Is not having friends a turn off?

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That doesn't make sense, that the innume system and being introvert having a direct link (without the social and psychological impact of friendships on the person) sounds like nonsense. If not, misleading.

I believe it all comes down to the lifestyle and psychology as a result of friendship vs friendless rather than a direct biological link. According to other studies relating to longetivity, health and friendship, the conclusion has been about the positive aspect, the psychological benefits on the life, affecting *lifestyle* of a person who has friends.

And, what that has to do with friendless being a "turn off" exactly?

It is for some people, maybe a lot.

Why should not having friends be a turn-off? If your partner doesn't like your friends, it would be a moot point.

I wouldn't have thought so, but hey, the only friend I have is my girlfriend, so hey, tell me.

I just object to other people imposing their own preferences on others about what "normal" and "healthy" is,
which is all the more odd when it comes from Autistics, who face being stigmatized and having their experiences denied at every turn.

I find it difficult to believe that those who actively dislike (or loathe) socialization and are not desirous of friends suffer much from not having them-seems mighty counter-intuitive. It would seem, however, if the thread is an indication, that they might indeed suffer from the stigma being friendless brings upon themselves when it comes to finding a romantic relationship.

Also don't agree that being a partner's only friend is somehow de facto "unhealthy". For some people it is, but that's to do with the couple and the individuals in it.

considering that social skills training and group therapy are actually accepted treatments for autistic people, i'd say that it's not just an opinion as to what is "normal" or "healthy" for people. it's backed up by research that people with autism benefit from having friends.

even though something is counterintuitive doesn't mean it is wrong. i challenge you to find any research at all that demonstrates that having friends is detrimental to people with autism or social phobias and such. i understand people not WANTING friends, but that does not mean they wouldn't benefit from having friends (especially over the long term).

i think that maybe there is an assumption that "having friends" means a giant social circle or some kind of siamese-twin BFF. it doesn't have to mean anything of the sort. it can mean having a couple of buddies to see a movie with, or a workmate to have a beer with at the end of the day, or people from church who you can have prayer meetings with.

Social skills training and group therapy can enable one to have more effective communication with people, which is a problem with people who have a non-majoritive neurology.
That hardly translates into needing friends.

I never said having friends is detrimental- I said not everyone experiences detrimental effects from NOT having them,
as can be evidenced by many such people on this forum who actively-prefer to be without social ties.

Not...really. I've yet to read a study on any unexpected physiological or psychological benefit from doing XYZ act which has bothered to include in it people who are statistical outliers. I have to read all the time about the psychological and physiological benefits of having sex, for instance and laugh to myself because of the studies referenced, not a single one examines anyone who identifies as asexual. It strikes me as similarly fallacious to claim "having friends has benefits", period, fullstop, unqualified, when the entire research project has proceeded from the assumption that everyone wants friends, and therefore failed to substantively examine introverts, and in such a way that controls for other variables that might differentiate between them and extroverts other than friends.

Right. Many people here such as myself don't have that, don't want that. While people who seek out friendships would find the scenarios you just outlined to be a very low "requirement", to those of us who don't have friends and don't want them, we're left scratching our heads thinking "That sounds awful/boring....maybe awfully boring." It doesn't matter if someone requires a mate to be hypersocial with a million buddies, or to just have one- at the end of the day, those requirements don't include everybody, on the unfounded presumption that there is something 'wrong' with such a person, by virtue of him or her having an uncommon preference.

actively preferring to be without social ties != not NEEDING friends .... preferences involve individual choices which may or may not be in a person's best interests. i actively prefer to eat cake and cookies for breakfast lunch and supper but that's not in my best interests.

having effective communication with people is not the only goal of social skills training. one goal is to help us to make friends.

there are many studies that have been done specifically with autistic people regarding socialisation and friendship. they are the outliers you speak of. you could also look at studies that researched people with social anxiety or social phobia. they are also outliers.

when you say that the "requirements don't include everybody", you are drawing a conclusion that is wholly unsupported by any research (on NTs or people with AS or other disorders). you have yet to demonstrate even one hint of a study that shows that some people do not need friends.

What's being claimed, though, is that eating Wheaties for breakfast is good for you, period, without mentioning there is a portion of the population with severe Wheat allergies who would become severely-ill from doing so.

That's great...for people who want them. Otherwise, it's like a knitting class.


From what I've read, Autistics don't differ significantly in terms of willingness to socialize, particularly HFA's- they're just inept at AS-NT communication.

Research is needed before we can agree that some people totally lack friends?

Because the affirmative CLAIM is not mine-
the CLAIM is that all people do,
and I've yet to see a study which examines introverts, and accounts for differences between them and their extrovert peers which are not causative in nature.

The burden of proof isn't on the skeptic.

you're asserting that some people do not need friends, and frankly... that's not supported in the research. there are many, many studies with autistic people and people with social anxiety.

also, being introverted doesn't equal "not having friends".

What research is this, which specifically studied people who don't want friends?

Those aren't groups who don't want friends.

True- I realize I was equivocating.


Of these:

X characteristic applies to every single member of Y group.

Sez what?

The former is the claim, and a radical one, and the latter is no claim at all.



If there are to be claimed health benefits on the human psyche and physiology for having friends,
and consequences to not having them,
I would think it kind of important to ensure that ALL people are wired in this identical way before asserting such.

Or else use qualifiers so as not to marginalize people and deny their reality.

the studies were of autistic people and people with social phobias.

you are somehow trying to assert that people who don't WANT friends would not be included in the studies, but they would be. and any good researcher would note it accordingly if the results from that group were vastly different from the rest of the group under study.

i haven't seen any valid argument as to why some people supposedly don't need friends except that... they don't WANT them. just like i don't want vegetables, actually.

Again, those aren't people who aren't desirous of friends- they're people who face significant difficulties in acquiring them...

Not being excluded doesn't mean they were studied separately and compared to a control.

I've yet to see a study cited wherein people who weren't desirous of friends WERE studied as a group.


Probably because I'm not making an argument.
I'm asking for evidence about a claim made about all of humankind
and have yet to see it...

I haven't seen any study on why there would be psychological or health benefits in friendship (how this constitutes a "need" in a real sense is yet another question) for people who naturally or nurturally are wired to not be desirous of it. Since, ya know, that's what's being claimed....

Last edited by ValentineWiggin on 09 Apr 2012, 9:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

.... they are included in the same studies....

~sigh~

Were they studied separately, as a group, and the data compared to a control?

Yes/no?

i don't know.... i wouldn't search that because i don't think it's necessary.