Friend Zone

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There is a girl I met in college and became very close friends with. She was in a relationship when we met, and has been in a few more sense then. We have became very close friends. We feel like we can trust each other with anything. We enjoy spending time together and constantly making silly jokes, usually at each others' expense. She has been helping me out with some things while I've been struggling, and I do what I can to help her. I seem to be the first person she goes to when she needs to talk about something or needs advice, unless she's in a relationship and feels she's obligated to go to her partner for emotional support. We just seem to really click as friends. When we met I was attracted to her, and though she won't admit to it, she has let slip that that she did find me attractive. But we didn't start hanging out because we were dating or trying to establish a relationship; we were just growing organically into very close friends.
I would marry her based on our friendship. I see physically attractive women everyday, but I never think about them seriously if I don't feel some kind of connection. I feel that me and her have something special that isn't related to simple sexual attraction. The problem is that she seems to have this idea that friendship and romance are an "either/or" dellima, and once someone is established as a friend, he is no longer a suitable candidate for a romantic partner. Basically I've been permanently assigned to the friend zone.
So now what? Apparently we're both supposed to return to the Purgatory of dating, where we search for someone we're attracted to on the basis of the most superficial qualifications, and proceed to distort our self-images to fit these individuals. Now, because that girl has my preferred bust size, which makes my id want to bang her, I strive to convince myself why she is now the best friend I ever had, and how I did always prefer LotR to ST my entire life (even though I was the hardest of hardcore Trekies up until we met) simply because its what she prefers, and how that means we just must have been made by the Gods for no other purpose to find each other and spend the rest of lives having amazing sex.
I really do feel that this girl is worth waiting for, but will I just be wasting my time? Will I wait and miss out of other opportunities to have her run off with someone else in the end anyway?

This sound's really familiar, except the girl I was friends with was never in a relationship. I'm gonna tell u straight up, there are a lot of pretty girls out there that you can date. But very few people that you will ever be able to consider best friends. Dates come and go but really good friends can last a lifetime. While u may think you're perfect for each other now things change and people change. I told my friend how I felt and it didn't work out. We still remained best friends and it was tough for a while but now I'm really glad she said no because she is such a good friend we do everything together. We don't have to date, we're happy with the way things are. Now I can still go out with anyone I want and still have my best friend. If you think it's worth the chance and if being in a relationship with her is what you really want than go for it. But you are risking the loss of the best friend you ever had. If she says no or if you guys go out and break up things aren't gonna go back to where they used to be.

No bites? Anyone?

Sorry Seems like a tough situation and I don't think I could offer any helpful advice.

I don't usually think about the whole friend zone thing (not denying its existence, though), I just try being the best I can for a partner.

Can someone explain to me what the female perspective on this is? Why do women have such a rigid "either/or" mentality when it comes to friendships and relationships?

I don't know, why do men insist on turning a working friendship into "something more"? Why can't they be satisfied with a relationship that's already been established as pretty good?

I used to think the best relationship is the one that started out as friendship, but now that I think about it, if I ever want to go out with someone I'd probably do it with someone I barely know. Good friends are hard to find, and I'm not really interested in marriage for our lack of compatibility to be a problem. (And since a semi-permanent relationship isn't in my future, then what the hey--I'd probably pick a supposed jerk over a self-identified nice guy, too. )

Seriously everyone, which of the two-opinions do you think is completely rational, and which is total BS?

You can't generalise, it depends on lots of things. Is there sexual tension? are you attracted to them really (not just as anyone to have a relationship with)? is it worth losing the relationship over if things go wrong? If the answer is yes- go for it. If no, to any of them, don't.

Sorry, I'm not trying to generalize. I accept that there are exceptions, and I've even occasionally seen them, albeit rarely. But is my simple observation that most women think this way, and to honest, it drives me up the wall.
I don't see it as risking anything, because if there is potential for things to go badly, they will even if we remain just friends. To me, getting married, having a family, and growing old together, is the natural evolution of a strong friendship.
People need to think about marriage as being about friendship and mutual trust and respect, not about who is more exciting in the short term. I worked in a retirement home's dining room over the summer,and there was a couple who have been together sense they met serving in WWII. The husband would push his wife's wheelchair to the dining room and help her get her food and situated at the table. On the days she couldn't come out with him, he'd come and carry her food back to their room. Just seeing them together, its obvious that they are truly in love with each other, even after more than 50 years. And I don't mean the fake love that's a bunch of pheromones floats around in their brains (that would have worn gone away before I was even born), but true soul mates. Now does anyone honestly believe that they would still be together, had they hooked up for the grossly superficial reasons that most people get married for these days?
And people wonder why the divorce rate is so high.

I know before you thought i was picking the quick and exciting relationship over a good friend.
but actually it's the opposite, and i did struggle with it to begin with.
every relationship before this one has been with the 'bad-boy', for the exciting rush of it.
but i decided to give the 'nice-guy' a chance, and it's incredible. I mean, we actually connect on every level -instead of just superficially.

There was a point in there, but i forgot what it was.

" A woman has a close male friend. This means that he is probably interested in her, which is why he hangs around so much. She sees him strictly as a friend. This always starts out with, you're a great guy, but I don't like you in that way. This is roughly the equivalent for the guy of going to a job interview and the company saying, You have a great resume, you have all the qualifications we are looking for, but we're not going to hire you. We will, however, use your resume as the basis for comparison for all other applicants. But, we're going to hire somebody who is far less qualified and is probably an alcoholic. And if he doesn't work out, we'll hire somebody else, but still not you. In fact, we will never hire you. But we will call you from time to time to complain about the person that we hired."

i found this nihilistic little article. it cheered me up a bit. might work for yourself

Nothing wrong with that. I'd rather hang out and associate with good looking men/women than drunk fat slobs of either gender. However, because there is physical attraction doesn't mean there is going to be an emotional or mental connection.



Enjoy the friends zone. It's her decision (e.g. I like visiting XYZ but it's not somewhere I could see myself retiring to) and there are many ways to rationalize it:

1. I like her too much to jeopardize the relationship (wimpy way out)
2. She's wrong and I'm going to convince her why (alpha male)
3. I'll show her what she's missing out on and turn her around (manipulative bastard)
etc.

Brow beating and/or manipulation takes effort I prefer not to make at this time. If I (you, me, readers, no one) am "all that" and backed with the self-confidence to solidify that opinion, then she'll figure it out. However, you must recognize that even though some guys prefer woman who are tall-skinny (me), others prefer DD's. She'll have her own opinion and tastes.

So figure out what your personality is, your threshold for pain and your willingness to undertake the risk(s) which may ultimately destroy your friendship. If you're willing to risk everything including losing her, it's much different than someone who values their friendship too much and different tactics must be used.

Why does the friend zone have to be permanent?

Certainly one can improve oneself enough to be suitable for their prospective partner?

That's what I've been thinking. I just don't know if that can happen or not.

Yeah, I was being a jerk. Your OP wasn't entirely clear, but I made things bad by projecting my personal frustrations onto it and not bothering to read following posts. And I was overly melodramatic, especially with what I said about curing females. Really, all I was thinking about is that most women seem to have a misguided perspective on relationships, but I blew it out of proportion. For that I owe you and the other ladies my apologies.

Sheesh, who said Aspies don't have emotions. We have more difficulty managing and communicating them, but when they come out, they really come out.