The masculine role in society

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ManicDan, it's not like that. I get mad as a result of overloading. When I cannot get away from people (this is mainly at work or if I have to go out shopping) I tend to get angry and swear. Even walking down the road and someone obstructs my way, I get angry. If someone tickles me, or touches me "wrong" or talks too loud or a million other things. I have a ton of sensory issues and cannot control my reaction to them. If I could be a hermit, then it would be ideal.

When you put it that way, yes, I do feel anger. Commuting does that to a person. But it is a temporary feeling; it only lasts a few minutes at most.

As for fear, I do not know. For example, I was robbed two times; the first I chased after the thieves. The second time, I did not feel afraid, but instead of reacting, I just convinced them to take a broken cell phone I had while telling them I had no money in my wallet (which was lie; I had a little money with me).

Morgan freedman is right. I have had the same opinion for a long time, but I didn't know he shared it too. Usually people call me racist when I try to make that argument.

I also have the same opinions. In fact, during this year's International Women's Day, two teachers tried to make the guys on our class deliver small gifts to the girls. I refused and I began a discourse on how having a single day of the year to honor women is ridiculous and sexist because: 1. we should stop making distinctions based on gender, color, religion, political views and so on and; 2. by that stupid logic, if we want things to be "equal", we need an International Men's Day.

Besides, IWD is not even a holiday. It is useless.

Unfortunately, my classmates had mixed reactions. Apparently, they thought I had some good points, but they insisted on keeping the date for no specific reason. One of the teachers (who is a woman) apparently agreed with me. Which means it was not a complete waste of time, after all.

I have it too. It varies between degrees and types though.



I'm not trying to deny or get rid of anything biological... not at all.
Just would like some to realise that biology doesn't dictate everything... and when those differences occur we need to be much more flexible about them.
I do not agree with what the education systems and such have turned into.

That article you provided on boys actually described *my* experience of school perfectly.
It's one of the reasons that I almost dropped out of school at 14.
They treated me like a girl (although I am one) and it almost completely put me off education for life. (it was much the same when they forced me into girl scouts - oh the horror)



I didn't realise that - seeking clarifcation until I could understand your point - and then making an observation (one I can verify with proof) simply because I was confused - is considered combative to you.

Last edited by Kjas on 21 Nov 2012, 4:54 am, edited 1 time in total.

It seems like whenever somebody posts something that has the potential to be controversial, a lot of other people post comments trying to refute things that the original poster did not actually say, but are related to what he/she said by the subject matter. It is like they were waiting to be able to make that argument and they made it as soon as they thought they saw an opportunity, and it is of little importance to them whether the person they are arguing with actually holds that position. Or maybe they think with boxes and think that because the OP thinks X, he/she must also think Y, because position Y is similar to a position that many people with position X have. Whenever I post a controversial subject (sometimes they are much more controversial than this), I have to write several posts clarifying what I did not say.

Yes but that is called making assumptions and doing such things also means you're taking things out of context, and not taking someone's previous actions, behaviour and personality into account.
It tends to be a bad combination and a very unproductive one.

Don't animals have gender roles too? Most mammal species at least?

I think there's some truth in bluemax's words.

opposition can be combative. it sort of depends. in this case you flipped from an on-topic discussion to a personal observation about me. i am sure you can see the difference.

you are making an interesting case because on the one hand you were obviously not agreeing with me, then you complained about me not agreeing with you. if you think we are in agreement, then your point has not been made clearly enough yet. you have not yet even tried to demonstrate that we arguing the same side, so i don't really understand why i would be agreeing with you.

(but i'll not say more on that, as it's not really on topic. if you had any questions about what i actually stated in my posts, i am happy to discuss that)

I come here to discuss things I am curious about in order to arrive at the truth, that requires discussion, and to clarify where necessary, and discuss details thoroughly - not to oppose, be "combative" or on some ego trip - all of those last 3 things directly get in the way of finding the truth and therefore are of no use to me.
I did the same I would with any other, it's just interesting that you almost always take such and interpret it as combative - most don't.

I made the personal observation, because I was not just talking about this thread, but rather about 90% or more of posts you have addressed to me - this has been a repeat pattern, one that has confused me before, but I simply have not stated it until now, when I could be sure of it.

I did not complain about you not agreeing with me. I said we were attempting to make the same point.
The incorrect assumptions and projections - without taking into account context, previous things and personality were what bothered me.

Just because I agree with one particular solution with you in this case, does not necessarily mean that I agree with the motives, or the premise that lead you to that conclusion - in fact, ours are markedly different. The premise and motives one has usually heavily influence the solution they come up with, and also the means with which they choose to implement it. Undoubtably we would have different means. And yes it matters - get the right end but choose to the wrong means to implement it and you have just created another short term solution that not only will not last - but will actively create more problems due to it.

