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Being friends after a breakup

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hurtloam
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10 Aug 2019, 12:36 am

Mona Pereth wrote:
Yep, that's a big difference between you and lots of other autistic people. Some autistic people are lucky enough to be emotionally self-sufficient like you apparently are, but many other autistic people, once they reach a certain age at least, strongly desire a close personal romantic relationship and feel very lonely without one.

In my opinion, those who feel lonely without a romantic relationship need to learn how to have strong platonic close friendships with people of both sexes, to take the edge off their loneliness. Otherwise, when seeking a romantic relationship, they will inevitably be desperate, which is commonly regarded as a big turnoff, especially in a heterosexual context.


I think this is a very important comment. There are so many lonely people here who have trouble forming friendships let alone something more.



hurtloam
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10 Aug 2019, 1:08 am

My situation is different though. I have a friendship that got messy, so I've got to untangle myself.

I think it's best to limit communication. I'm not going to refuse to attend things our friends organise if he's there, that's too extreme, but the hurt he caused is too much to deal with. I've not only lost a romantic connection, I've lost a friend and that really hurts. I can just flip a switch and have all the feelings stop.

I don't make friends that I can relate to very easily. It is a loss. It's such a waste. It's sad.



The_Face_of_Boo
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10 Aug 2019, 2:11 am

I assumed that he just rejected you as a romantic partner, what is really this sin he did that you keep talking about without naming it?



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10 Aug 2019, 4:14 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
I assumed that he just rejected you as a romantic partner, what is really this sin he did that you keep talking about without naming it?


I think I could have dealt with it better if I had asked him out and he had said no, rather than him making the move and then suddenly dropping me like a hot potato.

It was being treated like a terrible mistake that cut me so deeply.

In a moment I was enough, I was part of something happy, but upon closer inspection and upon reflection, not good enough and causing sadness. I'd rather be rejected outright, this is just confusing.

The change from happy to sad was literally overnight.



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10 Aug 2019, 4:52 pm

rdos wrote:
Yes, it seems so. I can identify with having a crush as a special interest. Actually, I suspect the reason we have special interests relates to crushes and our relationship preferences.

OTOH, I cannot remember ever having a problem with having a crush on somebody. Every time I kept a crush there seemed to be some shared interest, and so we at least played the distance observation game for a while.

I remember one particular happening a couple of years ago when a woman on a train triggered a crush. I decided I wouldn't ever see her again, and so I didn't want the crush, and it disappeared within a week or so with no bad feelings.

Perhaps one of the differences between me and all the autistics that have problems with crushes is that I will be content with observing my crush from a distance (and indefinitely so), and I don't need to ask her out or get into a relationship with her. I don't have any expectations and just like to thrive on the good feelings the crush creates.
The thing is that crushes can sometimes develop & turn into something much deeper even if they're not reciprocated. That's what happened to me. I actually could fairly easily accept that I cant have a romantic relationship with Miranda if I could be a small part of her life in some other way; friend, body guard, personal assistant, something. My problem is that I feel very protective of people I love & it hurts like hell not being able to do a d@mn thing about those feelings. I still feel very protective about both my exes & I haven't heard from them or seen anything about them online in a LONG time. It eats me up inside.


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rdos
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12 Aug 2019, 2:43 am

hurtloam wrote:
Mona Pereth wrote:
Yep, that's a big difference between you and lots of other autistic people. Some autistic people are lucky enough to be emotionally self-sufficient like you apparently are, but many other autistic people, once they reach a certain age at least, strongly desire a close personal romantic relationship and feel very lonely without one.

In my opinion, those who feel lonely without a romantic relationship need to learn how to have strong platonic close friendships with people of both sexes, to take the edge off their loneliness. Otherwise, when seeking a romantic relationship, they will inevitably be desperate, which is commonly regarded as a big turnoff, especially in a heterosexual context.


I think this is a very important comment. There are so many lonely people here who have trouble forming friendships let alone something more.


