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lostD
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14 Feb 2011, 2:14 am

Good morning (since it's the morning for me, change the word if it's the afternoon or the evening or the night).

I have had this talk about love with a friend yesterday; it is not the first time we struggle to truly understand what it could mean. For now, we guess it is some kind of sexual desire or at least and sensitivity to the attractiveness (physical or intellectual) of the person and a strong attachment that alter the brain one's brain work.

In this case, it would be nothing like what we can hear in songs and what most people say about it, which, to us, sounds mostly like myths used to justify the human instinct (reproduction, pleasure and perhaps exclusive socialbilty) or a cultural view of an natural behaviour.

I have also read somewhere that love cannot survive if it is not reciprocal because loving require being love, it is something people need to truly appreciate someone and they are not supposed to love someone who hate them unless they are in some kind of delusion about their story. Not sure about it.

Bear in mind that I do not know how asexual people are attracted to others which makes the question more difficult to answer and analyse.

I do not consider myself to have truly fallen in love though I once felt a strong attraction to someone which eventually lead to altering my state and making me consider her defects as charming but I was not blind by love and was conscious of being in a different state as well as I knew it would eventually die so I do not agree with the common thought that love makes one blind.

So, I am wondering, what does it clearly mean to be in love or to love ? I do not think it is all about heart beating and shivering when someone is close to you, nor do I agree with my grandmother who claims that one is in love everytime they are attracted to someone.



emlion
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14 Feb 2011, 7:19 am

for me love is having someone you can depend on, no matter what.
and that works both ways, obviously.



Moog
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14 Feb 2011, 7:27 am

lostD wrote:
In this case, it would be nothing like what we can hear in songs and what most people say about it, which, to us, sounds mostly like myths used to justify the human instinct (reproduction, pleasure and perhaps exclusive socialbilty) or a cultural view of an natural behaviour.


It's not mythic, that kind of love the songs talk about. In my experience it's quite rare, and those feelings abate.

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Bear in mind that I do not know how asexual people are attracted to others which makes the question more difficult to answer and analyse.


I don't either. If a person is asexual, then they may well not feel the kind of love that is alluded to in the songs.

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I do not consider myself to have truly fallen in love though I once felt a strong attraction to someone which eventually lead to altering my state and making me consider her defects as charming but I was not blind by love and was conscious of being in a different state as well as I knew it would eventually die so I do not agree with the common thought that love makes one blind.


People do do very very stupid things over love. If you are personally immune to that, well good!

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So, I am wondering, what does it clearly mean to be in love or to love ? I do not think it is all about heart beating and shivering when someone is close to you, nor do I agree with my grandmother who claims that one is in love everytime they are attracted to someone.


The problem with the word love is that it means a whole bunch of different things.


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roadGames
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14 Feb 2011, 7:42 am

It's impossible to describe, but you'll know it when you feel it.



leejosepho
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14 Feb 2011, 7:59 am

Old fogey view and personal experience:

lostD wrote:
For now, we guess it is some kind of sexual desire or at least and sensitivity to the attractiveness (physical or intellectual) of the person and a strong attachment that alter the brain one's brain work.

That is simple attraction with whatever in mind.

lostD wrote:
I have also read somewhere that love cannot survive if it is not reciprocal because loving require being love ...

Yes. True love is the *action* of placing and practicing the welfare of someone else at least equal with one's own.

lostD wrote:
Bear in mind that I do not know how asexual people are attracted to others ...

Anyone can be attracted to someone else for simple companionship, and true love can be embraced and practiced even without sex.

lostD wrote:
I do not think it is all about heart beating and shivering when someone is close to you ...

Icing on the cake!

lostD wrote:
... nor do I agree with my grandmother who claims that one is in love everytime they are attracted to someone.

I would be inclined to agree with you. However, maybe she only means to be saying that particular attraction actually could take a turn *into* true love.


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wefunction
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14 Feb 2011, 8:50 am

Love is something you do, not something you feel. What you feel is affection. What you do is love. Why you do it is devotion. Those are my thoughts about what love means.



Tias
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AKindOfJareth
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14 Feb 2011, 10:20 am

I think many of the definitions I frequently hear are conditional, and thus to me can not be true love. If you have to liken it to something else, I think true love is most like extreme artistic appreciation: when you hear a song you love, or see a work of art that seems to you the most beautiful thing in the world, the emotion it produces in you is instinctual and thoughtless, and furthermore it does not require that the painting or song love you. I met a girl once many years ago, whose soul was so beautiful it seemed to me that it was impossible for any conscious being not to love her, and I did. I am not blind to her human flaws, and my love has remained unrequited for nearly a decade, and probably will be so forever. Even so my love for her has never wavered; I would do anything to serve her well being at any cost to myself, and not because of some psychological void or need, but because of an innate desire to serve and protect what is true, good, and beautiful in this world. To clarify, I'm not saying that it would be right to let her walk all over me; doing so without protest would be a disservice to both myself and (importantly) her as well.



lostD
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14 Feb 2011, 11:58 am

leejosepho wrote:
lostD wrote:
... nor do I agree with my grandmother who claims that one is in love everytime they are attracted to someone.

