond of the idea at all that these people should be discouraged because of the idea of "traditional" roles.
The reality you refer to is different in every culture. I live in a countyr where there has been a female president for more than a decade, two female prime ministers, in the past government 60% of the ministers where women. Yet there are cultures where politics isn't seen a suitable trade for women. For the record, Finland is a prominent wellfare country where the educational level has more than once been ranked as the best in the world. I don't see the women in power having harmed the nations well-being despite their "natural" differences.
Again, I'm not saying anyone should be discouraged. Everyone should be encouraged. I'm saying that in a free society men and women will gravitate towards different career choices on average, due to different abilities and intellectual persuasions.
Poilitics is not a profession where male/female brain differences come into play. Neither men nor women have any advantage in politics. Male and female politicians are just incompetent and dishonest as each other.
02 May 2011, 2:54 pm
02 May 2011, 2:57 pm
02 May 2011, 3:14 pm
02 May 2011, 3:21 pm
02 May 2011, 3:32 pm
02 May 2011, 3:40 pm
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