There are parts i agree, but from my opinion they send you to a wrong solution.

I agree with you, that there are statistic gender differences. But its not about machines, its about humans. So meaning that there are differen statistic centers in behaviour etc... also means, that there are boys and girls who are far away from the statistic center of their gender.

So my english is not good, but maybe an examples helps to understand what i mean. So women normally have feet around size 39 (european size) and men around 42. So yes there are statistic differences and we should not ignore them. But a small amount of women do have feet size 42, just like a small amount of men has feet size 39. And they are not wrong or anything, as we are no machines, there is astatistic spread and thats normal.

So when you say, we should go back to earlier times where all boys were teached as boys and all girls were teached as girls, it would mean for the example: All girls had to wear shoes size 39. Also the few girls that have feet size 42 and who would suffer from that. Also the few boys who have feet size 39. Forcing them to wear shoes with feet size 42, just because the statistic middle of men are wearing feet size 42, is not the right thing to do if they have feet size 39..

From my opinion we should just accept, that boys and grils are different genders with a statistic different behaviour in some points. But this means also to accept that there are some boys and girls who are out of their statistic middle.

Or as example again: I would not tell every girl to become an engineer and every boy to become visagist. But if a girls sem to fit in as engineer, or a boy seems to be more happier when learning a statistic "womenjob", then we should accept that also. Because as there is a different statistic middle for genders in behaviour etc... , which we should accept and where i agree with you, there are these standing on the side of the statistic center.

So i am female engineer on my own, and still i totally agree that there are differences. Most women are for me as strange, as they are for men i think. I do not understand all that stuff about shoes and handbags, and accesoires, and star magazines, and make up and to be in social situations with women is really horror for me, because most of them expect a typical female behaviour which i only can pretend.

Ok, now with 33 years i am tested and diagnosed and from the testing i got scores that are even for men extreme and are far, far, far away from womens statistic middle. So there was nothing wrong about it, when i choose to go to engineer school as a girl, in which i was interested. My dad did not agree with me first, but i fought to do a aptitude test, and the test (and the second harder test, because my father still was not sure about it. ^^) confirmed, that this school would be great and fit my interests by any means.

Its also a fact, that handling social situations with girls was always harder for me then with boys. I did not understand the games really, and i am talking of kindergarten age and younger and as i already told, my parents are faaaar away from any "All genders are the same stuff.", so nobody told me that i should not play with dolls, my parents bought me some like every girl, and I was happy to be gifted and played with them from my opinion. So i built them houses from carton and so on, but this "I let the puppet talk and have thougths and so on...." stuff, with which i was confronted in kindergarten, i did not understood. Why shoult i talk with the puppet, as if it was a baby? Its a puppet? Or when someone said that my puppet would be sad and that stuff. Its a thing, it cant be sad. So it was a toy for me, that i accepted and never thought about any gender things, but to imagine it would be a baby or anything never came on my mind and seemed to be totally freaky. I mean i knwo that it was not alive, because i dismantled them to the parts and built it together again, interested in how the joint worked, why the eyes were closing, when i lay it down, how the hair was fixed in the inside and so on....

So i totally agree with me, that there are statistic differences for genders, because if tehre were not typical femal behaviour i would not have experienced, that i am not fitting in. But please, give the few freaks like me, that are existing, the free opportunity to accept to be different.and to act just as it fits in for them. If i get a daughter someday, its completely normal and ok for me, when she likes to play with dolls. (I am only afraid that she wants to play doll games together with me. Not i wouldnt do it, but i am afraid not to do it "right".) But if not, i wont let her beg 10 years for her first LEGO like my father did. ^^

The fairness test

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8mynrRd7Ak#![/youtube]

I pretty much avoid relationships at this point because of this. I value my individuality over being a masculine rock for a woman.

love the fight scene in Dark Knight Rises between Batman and Bane, the first fight scene

I'm at the same point - including the martial arts, the education, the knowledge, the sort of inner achievements; people's image of me based on what kind of 'vibe' I have and whether it comes off as macho or not is getting to be of less and less concern to me.

If I hear you right you're really saying back at the world in so many ways "I know who I am. Do you?" and when it seems like its churlishness making most of the barriers (like people's highschool-minded judgements) that it really feels like someone's trying to put a bib on you and feed you their baby food.

This is partly why I'm only so concerned with where I end up in the relationship world - I'm coming to be whole of my own even without a relationship. I prefer to keep myself the chooser as well, stay in the drivers seat, and decide who gets to share my private space with me.


I still have to watch this video yet but it looks like it could have some interesting things innit.

maybe i should castrate myself