Still haven't found a girlfriend

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Confusing, but pretty accurate.

You don't want to friend zone yourself with someone you're romantically interested in.

The value in having 1 or more friends that are girls would be just to be comfortable around them. But don't consider these friends your potential dating pool - almost always, they're just your friends.

It's much more common that you might go out on a date or two with someone, who knows you have a romantic/sexual interest in them vs. just hanging out as friends, and one or both of you realize you're not a romantic match & then IF you continue to see each other at all it's as friends. People do make friends this way as they realize they're better suited as friends than lovers.

But it's quite rare that people make new friends and then eventually become lovers. Very, very, rare.

If you have any romantic/sexual interest, your first meeting needs to be a first date, not "hey, let's be friends," or it's never going to develop into a relationship beyond just friends.

So What do i do, people say i have to make friends first that are girls. I HAVE NO FRIENDS THAT ARE GIRLS, NONE AT ALL.

So how the hell am i going to find a gf.

So basically getting to somebody before you develop romantic feelings is the worse way to go about things?

Yeah, I'm with sabreclaw on this one.

If you want a gf, do what guys with gfs do.

Develop you social skills if you have none.

To do that, go where people are. See and be seen. Get comfortable in your own surroundings. Engage in limited conversation, focus on the other person at all times if/when conversations happen.

This is the stage you are in now. You aren't ready to jump ahead yet, so enjoy being where you are for the next few weeks. If you try to jump ahead, you will face rejection before you are confident enough to handle it properly. You will come away from your experience demoralized and hurt. Rejection is inevitable and part of the process for EVERYONE. You will endure it and get used to it soon enough. What we need to do before that happens is build up your confidence in yourself so that when rejection comes you will handle it positively and use it to become stronger. So don't worry about that. Just get out there, get used to being out there, and let everyone get used to seeing you.

Once you get comfortable with other people and other people get comfortable around you, start taking the initiative to engage others in conversation. Always focus on the other person. If they throw the conversation back on you, be brief and deflect. Always focus on the other person. If other people take the initiative and engage you first, the same technique applies. Answer their questions, fire back with your own, keep them talking so you don't have to. Deflect. Refocus on them. Get in the habit of doing this. Trust me, it works. Once you see it work, you'll feel really good about yourself and want to keep going. That is crucial to your success at this stage--not how many friends flock to you, but how you feel about the small victories along the way.

For now, that is all you need to worry about. You aren't ready to move forward yet. When you are, this is what you need to be prepared for:

What I said so far is how you make friends. Do this with everyone whether you have a romantic interest in them or not.

Starting with your circle of friends, begin to build your dating pool. Basically, just talk to girls. Personally, I don't believe in this dreaded defeatist "friendzone." There are ways around that, so as far as I'm concerned it doesn't even exist. Banish it from your mind. Besides, even if it's possible to get friendzoned, you're still (gasp) seeing and talking to girls (shocking!).

Once you get to that point and you're ok talking to girls in your (snort, chuckle) "friendzone," introduce yourself to the "random girl on the street," i.e. someone you're always around but never talk to. Just get in the habit of doing that and expand your dating pool.

We can talk more about what to do and how to start conversations, but let's keep you on the track you're on. Trust me, you're on the right track. Keep doing what you're doing for a few weeks and be patient.

One pro tip you can use right away: Don't go to movies for social purposes. It doesn't work. I'm going out with my best girl to Rogue One tonight. Because I want to see Rogue One. The last thing I'm interested in is making out with her or having a conversation. Besides, trying to be intimate with a girl on the back row of a theater is romper room stuff. Grownups need to act like grownups, so don't go to movies to make friends or to impress a date.

Movies have their place, don't misunderstand me. They're fun. You're just not going to connect with a girl that way. If you've never gone out with a girl before, what you CAN do is take a girl you share absolutely no romantic interest and probably never will, just to say you did it. You can still say, "hey, I went out with a girl." It might make you feel better in the short term. But long term you need to develop some habits that will eventually lead to a relationship, and you'll find movie dates are ineffective. To do a movie date the right way, you need to plan some activity leading up to it, like a day at the zoo, rollerskating, bowling, whatever, capped off with a meal. Dating is about gathering information. Movies are for relaxing and escape. Don't relax and escape before you gather information!! !

Thank you for the advice Angel. What would be the steps you would take to find girls, make friends and be in a relashionship. Is this girl your GF, if so where did you meet her, how did you become friends.