Well, I've been lonely (and a bit desperate) too when I was younger. I wouldn't say I'm emotionally self-sufficient in that way, but nowadays I'm a bit more aware of what is needed not to feel lonely. It certainly is not a close friendship and not even a romantic relationship. You can be quite lonely in a romantic relationship too. When I had the distance things in school that all kind of started with a crush, I never was lonely. So, I would say that having somebody to obsess over and put my focus on is certainly enough not to feel lonely. It doesn't need to lead anywhere as I still won't feel lonely when I have those kinds of things going.

Actually, I think the whole commitment and relationship thing is so very NT and not very relevant to me, and therefore not the main reason why I would feel lonely or not.

So, I'm not convinced that friendships or other social contacts can act as substitutes for a romantic relationship (or a distance observation thing). I'm rather convinced that this won't work for me at least.



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12 Aug 2019, 8:00 am

rdos wrote:
Well, I've been lonely (and a bit desperate) too when I was younger.

At what age?

rdos wrote:
I wouldn't say I'm emotionally self-sufficient in that way, but nowadays I'm a bit more aware of what is needed not to feel lonely. It certainly is not a close friendship and not even a romantic relationship. You can be quite lonely in a romantic relationship too.

Yep, that's certainly possible. Especially, it seems to me, in a romantic relationship with a person with whom one has little or nothing in common. (You would probably disagree that having interests in common has anything to do with it, but I would suspect you're probably unusual among autistic people in this regard.)

rdos wrote:
When I had the distance things in school that all kind of started with a crush, I never was lonely. So, I would say that having somebody to obsess over and put my focus on is certainly enough not to feel lonely. It doesn't need to lead anywhere as I still won't feel lonely when I have those kinds of things going.

It's great that that works for you. I doubt it would work well for most people, including most autistic people.

(Additionally, even with people for whom this does work, it can work well only if you and your crush will be reliably in the same place regularly over a period of time, e.g. taking a class together. It's less likely to happen when one is no longer in school.)

rdos wrote:
Actually, I think the whole commitment and relationship thing is so very NT and not very relevant to me, and therefore not the main reason why I would feel lonely or not.

It seems to me that many autistic people may start desiring these things later in life than NTs commonly do, but that doesn't mean they are just an NT thing. Many autistic people do desire them too.

rdos wrote:
So, I'm not convinced that friendships or other social contacts can act as substitutes for a romantic relationship (or a distance observation thing). I'm rather convinced that this won't work for me at least.

It worked for me between the time my last romantic relationship ended and the time my relationship with my current boyfriend began.


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12 Aug 2019, 9:01 am

Mona Pereth wrote:
rdos wrote:
Well, I've been lonely (and a bit desperate) too when I was younger.

At what age?


The late 20s and early 30s. Basically after I had given up on the college crush which took almost 10 years.

Mona Pereth wrote:
rdos wrote:
I wouldn't say I'm emotionally self-sufficient in that way, but nowadays I'm a bit more aware of what is needed not to feel lonely. It certainly is not a close friendship and not even a romantic relationship. You can be quite lonely in a romantic relationship too.

Yep, that's certainly possible. Especially, it seems to me, in a romantic relationship with a person with whom one has little or nothing in common. (You would probably disagree that having interests in common has anything to do with it, but I would suspect you're probably unusual among autistic people in this regard.)


I don't think interests have so much to do with it. It's more the general outlook on life. Some people like to settle down when they age while others think life starts after you retire. Also, if one person likes a lot of physical activity and the other prefers to do as little as possible, that's also incompatible desires.

Mona Pereth wrote:
It's great that that works for you. I doubt it would work well for most people, including most autistic people.

(Additionally, even with people for whom this does work, it can work well only if you and your crush will be reliably in the same place regularly over a period of time, e.g. taking a class together. It's less likely to happen when one is no longer in school.)


That's true. The easiest time for romance was in school, but it is possible to set up later too.

