Why are adult women not as nice?

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Could you explain to me, in your own words, what a ND courtship and culture is and should be?

You want someone natural, untouched, and not smeared by any NT cultural influence, and yet you're going to expect a young, inexperienced woman to settle with you after she takes a bite of what intimacy feels like. She may decide she doesn't like you, after all.

It's not a sure-thing for a 'natural' woman to stay how she is after some experience, right? Cultural influence isn't so strong that people will lose their instincts.

You could be a serial dater of multiple inexperienced, vulnerable women, and all they'd have in common after leaving the relationship is being with you once and possibly being less desirable to the next man that comes along. It's unlikely she'll be any less desirable, lots of men are much less offended by a past dating history, because they are not threatened by it.

Insecure people are actually more likely to cheat, did you know that? They are less well-versed in knowing how to cope with someone wanting them, and might give into any attention they get if they learn they're desirable to other people.

Perhaps you (some men in this thread in general) are not relationship material. You demand for women to have no dating history, and will lose interest in them as soon as you learn a bit too much about them. If you've been single for very long, then it might be your own fault for being so unavailable to the NT cultured women you look down on.

I didn't "realize" I didn't like them--I knew that from the very start, but was desperate, because as you said, it can feel "kinda hopeless" to find others like myself. I went in thinking that all I needed was a girl who would want to experiment with touch. I came out knowing that I want someone who wants to experiment, and to whom I also am attracted. Not necessarily someone with whom I am deeply in love, just at the bare minimum someone I don't find hideous, and much more preferably someone I actually have some sort of feelings for.

The kind of woman I am looking for finds me attractive and I find her attractive too--so at that point this change is irrelevant--either she's already undergone it (by being with someone she finds hideous/unattractive and learning that's not what she wants), or else she doesn't NEED to, because she's already with someone she likes (myself).

I'm not looking for someone who is necessarily like how I was before those girls, but someone who is like how I am now (i.e. never been with someone he/she finds attractive, still curious about the male body in the sort of sense of a kid who peeks at her brother changing, wonders what it would feel like for a crush to be mutual). Though I wouldn't quibble with someone who has even less experience, like I had before meeting those girls--because as I say, I am looking for a relationship with mutual attraction anyway so it really doesn't matter. And I don't think it's really something to worry about anyway. Most young women have already had the opportunity to reject at least one guy, and feel (rightly or not) like they have the luxury of being able to pick and choose. So, they have probably either already done what I did with those two girls, and learned from it, or else they are holding out for mutual attraction anyway.

What I'm looking for is definitely not a girl who has never experienced physical or emotional intimacy before, but who falls head over heels and marries me at the first taste of someone liking her. What I'm looking for is someone who lived a similar isolated childhood, who wants to write a story together, metaphorically speaking, from the beginning.

So you want like a girl with confidence issues that will instantly fall head over heels in love with you and jump into marriage because no one else has ever liked her before? I mean sure I could see it being kind of an endearing fantasy but realistically that's ridiculous. I mean what happens after you get married right away and then get to know each other and find out you really aren't that into each other or you guys simply don't get along as a couple? What if she realizes she jumped into the marriage far too quick without really thinking it through.

So you want like a girl with confidence issues that will instantly fall head over heels in love with you and jump into marriage because no one else has ever liked her before? I mean sure I could see it being kind of an endearing fantasy but realistically that's ridiculous. I mean what happens after you get married right away and then get to know each other and find out you really aren't that into each other or you guys simply don't get along as a couple? What if she realizes she jumped into the marriage far too quick without really thinking it through.

The kind of woman I am looking for finds me attractive and I find her attractive too--so at that point this change is irrelevant--either she's already undergone it (by being with someone she finds hideous/unattractive and learning that's not what she wants), or else she doesn't NEED to, because she's already with someone she likes (myself).

I think you missed the negative in there. In other words, everything in that first sentence is what I DON'T want (but had the feeling some others in this thread THOUGHT I wanted). The second sentence is what I DO want. I am by no means ready to get married, or even think about that.

Also, I thought I saw a reply from you about my comments about women in group homes/assisted living facilities, but somehow it magically disappeared before I had a chance to respond to it. So, I will, even though I can't quote it.