And you will love Rouge one i saw it the other day with my mate.

females have so many demands on guys its not even funny. its always guys that most improve themself to get a gf.

but females are okay like they are. even a female with no job, no social skills and no friends can get a nice loving boyfriend.

what a joke.

I'm not going to list every step because, like goldfish and outrider said, there are some things that can be difficult and confusing. What I'm trying to do is stay on your level and help you work at a pace that will work for you since everyone is different. And I want to see you work into your life some habits that people in relationships develop that get them there. You need to take your time and work through the process. Let us know how you're doing along the way, and we'll keep moving forward.

Like I said before, you're doing fine where you are.

As to what steps to take, you'll have to figure some stuff out on your own because some things you just have to experience for yourself in order to understand them. Keep things simple in your head so you don't get overwhelmed.

In your case, you need to build confidence and morale. Confidence so you'll get comfortable approaching girls. Morale so rejection won't affect you negatively and so you'll keep going no matter what happens. My two big rules are: 1. Conventional dating (as we know it) is ineffective, so don't do it. Think outside the box, and 2. Reduce dating to a numbers game. Wrt to rule 2, it's NOT a zero-sum game. Every conversation you have with a girl is a win. Mostly what I want to see is mentally breaking down love and relationships so you see only immediate positive results that keep YOU feeling good about the process. You've already scored points just by going out with friends to a movie. Always celebrate the little things.

I'll go more into "the steps" another time. For now, just keep doing what you're already doing. This is a long journey. Enjoy each step along the way.

Actually, I'm married with three children. We've been together for over 17 years. We met in college. She had a bf at the time, and I'd just broken up with my fiancée. We broke up after a few months, dated other people, got back together. She dropped out of school, I graduated and went to a school in upstate NY for my master's degree, she went BACK to school, we indulged in some flings while we were apart, I came home, got a real job, proposed to her, she finished college and ran off to Mexico (no, I'm not kidding). We got back together, got married, and the rest is history.

We are best friends, btw. We couldn't stay apart even when we tried to have relationships with other people. We'd just end up cheating on our SOs whenever we'd hang out. So we'd be in bed together talking about the latest drama with whichever guy/girl the other was with. It got crazy-ridiculous-stupid. In the end we just couldn't take it anymore so we got married. We haven't been with anyone else since we got engaged, and we are both hyper-vigilant about our relationship.

As far as my advice goes, you're going to find me predictable. I don't have many original ideas. Most everything I say is ripped straight from "How to win friends and influence people" by Dale Carnegie. I also like 7 Habits by Stephen Covey, Art of War by Sun Tzu, 48 Laws of Power, and the Bible. I like all of the Bible, actually. But for HR purposes Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, Job, and every single thing Jesus said are most excellent. Leviticus and Deuteronomy carefully detail and flesh out what Jesus said, but it's all pointless if you miss the basic premise: Love God, put the needs of everyone else ahead of your own. That's why I love the Old Testament so much, because it shows how timeless are the principles of HR. Not to dismiss the obvious spiritual implications, but that's a different topic.

I also can't stress enough the importance of reading literature specific to love, relationships, and sex. My advice basically distills everything you'll read there, but you never know when someone will say something that strongly resonates with you and makes it easier to understand. Any literature or media that specifically targets women is also VERY good. I love Nora Roberts, Danielle Steele, and Sandra Brown (Steele can be a little dense for my taste, but whatever). Redbook was right up there with the Bible when I was a teenager. I don't personally read Cosmo, but I wonder if it's as helpful as Redbook used to be. Daytime soaps are an endangered species these days, but I still find B&B inspiring, much to my wife's disgust. I used to really like Y&R, but my time for trashy TV is rather limited. B&B appeals to me because I identify with the dark, moody male characters. It's really the women that drive the storyline, but there are always the strong male characters supporting them from the shadows. Why would (real life) women be drawn to these men? What is the appeal? How can I express myself clearly by adapting the behaviors of fictional men to tell my own story? Keep in mind that these are melodramas, not something you want to live out here in GrownUp Land. What do women want to see? Vulnerable but strong men who lean on their female love interests in order to succeed. Successful, strong women who use their success to prop up their lesser male counterparts. Women who are heros. The exact opposite of what you used to see back in the 80's, but that's just a difference in culture (also compare the prevalance of these shows in the mid 90s vs today. They've mostly disappeared). These books and TV shows survive because the writers are careful trend-chasers. So often trashy romance novels and daytime soaps are litmus tests for what women want. Learn how to take the best from women's media and put it to practical use and you'll find love and romance a little easier to understand and navigate.