Mona Pereth wrote:
rdos wrote:
Actually, I think the whole commitment and relationship thing is so very NT and not very relevant to me, and therefore not the main reason why I would feel lonely or not.

It seems to me that many autistic people may start desiring these things later in life than NTs commonly do, but that doesn't mean they are just an NT thing. Many autistic people do desire them too.


I have age data in my investigation of friendships, and there are a few that are 40+ so I could check if your suspicion is true. Personally, I don't think it is. I'm much less likely to want friends at this point than I was when younger. OTOH, I'd suspect that when people get into relationships they will be less likely to want friends, and so checking this will require to know if people are in relationships or not, and I don't have that information.



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12 Aug 2019, 1:06 pm

I have to guess that many with autism who feel lonely as they get older and think a human companion is the answer are people who never had close relationships in the past. I've had plenty of close relationships and the older I get the less I worry about being lonely because the constraints of a relationship and lack of personal freedom are much more difficult challenges.



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12 Aug 2019, 2:12 pm

rdos wrote:
I don't think interests have so much to do with it. It's more the general outlook on life. Some people like to settle down when they age while others think life starts after you retire. Also, if one person likes a lot of physical activity and the other prefers to do as little as possible, that's also incompatible desires.

I agree that having a compatible basic outlook on life is even more important than having common interests, though for me the latter is important too.

rdos wrote:
Mona Pereth wrote:
rdos wrote:
Actually, I think the whole commitment and relationship thing is so very NT and not very relevant to me, and therefore not the main reason why I would feel lonely or not.

It seems to me that many autistic people may start desiring these things later in life than NTs commonly do, but that doesn't mean they are just an NT thing. Many autistic people do desire them too.


I have age data in my investigation of friendships, and there are a few that are 40+ so I could check if your suspicion is true. Personally, I don't think it is. I'm much less likely to want friends at this point than I was when younger. OTOH, I'd suspect that when people get into relationships they will be less likely to want friends, and so checking this will require to know if people are in relationships or not, and I don't have that information.

By "later in life," I didn't necessarily mean after 40, and, in the above context, I was talking about committed romantic relationships, not friendships. What I would expect, regarding committed romantic relationships, is perhaps the following:

1) NT girls typically start desiring them in their mid-teens, if not earlier.
2) Verbal autistic girls/women typically start desiring them in their late teens or early 20s.
3) NT men typically start desiring them in maybe their early 20s.
4) Verbal autistic men typically start desiring them in maybe their mid-to-late 20s.

I'm not sure if the above is correct, but those would be my guesses.

We discussed earlier how/when I think friendships form, and I agree that people in romantic relationships are less likely to seek friendships, other factors being equal.


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rdos
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13 Aug 2019, 6:42 am

Mona Pereth wrote:
By "later in life," I didn't necessarily mean after 40, and, in the above context, I was talking about committed romantic relationships, not friendships. What I would expect, regarding committed romantic relationships, is perhaps the following:

1) NT girls typically start desiring them in their mid-teens, if not earlier.
2) Verbal autistic girls/women typically start desiring them in their late teens or early 20s.
3) NT men typically start desiring them in maybe their early 20s.
4) Verbal autistic men typically start desiring them in maybe their mid-to-late 20s.

I'm not sure if the above is correct, but those would be my guesses.


I never made much difference between observation "things" and real relationships, but for the former, I desired them already from my mid-teens (or something like that).

However, when I studied relationship history I basically came to the conclusion that ND men were older when they got into relationships, and therefore also older when they got children. Something that a famous (maybe should be infamous instead?) found and attributed to older fathers having a higher risk of getting autistic children. I suspect this poor study actually have refrained some older autistic men from getting children, but it is all bull. There is no such effect. It all comes down to ND men being older when they get into relationships and getting children that are at a much higher risk of inheriting their autistic traits.

I wouldn't attribute this to a later desire though. We have many guys here that clearly desire a romantic relationship but fail to achieve one. I find it more likely it's an effect of not being able to handle today's dating expectations.



