Growing up and done with bad boys

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Embroglio
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19 Jun 2012, 4:42 pm

Women complain about dating as*holes yet think nice guys are wimps. Perhaps the guys who complain about women only dating as*holes need to take a look at themselves. Most of the guys who consider them selves "nice" are in reality p*****s. I used to consider myself to be a nice guy, and I was passive. Get shot down once and pout the whole night about it. Pout that women are dating as*holes all the time. Yet it's not so much as*holes they're dating as confident assertive guys. Women enjoy the chase just as much as men do. You can't play all your cards up front. You have to make them play too. Once I learned I've had a much easier time with women. Heck for the last month I've had a girl interested in me who I have no interest in dating. And despite making that clear she still pursues me. It's about being assertive, yet not obsessive over a girl.

Zinia
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19 Jun 2012, 4:43 pm

deltafunction wrote:

Kinme wrote:

Is it just for the challenge and satisfaction of changing the person? Is it some kind of twisted sexual thing?
Haha, I see who you're directing that at. :p

You want to be the one they will change for. It makes you feel special. Then you even go down to the emotionally abusive relationships, where the guy will apologize after he has done wrong, promise to change, and then do the same thing over again. Then it is hard for women to get out, because they want to believe him.

I agree with this cycle, but I don't know if it's from the woman wanting the guy to change, or her naivety to think that deep down inside, he's nice--like she is.

Kinme
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19 Jun 2012, 4:46 pm

deltafunction wrote:

Kinme wrote:

Is it just for the challenge and satisfaction of changing the person? Is it some kind of twisted sexual thing?
Haha, I see who you're directing that at. :p

Sadly, that sounds quite accurate, from the relationships I've observed.

TM
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19 Jun 2012, 4:46 pm

Kinme wrote:

TM wrote:

Kinme wrote:

TM wrote:

Kinme wrote:

TM wrote:

Zinia wrote:

TM wrote:

Usually the "type" people go for is rooted in needs they may not be aware they have. In women who tend to go for "bad boys" their unpredictable nature, tendency to behave arrogantly and so on tend to be like kryptonite to these women.

It wouldn't be the first woman who said she was done with bad boys only to end up with another string of them.

I think the allure of bad boys is that they tend to be very manipulative. Personally, I think bad boys go for considerate, generally honest girls who generally see the good in others. But once a girl realizes the signs of a manipulator, then she won't fall into that trap again.

Yeah, such a shame that they'll recognize the signs of a manipulator in one dude, the next guy doing the exact same thing, same procedure.

I feel that they're drawn to being treated like garbage because that's all they've known and it's what they're comfortable with. They get bored with being treated well and clung to by someone who genuinely cares, because they don't have to fight to keep the relationship going like they do with the bad boys. It's a push-pull sort of thing. Sure seems like the case, anyway.

Most definitely. Women are also drawn to arrogance and status, most bad boys are arrogant and a guy who is likely to stab someone to death over a spilled drink tends to gain a certain status.

Look at it this way, many of the qualities a lot of women are unconsciously attracted to, are traits that "bad boys" frequently have and which "nice guys" don't. However, the traits that are good for the woman tend to be the ones nice guys have. So its a paradox of sorts.

Sure is a paradox... Makes sense to me.

The part of it that makes me laugh is that a woman will often go for a bad boy in the hopes of "changing" the "bad boy" into a "nice guy" instead of just dating a nice guy. It's a central theme in many romance novels, the pirate, the outlaw or the "untamable buck" who is finally tamed by the lovely heroine after a literal roll in the hay.

Of course, the result is that if the man changes, she loses most attraction to him because she removed the very traits she liked. If he doesn't change, she ends up posting a thread like this on a web forum.

Is it just for the challenge and satisfaction of changing the person? Is it some kind of twisted sexual thing?
Haha, I see who you're directing that at. :p

Delta already summed it up fairly well, but I'll add a little to it. It's not a sexual thing, even though such things being twisted is a positive side-effect of such a relationship. However, there is a great deal of pride taken by a woman who makes a man change for her, even though she in the process tends to lose all respect and attraction for him.

rabbittss
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19 Jun 2012, 4:47 pm

Zinia wrote:

rabbittss wrote:

deltafunction wrote:

It makes me sad to hear nice guys want to be a**holes because they think they will attract women. These men are not an ideal in my mind...

Well considering the alternative seems to be to sit patiently and wait our turn.. Ya know.. let the alphas have whatever they want then we can fight over the rest when they get finished. i don't want some used up woman who's been around the block, had her fun, and now come looking for something stable since she's about to reach her sell buy date, no thanks. I'd rather be alone forever than get some douchebag's emotionally distraught, physically tepid leftovers.

See, now I don't understand this. To me, your ideas about women sound douche enough for you to have the whole lot of the "shiny" fresh ones, by your logic.

Maybe some women are attracted to bad boys because the bad boys don't seem to want to own them like objects, but paradoxically, the bad boys turn out to be the ones who, like you rabittss, view women like objects. Perhaps though--the bad boys are BETTER at tricking women into thinking they aren't like that.

Women just need to carefully screen against men who will treat them like objects--regardless of nice guy or bad guy persona.

I wasn't always the cynical, and heartless bastard I am today.