I Just wanted to ask something about Plenty of Fish. Do girls ever reply on there. The other day i sent this message


Hello, my name is sam, i am 24 years old. I love traveling and i am currently studying on level 2 travel & tourism at college. It is my dream to travel the world, explore new places and have adventures. Where in the world would you like to go? Also i am the same as you, i love saving my money, how can i have all these adventures if i spend money on things i don't need? Anyway please get back to me, you seem like such a nice woman and it would be nice to make friends on here.



I mean she viewed it but didn't even respond


how on earth will i find a friend that is a girl if i dont know girls

Ive got.more bad news.

1. Most people would consider that a bad first message. It is too long and women want a message that says you read her profile description. So if sh likes the same music, you could say "Hi, I see you also like to listen to X, what do you think is their best song?"

You also should not say just hi or hello because again makes her think u did not read her profile.

2. Most people are or looking for friend on dating sites they are looking for sex or love. It is unlikely any women from dating sites want to be 'just friends'

3. Many been you try to get to know as friends might think you want sex or love from her and not to be just friends.

Do I make dating sound hard?

This is the easy part!

White as snow is correct.

I'll tell you a little secret the bluepillers will try to deny:

1. When a heterosexual man in his 20s and hetero woman in hers are friends 90% of the time the guy wills be willing to give the girl a chance at a relationship or sex if she jua asks. The opposite is rarely true. When a woman sees you as only a friend, she really does. There is 0 physical or romantic attraction whatsoever, she sees you like a brother. She likely never has and never will be interested in you that way

For men, complete opposite of what I said.

In a m/f friendship, the male is more likely to develop onesided feelings for her than she for him.

Why do you think it seems more men ed up friend zone then women?

There's ypue answer.

But the thing is i did read her profile. She was the sort of girl i would really like to date. i took my time reading her profile.

I know that if i ever found a girlfriend i would be the happiest person alive. It is my dream in a few years to have a family, spend christmas with them. It is my dream in the future to tell my dad he is a grandpa

No not really. If it really was that easy for women to get a nice loving boyfriend there wouldn't be any single women who want a relationship. It is certainly true that some flaws are more tolerated in women than in men by potential partners but it obviously is not a black and white thing where women can get everything they want without even trying and men don't have a chance.
That it absolutely did not matter when it comes to dating whether a woman had a job or not was probably two generations ago. Now, yes, there are more men who might be willing to date a jobless woman than women willing to date a jobless man but jobs are actually not unimportant for a woman's chances in dating. Neither are social skills or having friends. Even if most men would be willing to not only date but to have a long term relationship with a women with no friends and bad social skills - which most men wouldn't (and yes of course they have a right to no want those women; I'm not trying to imply anything different) - it'd still make it difficult for those women to get to know a potential boyfriend (and getting to know the right people might just be a problem a lot of lonely guys will be familiar with).

What is really a lot easier as a straight female than as a straight male is getting one night stands and possibly first dates - if one is into sleeping with random strangers no matter what the circumstances.

I just don't think white as snow's attitude will be any help in dating (or at least how he sounds in this post; I don't remember any other posts of his and it might not be his overall attitude but a temporary bad mood). If I realized that a guy I was dating thought everything in life was handed on a silver plate to me just because I am female whereas the world kept being unfair to him because he is male, I'd be gone. Why? Because I couldn't expect a person with that attitude to be supportive if I had any problems because apparently my life is always easy because I am female.
This is not to say a guy can't talk about the disadvantages men have because women and men are not treated exactly the same by society (but there also are biological differences; it's not all made by society). However, if a man has black and white thinking where life as a woman is easy and life as a man is hard a woman can not hope for him to be supportive of her.

Yeah, I know what I'm saying is not relevant to the OP; so sorry for that.

I think i'm starting to look more attractive now. I mean yes i still haven't found a gf or even found a friend thats a girl that i can take to the movies, go to places with but my face is looking better.

I think if i can lose a bit of weight and have a nice haircut i will look really good. I don't get very nervous in social situations, just scared about talking to girls if i'm out because how could i meet someone that is a stranger?

I have never had a gfirlfriend just cruel rejecitons. Why don't you answer my thread.