I would be inclined to agree with you. However, maybe she only means to be saying that particular attraction actually could take a turn *into* true love.


No, she definitely meant that "I am in love" means "I am attracted to", I had a long debate about that with her. She seems to think that love is mostly about finding someone who seems to fulfil our needs. She needed to feel love when she was younger because of her personal history and she believes this is why she ended up with my grandfather who probably loved her more than she did. My aunt, on the other hand, always had been with depressive men because she need to take care of people so she is attracted to those who may need her.

I feel very concerned about the well being of my close friends (ok, there's only two of them but that's enough to me) and I tend to serve them, I would wish no misfortune to happen to them and probably could sacrifice myself if they were in real danger so I do not think this kind of thing is only linked to romantic love which is why it is so confusing to me.

The wikipedia page does nothing to help, really.

I guess I would agree with wefunction because I have always felt that love was just mostly describing what you do, I do not mean "make love" but building the relationship, it's not something the feelings can do, the feelings will depend on what you do (even though they may die).



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14 Feb 2011, 12:02 pm

It depends on the person, from what I've seen. To me, it's when you have dealt with the person's worst, but still want them around for their best. Take my husband for instance. I melt down on a regular basis, I have habits that make him cringe, and I do things that sometimes drive him nuts, but he still snuggles up with me on the couch when we watch movies because when I am somewhat normal, he somehow thinks I'm the best person in the world.
To my friend, a mining engineer who is a diagnosed aspie, love is staying up all night to finish a paper for class. Yes, she did tell her Soviet studies professor this, and it was the best response to his question on what love and romance are. He still facepalmed, however.



emlion
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14 Feb 2011, 12:04 pm

Quote:
To me, it's when you have dealt with the person's worst, but still want them around for their best.


I love this.



TheWeirdPig
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14 Feb 2011, 1:58 pm

lostD wrote:
Good morning (since it's the morning for me, change the word if it's the afternoon or the evening or the night).

I have had this talk about love with a friend yesterday; it is not the first time we struggle to truly understand what it could mean. For now, we guess it is some kind of sexual desire or at least and sensitivity to the attractiveness (physical or intellectual) of the person and a strong attachment that alter the brain one's brain work.

In this case, it would be nothing like what we can hear in songs and what most people say about it, which, to us, sounds mostly like myths used to justify the human instinct (reproduction, pleasure and perhaps exclusive socialbilty) or a cultural view of an natural behaviour.

I have also read somewhere that love cannot survive if it is not reciprocal because loving require being love, it is something people need to truly appreciate someone and they are not supposed to love someone who hate them unless they are in some kind of delusion about their story. Not sure about it.

Bear in mind that I do not know how asexual people are attracted to others which makes the question more difficult to answer and analyse.

I do not consider myself to have truly fallen in love though I once felt a strong attraction to someone which eventually lead to altering my state and making me consider her defects as charming but I was not blind by love and was conscious of being in a different state as well as I knew it would eventually die so I do not agree with the common thought that love makes one blind.

So, I am wondering, what does it clearly mean to be in love or to love ? I do not think it is all about heart beating and shivering when someone is close to you, nor do I agree with my grandmother who claims that one is in love everytime they are attracted to someone.


To be in love means to have lust, attraction (usually both physical and psychological), and attachment to someone.

To love someone is to stick it out when you no longer feel lust, attraction, and attachment.



Asp-Z
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14 Feb 2011, 2:57 pm

Urban Dictionary wrote:
love: nature's way of tricking people into reproducing


I'm inclined to agree with that definition.



Aspocrat
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14 Feb 2011, 3:56 pm

Love is when you'd take a bullet for someone and sail the seven seas to protect them.



DeusMechanicus
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14 Feb 2011, 3:58 pm

Do not confuse the concept of 'love' - [it is only a concept] with lust.
Lust is derived from the desire to procreate and is inherent within our genetics. The emotional attachment associated with lust is not superficial but it is just as arbitrary. It is not useful to think of it as anything else.
‘Love’ is unconditional and complete altruism which may be directed at an individual or a group and does not require the presence of lust to validate it.
It is possible to experience both lust and love but this is a rare phenomenon and not commonly recognised because it is not commonly understood.



AKindOfJareth
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14 Feb 2011, 4:40 pm

DeusMechanicus wrote:
‘Love’ is unconditional and complete altruism which may be directed at an individual or a group and does not require the presence of lust to validate it.

+1