When the friendship is just not enough

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Ive hear many women, NT and otherwise, express their outrage towards men who refuse an offer of platonic friendship on her behalf after she has turned him down romantically. So my question for the ladies is as follows: Why is it unreasonable for a guy who's been rejected by a woman to decline her offer of friendship and move on??? Don't women understand that NO ONE is obligated to be their friend any more than they are obligated to be someone's girlfriend if they don't want to?.........

Maybe I missed it, but I've not seen any outrage on the topic on this board.

In fact, I distinctly recall a female who was perfectly in favor of "ditching" the rejector without guilt or remorse - a position which I wholeheartedly concur with.

It's just too awkward when this happens to just forget about: it if I offer to "LJBF" someone I don't begrudge them not sticking around if they don't want to...

You're not obliged to be friends with anyone, but what annoys a lot of women is when a guy will spend ages pretending to be friends with her and then disappear when they finally ask her out and she says no.

It takes effort from both parties to build and maintain a friendship, so when one side is only using it as a means to get into the other's pants, of course the other person will feel insulted and angry.

There's a myth that girls have such a thing as a friends zone and once you get into it, you're stuck there. It's not 100% accurate, but it's a good way to think. If you want to go out with someone, ask them out . Don't hang around for weeks or months trying to pretend to be their friend and then act surprised and hurt when that's all they see you as.

I don't have a problem with refusing to stay friends with an ex or someone you just met; that's fair enough as you never let on that you wanted to be 'just friends' in the first place and it can be painful to be friends with a person you used to be much closer to.

Well said, Lene.

Bolded above, great remark. That actually makes a lot of sense, that by the very process that establishes comfort for many on the spectrum (especially males, from the discussions in this subforum) it sets up the expectation of friendship in the other person. I think that speaks again to how the dating process is perceived by many as the process of getting to know someone, in a romantic fashion, as opposed to a "next step" once that friendship is established, and that there is a perceived difference between the two processes. Agreed that the 'friend zone' is a myth, but that it seems likely that once someone has gone through getting to know another person in one way that they are not always willing to change their views. Reminds me of studies done regarding perceptions within families, and that other members of a familial or community unit tend to be the most resistant of change in other members - a black sheep is generally always seen as a black sheep, etc.


M.

I don't see any value in getting close to someone I wouldn't want to be my friend. Pretending to be someone's friend quite frankly seems like a stupid investment.
I never even moved up to intermediate finance, and that plan still makes me cringe.

This is very true. When this has happened to me in the past, I am left feeling as if I was the only one in the friendship. What he really had was an ulterior motive, not a friendship.

I do think this plays out strangely with AS and I am unclear why. When I first approached my now-husband and expressed interest, he was open to spending time with me. I then used the word "date" and he backed off saying he needed to "take some time with this idea". (He did, and subsequently emailed me back and we had our first "date" upon which we both agreed we had a semantics issue only). He initially said he would like to "spend time together socially as friends". I was taken aback at the "friends" word because I really thought there was attraction between us.

I know now that he was very interested in me also. But for some reason for him the process was: spend time as friends, progress to date. For me I had already categorized him as "date material" and to me it progresses from there.

I hadn't ever encountered this issue from a guy who WAS really interested in me. Normally if a guy is clear about "F-friend" word, he doesn't want to be closer to you.

I'm not sure it's so much the existence of a "zone" so much as the feeling that if somebody likes you as a person, they'll want to be friends. So if a guy expressed interest in a romantic relationship but then declines friendship, it seems as though all he was really interested in was sex. If he doesn't want a friendship, it can be hard to believe that he would have actually wanted a relationship.

I've got a question though. What about men who would of remained friends with the woman whether she rejects him or not, but just didn't ask her out initially out poor social skills? I've read quite a few posts by male Aspies in this sub-forum that say that they try to be friends first because they want to be with someone who they can be friends with as well. This also seems to happen to some NT men with poor social skills. This may be where the myth of a friends zone comes from. It seems like these men may be unwittingly setting up the expectation in the other person that they just want to be friends. Is it possible then, that if he tells her his feelings later on, that could destroy the friendship even if he doesn't want it to end? With the girl thinking that he's one of those men with ulterior motives like the ones you mentioned above?

QTF

Yes!! !!

This!! !

What she said!! !! !!

If a man decides that a non-romantic relationship with me is a waste of his time, then no relationship was ever possible! !! Somebody who can just walk away from you without so much as a backwards glance if you don't feel romantic towards him IS A JERK NOT A NICE GUY!! !

Maggiedoll nails it!!

Speaking for myself, I would not want to remain friends with someone after he expressed romantic interest in me that I do not return. I have had this situation a few times in my life.

Possibly because of my own temperament, or gender stuff, or NT stuff, I feel "heavy" with the guy's interest in me. Like, I have responsibility somehow for him and his feelings - - I can feel pressured by that. What if I stand too close to him? If I dress up when I see him is that inappropriate? Am I leading him on? Am I 'using' his affection for me if I ask him to the movies when I don't have a date? Too much pressure. I'd rather simply cut it loose. This might be hurtful in the short term but ultimately seems more compassionate for myself, and him.

If a man decides that a non-romantic relationship with me is a waste of his time, then no relationship was ever possible! !! Somebody who can just walk away from you without so much as a backwards glance if you don't feel romantic towards him IS A JERK NOT A NICE GUY!! !


...and this is well said as well. Why don't men who want real relationships realize that a friendship is essential for the relationship to last ?

I'm female and I would behave that way. I wouldn't do it to be a jerk, but I don't want to be hanging around friends with a guy who isn't interested romantically in me. That would be really hurtful for me, and I think it's hurtful for guys to care about someone and have it unrequited in that way. And I surely don't want a guy hanging around "friendly" who I am not interested in. For me, sexual interest is completely separate from friendship. If I'm sexually/romantically attracted to someone, they are in a different category.

Hm, I guess I maybe for me there is a "zone" finally.

Yes. I am of course speaking from annoyed experience. Back when I was in college, some jerk actually did this to me. He was super friendly, fun to be with, we hung out. But I did not fall in love with him. The fact is, lots of men are fun and friendly and great to hang out with but falling in love with with every single man who is nice to me is an unreasonable expectation. Mother Nature/evolution did not wire women to fall in love with literally every nice man who crosses our path. And with good reason. Falling in love with 1 or perhaps 2 or 3 over the course of a lifetime is my wiring. And all genuinely nice men have been fine with that. A genuinely nice guy doesn't drop you like yesterday's newspaper if his "friendship" doesn't result in you falling in love with him. Other men remained friends with me while pursuing other women.

But not this guy. Overnight I ceased to exist to him. Because I had failed to fall in love with him as expected despite liking him as a person (because I didn't know what kind of person he really was), he washed his hands of me and ended what I had thought was a friendship but was actually a cynical bid to get into my pants that just didn't work out for him.

Jerk

Sorry, am confused as that seems to be repeating what I said - that the friend zone is a myth, and that there are differences in how those who see dating as the next step in a friendship vs. those who see dating as the process of establishing that friendship. I'm in complete agreement with the idea that if someone only wanted to be in a romantic relationship with me, yet would not accept friendship if that was the option offered, isn't really a sincere friend to begin with. So... again, my apologies but I'm not sure how our two comments differ at all.


M.