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AntoniusBlock
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28 Sep 2010, 2:06 pm

Hi there,

my problem with smalltalk seems to be that often, i don't know what to ask next, for me everything important seems to be said in the conversation already. I know that it would be better to talk about the apparently unimportant things, because indirectly it has alot of meaning, it says, hi i am interesting in you, i care for you.

My explaination for our deficit in doing small talk is, that we are used to filter things out, which usually are unimportant, but in smalltalk they aren't. I wonder how we can learn to not filter the unimportant things out....?



Cate
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28 Sep 2010, 2:44 pm

It's nearly impossible since small talk (or as I refer to it, "phatic conversation") has no utilitarian function.

I know of it described, that for people like us, language is understood as a tool for exchanging useful information. The problem with small talk is that from our standpoint, blabbing about unimportant information, or information which is not explicitly and practically useful, has no purpose.

Yes, logically, I think we all understand that small talk has a purpose, that being somewhere in the social sphere (don't ask me where – I am completely in the dark in this sort of thing).

I think your observation that small talk serves to show interest and care in the other person is probably also very true. I simply find it would be much more direct and efficient to simply state, "I care about you and am interested in you" rather than to do the whole alien song and dance accompanying the interaction.

Which is why, in most cases, this is exactly what I do. I say, "I find you interesting. Talk to me for a while about yourself." Unfortunately, this usually leads to a song and dance involving the words, "what do you want me to talk about?" but eventually the point may be taken and the person may begin an induced soliloquy.

This means success, on my part...but not success in terms of small talk, since what I am accomplishing is an exchange of useful information rather than the development of some invisible and mysterious bond normally reinforced through small talk.

What a tangle!



sluice
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28 Sep 2010, 8:36 pm

Talk about what you know. I like sports, I can talk fairly easily about it. You're are not trying to win an argument or tell them about all the boring facts to show how smart you are. Say "Hey, did you see the (insert favorite local team) game yesterday?" Then talk about them possibly winning the title or stinking up the place or whatever. You can do the same thing with music or a movie. If you hit it off, then you can ask if they have seen 'X' yet, that is related to what you just talked about. You can then invite them to come along with you to see it with you if they want to the next time you go. Try to get a commitment for a specific time from them. If they are non committal, then you have an easy out of saying "maybe next time then" and act like it is no skin off your nose.

At least that is how it used to work in principle. I don't really practice it much these days.



Bluefins
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28 Sep 2010, 8:55 pm

sluice wrote:
skin off your nose.
Aaah! Watch your metaphors. *cradles nose*



Hector
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28 Sep 2010, 10:40 pm

Cate wrote:
It's nearly impossible since small talk (or as I refer to it, "phatic conversation") has no utilitarian function.

I know of it described, that for people like us, language is understood as a tool for exchanging useful information. The problem with small talk is that from our standpoint, blabbing about unimportant information, or information which is not explicitly and practically useful, has no purpose.

Yes, logically, I think we all understand that small talk has a purpose, that being somewhere in the social sphere (don't ask me where – I am completely in the dark in this sort of thing).

The most common misconception around these parts is that the purpose of communication is to exchange information. You seem to realise this is a mistake, at least. People often speak to each-other in order to establish connections, and make themselves more comfortable with themselves and their surroundings. If you end a conversation abruptly, because there is nothing more to say, it often serves as something of an affront to the other person's efforts to try to connect with you. The implication is that if you don't want to continue the conversation, you must not be interested in them.
Cate wrote:
I think your observation that small talk serves to show interest and care in the other person is probably also very true. I simply find it would be much more direct and efficient to simply state, "I care about you and am interested in you" rather than to do the whole alien song and dance accompanying the interaction.

This is not sufficient. People are naturally suspicious of strangers, and often only slightly less suspicious of near-strangers. They don't know why someone they don't know would "open up" to them, and would question either their sincerity or their motivation for doing so.
Cate wrote:
Which is why, in most cases, this is exactly what I do. I say, "I find you interesting. Talk to me for a while about yourself." Unfortunately, this usually leads to a song and dance involving the words, "what do you want me to talk about?" but eventually the point may be taken and the person may begin an induced soliloquy.

This means success, on my part...but not success in terms of small talk, since what I am accomplishing is an exchange of useful information rather than the development of some invisible and mysterious bond normally reinforced through small talk.

What a tangle!

I think this is an OK strategy actually, except for the very beginning: people like to talk about themselves, but where to start? I'm not that great at starting conversations, but I think it's very common and normal to start with a question pertaining to a situation which both of you are in. For example, you may ask a stranger at a party how they came to be there. Or ask a new student what brought them to this course.

Another important lesson I learned, somewhat pertaining to this "exchange of information" business, was when I was being examined by a team of psychology students. I was filmed having a conversation with one of their students: I started out by asking about her studies, found she had some interest in psychoanalysis, which followed with my asking a series of related questions on the relationship of psychoanalysis to psychology as a science. She didn't feel qualified to answer, but didn't want to admit it, and was visibly uncomfortable. Since then, I've tried to emphasise my own level of ignorance when asking students (or even professionals) about the work they do, to keep from appearing like I'm judging them for what they say. Maybe it's not something you do in particular, but this is just a remark for everyone out there.
AntoniusBlock wrote:
Hi there,

my problem with smalltalk seems to be that often, i don't know what to ask next, for me everything important seems to be said in the conversation already. I know that it would be better to talk about the apparently unimportant things, because indirectly it has alot of meaning, it says, hi i am interesting in you, i care for you.

My explaination for our deficit in doing small talk is, that we are used to filter things out, which usually are unimportant, but in smalltalk they aren't. I wonder how we can learn to not filter the unimportant things out....?

I guess by "filter things out" you mean filtering out what you regard as unimportant information. Conversations have to be treated a bit more actively than that: every detail someone has just said should be put in working memory, and used to make either a general or specific question about them, or an observation that you relate to their experiences. Rather than just being, at best, some new information.



daspie
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28 Sep 2010, 10:54 pm

Learn the "language rules" to know how to filter out important information from the unimprotant.
http://www.wrongplanet.net/forum-posting.html