Kinme
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19 Jun 2012, 4:47 pm

Zinia wrote:

deltafunction wrote:

Kinme wrote:

Is it just for the challenge and satisfaction of changing the person? Is it some kind of twisted sexual thing?
Haha, I see who you're directing that at. :p

I agree with this cycle, but I don't know if it's from the woman wanting the guy to change, or her naivety to think that deep down inside, he's nice--like she is.

I believe it could also be that.

deltafunction
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19 Jun 2012, 4:50 pm

Zinia wrote:

deltafunction wrote:

Kinme wrote:

Is it just for the challenge and satisfaction of changing the person? Is it some kind of twisted sexual thing?
Haha, I see who you're directing that at. :p

I agree with this cycle, but I don't know if it's from the woman wanting the guy to change, or her naivety to think that deep down inside, he's nice--like she is.

True. I think for me, I thought they were nice deep down. I thought that they didn't mean to hurt me, but in reality, they were playing me like a fiddle. I don't think most women are as naive as I was back then, though. Then again...

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Kinme
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19 Jun 2012, 4:52 pm

deltafunction wrote:

Zinia wrote:

deltafunction wrote:

Kinme wrote:

Is it just for the challenge and satisfaction of changing the person? Is it some kind of twisted sexual thing?
Haha, I see who you're directing that at. :p

I agree with this cycle, but I don't know if it's from the woman wanting the guy to change, or her naivety to think that deep down inside, he's nice--like she is.

I'm pretty sure there are a ton of naive girls, guys as well. -.-... I hate watching them go through this kinda crap, too. I see it all too often with my friends and... on social networking websites, lol.

TM
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19 Jun 2012, 4:53 pm

Zinia wrote:

To be honest, he has a point. A woman's value falls if she's "easy" a man doesn't like to think that his girl has had more penises inside her than a urinal at Yankee stadium. Honestly, if you knew that your "new boyfriend" had nailed all kinds of dodgy strange up and down the east coast, that wouldn't affect your valuation of him?

Kinme
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19 Jun 2012, 4:56 pm

TM wrote:

Zinia wrote:

Would for me.

TM
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19 Jun 2012, 4:56 pm

Kinme wrote:

On the positive side, after enough rejection they're going to turn into me, a cynical as*hole and it will never happen to them again.

deltafunction
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19 Jun 2012, 4:56 pm

Kinme wrote:

deltafunction wrote:

Zinia wrote:

deltafunction wrote:

Kinme wrote:

Is it just for the challenge and satisfaction of changing the person? Is it some kind of twisted sexual thing?
Haha, I see who you're directing that at. :p

I agree with this cycle, but I don't know if it's from the woman wanting the guy to change, or her naivety to think that deep down inside, he's nice--like she is.

Yeah, I know what you mean... same here -_-

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Kinme
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19 Jun 2012, 4:58 pm

TM wrote:

Kinme wrote:

On the positive side, after enough rejection they're going to turn into me, a cynical as*hole and it will never happen to them again.

Do you at least give people a chance, though? You're on here helping out; you must not be that much of a butt.

rabbittss
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19 Jun 2012, 4:59 pm

Zinia wrote:

rabbittss wrote:

deltafunction wrote:

It makes me sad to hear nice guys want to be a**holes because they think they will attract women. These men are not an ideal in my mind...

That's another thing. You are assuming these are opinions I hold based on no evidence at all. I wouldn't have these opinions if I hadn't gathered observational, primary, and secondary data to support these ideas. I didn't USED to have these ideas, but after 14 years of basically getting overlooked by every girl I ever thought was cute for some chaw chewing jerkoff in a jackedup pickup truck.. only to wind up, surprise f*****g surprise, spewing out babies and living in a run down trailer park, or back at her momma's house after her loverboy knocked her up and then bolted.. I've kind of gotten over the whole sympathy for the devil thing.

Basically, since for the last 14 years I've not been dating, having meaningless sex, or cuddling watching movies.. I've had a hell of a lot of lonely weekends to ruminate on these ideas. My formerly nascent philosophy is now fully grown and ready to share.

Last edited by rabbittss on 19 Jun 2012, 5:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Kinme
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19 Jun 2012, 4:59 pm

deltafunction wrote:

Kinme wrote:

deltafunction wrote:

Zinia wrote:

deltafunction wrote:

Kinme wrote:

Is it just for the challenge and satisfaction of changing the person? Is it some kind of twisted sexual thing?
Haha, I see who you're directing that at. :p

I agree with this cycle, but I don't know if it's from the woman wanting the guy to change, or her naivety to think that deep down inside, he's nice--like she is.

Yeah, I know what you mean... same here -_-

And you tell them HUNDREDS of times that they're going to regret their decision. Oh, well, they did it anyway... and they regretted their decision. They come and apologize and say they'll listen to you. What a crock of crap that is- they're gonna wind up doing the same thing.

TM
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19 Jun 2012, 5:04 pm

Kinme wrote:

TM wrote:

Kinme wrote:

On the positive side, after enough rejection they're going to turn into me, a cynical as*hole and it will never happen to them again.

Do you at least give people a chance, though? You're on here helping out; you must not be that much of a butt.

I give people a chance, but I always keep in mind that people tend to mask and/or hide large parts of their emotions and inner monologue. My mental makeup is.... complicated.

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