Yeah, that's the point I've been trying to make. You're getting better with social. Now we gotta get you confident talking to girls. The first step is still in play. See and be seen. Don't worry about approaching girls just now. Let them get used to you being around. You want to appear harmless and non-threatening. Because you ARE harmless. But the problem we have sometimes is how we appear. Making moves so soon might give the wrong impression. Some of us like myself have "creep" oozing out of our pores even if we're not. So just being present is enough because even if you send a bad vibe, you're not going to scare anyone. After a while they just become "nose-blind" to it. She's like, "yeah, I know he's funny-looking, but he's just a big teddy bear." Once you get there, you can make eye contact and say "hello." And smile at them when you do.

After a week or so of that, introduce yourself. Trade names. Keep it very brief, then stick around for longer conversations as you feel more comfortable.

Your goal at that point is to get comfortable talking to girls, NOT getting a gf. You can't get a gf if you aren't talking to girls, so make friends. I believe that the "friendzone" is a work of fiction; however, it's got some good metaphorical use. Make up your mind that these girls are friends and always will be (this can always change, but don't think about that right now). Because there's no pressure to be more than just friends, it will help you get in the habit of talking to girls and seeing them as really no different than your guy friends.

Just remember: Friends First!! ! Go slow.

The "friendzone" is a myth because friends can and do become attracted to each other all the time. What happens is you become acquainted with a lot of women who will be really nice to you, but you just aren't their type. You never had a chance with these women in the first place. The friendzone illusion makes it appear that at one time maybe you had a chance but lost it due to something you did or could have changed. The reality is it doesn't matter. If you are friends or acquaintances with enough women, sooner or later you are going to find that you get to hang out with one or more women than others. When that happens, you're close to having a gf. At that stage, you just ask. You might, say, approach 10 girls about an exclusive relationship, and 9 of them come back with "Aw! You're really sweet and cute and stuff. And I really am sorry, but I just don't like you that way." But then you have that 1 that's like, "I thought you'd never ask!! ! Yes, I'd love to be your gf."

If you're really smooth about it, you'll be with some girl after you've already kinds cut other girls out of you life, and this will happen so subtly she won't even notice. You just randomly hold her hand one day and she won't resist it. You kiss on the cheek every time you part ways, until...oops, you miss, and give her a real kiss. So later on you ask her to be your gf and she's like, "ok, I kinda thought I WAS your gf."

Or even better: She starts introducing you to her fam and friends as her bf.

Note that this is NOT dating the way we usually think about it. It's simply a way to get out there and meet girls and become comfortable in your own skin around them. You might have a gf in as little as 8 weeks, or it might take as long as 2 years. Or more or less that. You condemn yourself to certain failure by trying to move too fast, skipping steps, or giving up.

But it's better than dating. Dating means:

You go to a girl, ask her out. She says no.
You go to a girl, ask her out. She says no.
You go to a girl, ask her out. She says no.
You go to a girl, ask her out. She says no.
You go to a girl, ask her out. She says yes, then she stands you up.
You go to a girl, ask her out. She says no.
You go to a girl, ask her out. She says no.
You go to a girl, ask her out. She says no.
You go to a girl, ask her out. She accepts. Repeat. Repeat, she turns you down because she's "washing her hair."
You go to a girl, ask her out. She says no.
You go to a girl, ask her out. She says no.
You go to a girl, ask her out. She says no.
You go to a girl, ask her out. She accepts. Repeat, repeat, repeat, she likes you, you have a gf. You develop feelings for each other. Maybe even have sex a few times. You have one little fight, she cheats on you, some other girl starts hitting on you, your gf turns psychotic...whatever, it all falls apart and one/both of you end up with a broken heart.
You take time out from relationships to heal, maybe get in a rebound relationship that doesn't go anywhere but at least you got some good sex.
You go to a girl, ask her out. She says no.
You go to a girl, ask her out. She says no.
You go to a girl, ask her out. She says no.
You go to a girl, ask her out. She says no.
You go to a girl, ask her out. She says no.
You go to a girl, ask her out. She says no.
...

You get the idea. I say screw that, there's got to be a better way. Take time, make friends, let relationships "just happen." Sure, there will still be rejections and heartbreak along the way. But if you do what I suggest, you'll have no shortage of girls to hang with. And you'll learn a lot about girls. Those that keep you in the "friendzone" might even be better coaches and advisors than I am and help speed things along in a HEALTHY way. Don't doubt me!

In bold is what happens inside the man though.