I'm not interested in nonverbal women, or women who appear openly, for lack of a better word, "ret*d". I'm fine with women who can't drive, who can't live on their own, or who have issues like motor tics, incoordination, etc. But I want someone with whom I can have a real conversation, and someone I can ask for consent with before doing anything.

There's this girl I've been visiting in a group home--she's actually quite smart and perfectly able to communicate on her own. I'm not sexually interested in her, though I thought I might be when one of the staff of the home came to an asperger parent meeting where my mom was and said the young woman was looking for friends. She's almost exactly the same age as me, and everyone wonders why she's there, but she does live in kind of a "bubble". She doesn't have a boyfriend, and I totally understand why--the majority of guys (and other women) in that home are nearly nonverbal, they babble almost like babies and it would be inappropriate for her to date them, not to mention that if they are as unattractive to her as women who are THAT low-functioning are to me, she wouldn't want to anyway.

^ And why is that a bad thing if the women I am dating also want to relive this kind of concern-less relationships?

Some of the women I had sex with are divorced / single moms who miss the sex and want to try it again after so long; they aren't very young either; usually of age 30-40 bracket.

Yes I want to make up for the wasted years - they were wasted. because I was not attractive; no girl wanted me, it wasn't by my choice.
But I am being very transparent in my intentions.

Even if I personally have my reasons for thinking that it's bad and I can't stand such behaviours, I don't think that I was lecturing people in my post. I was just saying what the situation is and you said the same exact thing today in your post. I didn't even say the word "bad", perhaps you are projecting something on my post.

You remind me of myself when I was at your age.

People change and you might change too.

There is more to relationships than attractiveness. She could find you attractive and still conclude she doesn't like your personality,

she could like you initially and come to not like you so much if she ends up thinking you don't spend enough time with you, doesn't think you're on the same page as far as relationship goals or things like that.

Even two people liking each other isn't a guarantee it will work out. There is one of my exes I never came to dislike...I think he was a cool guy, but there were other factors that got in the way.

There are just a lot of factors.

This subforum is filled with guys who wasted their youth and now want to make up for it by either sleeping around or getting the teenish relationship they never had while they are 30 or something.

There is good change, and then there is bad change.

I include personality in "attractiveness", not just beauty. Those girls I was involved with didn't only LOOK unattractive, they weren't my type personality-wise, even though one in particular was a very nice person.



Isn't this the whole thing we're talking about--finding someone on the same page in terms of relationship goals (where stage of development is a major factor)? If I'm looking for "teenish Disney love" as Peacesells puts it, and someone to share a blanket fort with or lie under the stars with and muse about the nature of existence, whereas she's looking for someone stable who will support her and maybe raise a family, doesn't that count as "not being on the same page as far as relationship goals or things like that". Similarly, if my idea of sexual experimentation is rolling around tickling each other in various places, taking showers together, and tasting each other's fluids like a kid licks different candy, and hers is getting handcuffed and being treated roughly, doesn't that ALSO count as "not being on the same page"?



What does "work out" mean here?

Could you explain to me, in your own words, what a ND courtship and culture is and should be?

You want someone natural, untouched, and not smeared by any NT cultural influence, and yet you're going to expect a young, inexperienced woman to settle with you after she takes a bite of what intimacy feels like. She may decide she doesn't like you, after all.

It's not a sure-thing for a 'natural' woman to stay how she is after some experience, right? Cultural influence isn't so strong that people will lose their instincts.

You could be a serial dater of multiple inexperienced, vulnerable women, and all they'd have in common after leaving the relationship is being with you once and possibly being less desirable to the next man that comes along. It's unlikely she'll be any less desirable, lots of men are much less offended by a past dating history, because they are not threatened by it.

Insecure people are actually more likely to cheat, did you know that? They are less well-versed in knowing how to cope with someone wanting them, and might give into any attention they get if they learn they're desirable to other people.

Perhaps you (some men in this thread in general) are not relationship material. You demand for women to have no dating history, and will lose interest in them as soon as you learn a bit too much about them. If you've been single for very long, then it might be your own fault for being so unavailable to the NT cultured women you look down on.