A woman at the church

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Well, her giving me the phone number was a week after me asking her that question. Because you see, I only come there for sabbath services (its a messianic church) and they happen once a week, on saturday mornings. After one of the services, they didn't have the meal, and I was outside the church about to go home and asked the younger lady that question right before I left. Then the next sabbath, we had a meal, and then I was on the same table with the older lady and the younger lady eventually joined us at the older lady's prompting.

I am not sure whether the older lady was present when I asked the younger lady that question the first week. I know that some of her friends were present, and its quite possible that the older lady was there too, but I am not sure. Because I didn't know who she is until she introduced herself a week later. From what she said a week later it sounds like she was there, but I might be mistaken maybe she wasn't and the younger lady just told her.

In any case, the point is that -- whether the older lady was there the first week or not -- I was talking the first week only to the younger lady and my interaction only involved asking her that question and walking off. Then a week later I talked to the old lady and *thats* when she got the young lady to give me the phone number.

So basically the young lady had the whole week to process it.

The other factor is being a good christian girl she might wanted to have made you feel you were welcome to ask her to be friends ( I recall this from my own experiences from church) but then she limits any further interaction just so you maintain a "friendly" distance and not create any misunderstands about her intentions as romantic.

You know what’s the most sad in this thread?

You are overthinking too much about her for over 5 pages while she probably doesn’t even recall your name by now.

Attractive young women are simply used to reject tons of guys in their life; and usually become desensitized about it.

I wouldn't say she is attractive. I would rank her as average or slightly below. But she is certainly much more attractive than most of the girls that dated me: at least she is of normal weight, while the girls that dated me were extremely overweight.

Also the fact that she was single for so long suggests that maybe others don't think she is attractive either. But, like I said, as of now she is engaged (thats what she told me in response to my last text).

that is the incel/redpill viewpoint.. i have worked with women for 10+ years and listen to their conversations.. they talk about men a lot.. all kinds of men.. she probably mentioned him to her friend a once or twice.. but unless you are actively dating a woman, are married, or rich.. you are not even on their radar!

Thats another thing that I don't understand. If they have time to talk about me to their friends, why don't they have time to talk to me directly?

Don't get me wrong, I have no problem with the "talking to their friends" part; my problem is with "avoiding talking to me" part. It feels like there are at least two compelling reasons to talk to me directly:

a) What if there was a misunderstanding, and then I can clarify it? Even if they are 99% sure that there was no misunderstanding, wouldn't that 1% chance that there might be worth 5 minutes of trying to figure out?

b) If they were to send me some text, however short, I won't have to stare at my screen all day long and be puzzled what is going on

So, from the fact that they don't bother communicating with me (whether hearing me out OR telling me their side), I would gather they are all so super busy that they don't have extra 5 minutes. Or they are so super lazy that pressing an extra key on their phone is too hard.

But then comes a surprise: It turns out that they spent several hours talking about me to their friends. So if they were able to do that, what was stopping them from taking 5 minutes to talk to me?!

Do they assume I am a brick wall who won't hear them anyway? If so, thats a misunderstanding right there. Look at all those long messages that I type. If I was a brick wall, I wouldn't have been typing all of them.

I just don't get it. If they talk to their friends, their friends can *guess* what went on in my head. If they talk to me, I can just *tell them*. And no I am not being hypocritical: on my end I would totally prefer to talk to them rather than to the third parties on wrongplanet. The only reason I talk to wrongplanet is that they aren't letting me talk to them directly. As far as I am concerned, I feel like if I were to talk to those girls directly it would be a total win/win. I just don't see why *they* don't see it that way.

Now, since you said you personally wittnessed the girls talking to their friends about men, do *you* have any inside regarding this question? Why do they talk to their friends while avoiding talking to the men in question?

it simply shows how one can be obsessively thinking about the other while the other is thinking about meh. It is not about RP.

"a) What if there was a misunderstanding, and then I can clarify it? Even if they are 99% sure that there was no misunderstanding, wouldn't that 1% chance that there might be worth 5 minutes of trying to figure out?" - YOU may want to clarify it, but she gets a reaction to the first thing you said and people don't change their mind easily.. the misunderstanding is enough for her to make a negative opinion of you, not because it cannot be clarified, but because a person she likes would never make a misunderstanding like that in the first place.. she took the misunderstanding at face value and she does not have the attention span or interest to clarify.. and the fact that someone would make that misunderstanding already paints that person in a non-likable light for her.. women take things at face value often.. that's why they are so easy to manipulate and impress by some men.. they can tell them stories and get their sympathy when it makes no sense.. for example a guy coming of jail can win over a woman.. or a gang member can get a girl to kiss him on the cheek.. or a drug dealer can get sympathy and admiration from a woman.. they take things at face value and if they think it through, the things they think through are at face value as well.. on the other hand, us aspie men, that is probably me and many others, we are so blind we cannot take things at face value and we fail to see and recognize obvious things that are in front of us.. so who is right - us blaming them for not thinking things through, or them blaming us for not seeing what is right in front of us?