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15 Aug 2019, 5:36 pm

My wife wants a' parenting marriage'. Our physical connection has deteriorated over time. I was never very prolific - not helped (arguably) in the past by weed. We had very contrasting sexual experiences prior to beginning our relationship - this has always been unhelpful. I have been diagnosed with ASD (aspergers) within very recent past aged 46. We have 3 children together. Fantastic, beautiful, healthy, boisterous boys. I have a job whereas she currently does not - staying at home with 3 boys is the hardest job of all. I really feel all over the place right now. Advice welcomed as we have not told anyone of our new situation. We just got back from holiday in Florida (Disneyworld) which was amazing but our relationship has (we are in agreement) wained - deceased in the physical sense. The kids are our priority but my wife and i are bickering more than ever. I was feeling sad at work today but my mood changed markedly when i was sent a video of the puppy i have bought. Generally we are a big happy family but there is mutual sadness about what may happen in the future. Aspergers diagnosis for me whereas wife NT. I often say life's too short and it is of course but so much complication and hassle involved when affection decreases. Add in 10 year marriage and 3 kids. FK!! !! !! !! !



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15 Aug 2019, 10:01 pm

Layzark wrote:
My wife wants a' parenting marriage'. Our physical connection has deteriorated over time. I was never very prolific - not helped (arguably) in the past by weed. We had very contrasting sexual experiences prior to beginning our relationship - this has always been unhelpful. I have been diagnosed with ASD (aspergers) within very recent past aged 46. We have 3 children together. Fantastic, beautiful, healthy, boisterous boys. I have a job whereas she currently does not - staying at home with 3 boys is the hardest job of all. I really feel all over the place right now. Advice welcomed as we have not told anyone of our new situation. We just got back from holiday in Florida (Disneyworld) which was amazing but our relationship has (we are in agreement) wained - deceased in the physical sense. The kids are our priority but my wife and i are bickering more than ever. I was feeling sad at work today but my mood changed markedly when i was sent a video of the puppy i have bought. Generally we are a big happy family but there is mutual sadness about what may happen in the future. Aspergers diagnosis for me whereas wife NT. I often say life's too short and it is of course but so much complication and hassle involved when affection decreases. Add in 10 year marriage and 3 kids. FUUUUUUCK!! ! ! ! ! ! ! !


By "parenting marriage" do you mean you don't sleep together but still don't sleep with other people?

Raising kids is really tough on a marriage. I stayed home with my kids for awhile and it was exhausting and isolating. I also had undiagnosed autism and ADHD at the time. Does she have anything else besides the house and kids she can do that she's passionate about? If she's happy with something outside of family she might be more open to being romantic again.

When you guys have problems or are stressed do you tend to talk about it with each other, or do you tend to talk to other people about it?


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17 Aug 2019, 1:12 am

hurtloam wrote:
How do you ignore your feelings for the other person?

You know it's not going to lead anywhere, but there's something about them that just tugs at your heart strings every time they smile at you.


It just depends on what the issues were and if they've been resolved.. the feeling of unresolved issues and still having feelings is unbearable and it just isn't worth the heartache in trying to stay friends. If you both are on good terms and fully understand why it ended, it's possible.


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17 Aug 2019, 4:18 am

886 wrote:
hurtloam wrote:
How do you ignore your feelings for the other person?

You know it's not going to lead anywhere, but there's something about them that just tugs at your heart strings every time they smile at you.


It just depends on what the issues were and if they've been resolved.. the feeling of unresolved issues and still having feelings is unbearable and it just isn't worth the heartache in trying to stay friends. If you both are on good terms and fully understand why it ended, it's possible.


Yeah, there were no great big, huge, horrible issues. We never even have really had an argument. It's not like either of us are manipulative or messed the other around.

I don't fully understand what the reason is, but we're on good enough terms to hang out with a group of friends now, so I'm ok with that-ish.

Still hurts for the time being. I'm gonna grit my teeth and get through it.