"b) If they were to send me some text, however short, I won't have to stare at my screen all day long and be puzzled what is going on" - women KNOW that texts from women are VERY meaningful and carry many connotations.. usually a text means the girl is romantically interested in you.. so a text from a girl in our modern world is like doing something preposterous in the Victorian era for a girl.. I once asked an old female classmate for her phone number to text, and she was convinced I am trying to get a date with her despite her having a bf.."

"So, from the fact that they don't bother communicating with me (whether hearing me out OR telling me their side), I would gather they are all so super busy that they don't have extra 5 minutes. Or they are so super lazy that pressing an extra key on their phone is too hard. " - they don't know that you need things explained to you, because they normally do not explain things to men.. NT men figure women out naturally, or not at all.. in fact, women enjoy knowing what men think, and testing how the men will react to figure out what the men think, while hiding what they truly think.. it's like a protective thing and a power play on their part.. I don't think they know to hear you out or to tell you their side, and even if the did, they would find it not interesting and not exciting.. and they don't have time for things that are not interesting or exciting.

"I feel like if I were to talk to those girls directly it would be a total win/win. I just don't see why *they* don't see it that way." - the women do not normally talk to men who do not naturally understand them.. so it is hard for them to do.. if you do not naturally understand what most humans they have encountered would be expected to understand, having to explain things to you would require them first to research what it is that you do not understand and why.. explaining to you these naturally obvious things would be quite hard for them because they do not usually do this, it is also intimidating women as they avoid men who do not catch on easily.. it's like talking to Forest Gump on their part - most people just give up before even starting, and if they do explain it, while there is a reward of improved understanding in it for you, there is no reward in it for them for the work.

"So, from the fact that they don't bother communicating with me (whether hearing me out OR telling me their side)" - they may have been communicating with you through signals you do not understand such as smiling or lack thereof, body language, tone of voice, situational behavior, etc.. more likely, they saw you as a quiet and strange man and decided they do not like you enough, or they were not thinking of you in a sexual/romantic way at that point.. there are certain things about finding a mate that interest women, and if they don't think about them, they do not get sexual/romantic feelings or thoughts about that man.. us aspies happen to suck at many of those specifically the personable stuff that women look forward to, seek and expect.. that stuff makes me uncomfortable and I am not good at it and it makes me cringe actually.. also if they do not like you, they do not want to get into a deeper conversation with you, since that would associate them with someone they do not like even more.. but more likely they were neutral about you.. just saw you as a quiet and strange man, maybe a little weird.. or just an awkward shy guy..

"Why do they talk to their friends while avoiding talking to the men in question?" - aspies are honest, but NTs are not honest and often have evil harmful intent behind their words.. so women are afraid of men hurting them physically through a sexual pursuit.. which happens often.. apparently NT men often hurt women.. they also lie to women and set them up to get physically assaulted.. women do not trust men easily unless they can test the man through his emotions or his social status.. so women do not see you as you, (and you know you are a good person I assume, but they don't), so they see you as one of many men they do not trust and do not believe what the man says.. so talking to the men is dangerous in their mind, and you are one of these men.. if you had social status, your own emotions were the right kind at the time, had situational or emotional connection with them through speech or body language, or more of a social connection with the woman, then she would talk to you, but because you had none of these things, she did not.

If they talk to their friends, their friends can *guess* what went on in my head. If they talk to me, I can just *tell them*. " - they rarely if ever talk about what went on in the guy's head.. my impression is that women are very bad at understanding the male perspective actually and have very little interest in what men think.. they only pay attention to men's sexual drives, and how the men dress, behave, where they work, if they work out, if the man gets into a fight or jumps to save or defend a woman, or if a man is willing to fight for the woman.. women understand men's emotional drives, but they do not care about what the men think.. like I said, they take men at face value which is the overall look of the man both who he is in society and what his emotional drives are.. in this case, your emotional drive as an aspie may be negative and not exciting to the woman! And your though process is not natural for her to understand, only your emotional drive is.
Let's say you go fishing.. and then you talk to your friend about different types of fish you caught and released.. one was long and the other was small.. you are sharing your experience with the friend because you are obsessed with fish and love fishing.. however, you wouldn't talk to any of the fish one on one, because the fish have nothing interesting to say back to you.. and also you are interested in the characteristics of the fish and also fishing.. the reason she does not talk to you, is because the fish she caught is not her favorite.. if she caught a prize fish, she would have been grateful and kept it and took pictures with it.. but if it is not a desirable fish, she will not keep for a long time, she will throw it back in the water as soon as she gets it off the hook..

^ oh boy, no one would like my fish characteristics.

Are they blob-like?