Broken Relationship

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I don't know if I just need to vent to people who may understand, but I do know that I need a solution. Maybe someone on here can offer me one if you'd be so kind. I'll try to make this post as short as possible.

My partner doesn't understand why I behave the way I do. He means a lot to me. Any NT person would have cut their losses by now, but I'm not NT and I do not enjoy change. I need to fix my relationship because I am incapable of leaving him. And while I realize most people would tell me that's not an acceptable reason to stay with someone, if anyone will understand it's you guys. So please bear with me and try to help me because I'm miserable.

He knows I have autism but has made no effort to research it. I wish he would but don't feel comfortable responding to the issues he has with me by telling him it's part of having autism. It feels like a cop out and I'm sure he would see it that way as well.

He is very hostile and aggressive. When he gets angry at me he calls me names and says the most horrible things. He tells me he doesn't mean it, that he's just angry, but as a result of hearing things like, "You're stupid" or "what's wrong with you?" "You ruin everything" and many others I cant say without cursing, my self esteem has plummeted to less than zero. He doesn't understand why it effects me the way it does. After all he tells me that he didn't mean it. I just don't understand how it is possible to call someone a name without first thinking it is true. Some of the things he says could not have just come out of nowhere. If you say it it means you've thought it and no matter what he says after our fights I believe he meant every word he spitted at me.

To make matters worse, we have sex maybe twice a year. I'm attractive and I know it, but I still can't help but think it's because he doesn't find me desirable. It makes me feel like a failure as a women. He watches a lot of porn (just about every night) and I just can't get over the fact he'd rather get the job done himself instead of having sex with me. (who used to beg for it but after a couple nasty fights where he told me how unattractive that was I put an end to the begging.)

I constantly annoy him with my over speculation and since I can't read him I do not realize how annoyed he is getting. Instead of being direct with me about it, he gets fed up and starts yelling at me for something completely unrelated. I have told him to just TELL ME so I can shut up, but apparently he is incapable of doing so.

Several years ago, in the beginning of our relationship, I was so confidant and happy. I feel like the shadow of the woman I used to be, and he feels it too. He yells at me for being sad all the time, if I cry he gets very aggressive because he thinks I'm trying to make him out to be the bad guy and I refuse to take responsibility for the things I've done. I'm constantly watching everything I say and do so I don't upset him. But that in itself upsets him. I am just at a loss of what to do anymore. He recently found my list of rules. They are rules I live by every day to help me not do something that will upset him. "Don't talk to him when he firsts wakes up." "Don't talk to him when he first gets home from work." "Don't show any sign of weakness." "Don't talk about shared interests in detail (Because if I go on and on about something we're both interested in and share my research he will accuse me of ruining that particular interest for him.)" "Don't put anything in the recycling bin instead, just take it directly outside." There's a lot more but that's just to give you an idea. He we so hurt by this list, and I can't for the life of me figure out why! He should be pleased I'm going to such effort for him. Instead he claims I hate him. Why would I try so hard if I hated him? Why can't he just see that.

There are so many broken pieces in this relationship I can't even fathom how to fix them all. Any advice is welcome. Please don't tell me to leave him though. I haven't shared all the gory details, but what I have shared doesn't even come close to the worst of it. If I could leave him I would. But I love him and am too loyal and too opposed to change to leave. I just CAN'T. Please accept that.

Thanks for reading this if you got to the end. It makes me feel better just to know that some of you may understand what I'm going through.

I'm not sure what exactly you want us to tell you. You're willing to consider every possible option, other than the correct one? Why even bother doing anything? I obviously can't force you to do anything, but I will say this: Enjoy your Stockholm Syndrome; it's the only way you'll get anything positive out of this (in your own words) broken relationship.

It sounds like you are in a abusive relationship and he won't make the effort to understand you and won't bother to read about autism. If he has no intention f changing, you should leave him. It's better to be alone than being in a abusive relationship. And based on what you wrote, I don't think he will change.

It seems to me that you need to find a relationship therapist. The problems you describe sound like the sort of thing that comes from a long degeneration of the relationship caused by many little problems. This can make the solution very hard to find. A therapist who is familiar with the kinds of ways relationships can degenerate may be able to spot where the problems are coming from.

While it can be useful to ask questions on this forum, it can be difficult to diagnose a problem when we only can see it from your perspective. This difficulty can be compounded if you, like most Aspies, have difficulty understanding and explaining NT behavior. But someone who can see both sides of the story and see both of you interacting is likely to better understand the dynamics of your relationship.

My reaction to what you describe of your relationship is that it seems like both of you may have unrealistic expectations of a relationship and yet are not able or willing to reach out and communicate honestly. Honest communication can be extremely difficult, especially when you are anxious.

One of the things that comes across in your writing; you seem to be forcing yourself to be submissive. You have written a set of rules that YOU must obey to make things work. What about him? Shouldn't he be trying to meet you half way? Perhaps the reason why he became angry when he found your list of rules is that it makes no demands on him. It places no expectation of him being a better person on him.

This may seem counter intuitive but many people will tend to live up to the level of your expectations of them. If you expect this guy to be a jerk and to treat you badly, he may find your expectations offensive and treat you the way the way you expect him to. But if you demand that he be a better person,... If you assume that he can be a better person, he may accept the challenge and live up to those expectations.

Any relationship is a negotiation between both sides. If you think he can't change and be a better person, then your best option is to get out now. Waiting will only make it worse later. If you believe he can be better, stand up for yourself and don't accept ill treatment.

I think a relationship counceler is your best option, but short of that, demanding that he treat you honorably may actually work. If those options are not possible, then get out of the relationship immediately.

Good luck.

Last edited by jagatai on 25 Nov 2013, 11:51 am, edited 1 time in total.

Speaking as an NT, this sounds like abuse.

NO ONE should be calling you names, regardless of what you've done or haven't done.

Though, there is a possibility that he WANTS *YOU* to break it off with him, without being the one to do so. I can't wrap my head around how anyone can be so chicken s**t, but I have seen this in the past with NT/NT relationships--man treats woman as badly as possible so she breaks up with him, and then he looks like the victim.

Regardless of all of this, if you can get counseling, GO! Eff this dude. You are worth more than that.

**edit--You know what, nix that one paragraph about him wanting you to break up with him. I just re-read your post and saw the bit about your list. He IS an abuser. Get out while you still can.

I had a list I kept in my head on how to deal with my stepfather when certain things were going on. When to be on guard, when not to be, etc. THIS IS ABUSE.

I am sorry, I cannot comply with your request.

You are in a textbook abusive relationship. I wouldn't be surprised if the parts you left out involve physical violence. He is exploiting your loyalty and your fear of change, that's what all abusive guys do. You will not change him, you will not fix him. That's what these guys pray on, those instincts. Sure, sometimes he might give you enough to make you think he's changing, but he's not. He knows you won't leave him.

You can leave him. You need to overcome your fear of change, and understand that no one who abuses you is worth your loyalty.

As long as you stay with him, you will be abused. It's that black and white. If you need help, reach out to the police, or a woman's shelter, but you need to get out before you end up in a body bag.

I concur with everyone that says you need to get out of this relationship. It is abusive. If I have learned anything about my experience, and I am seeing it in the experience you describe as well... if the other refuses to understand what makes you who you are, they don't respect you.

Let me first say that this is all just my opinion. I don't truly know your relationship, I only have suggestions. I may have everything wrong.

This is the first problem. You perceive your autism and the issues you have from it, as 'a cop out'. If there's one thing I've learned from the internet, it's that the way you present something can matter more than what the thing is. If you only bring up your autism during or after a fight, it will become something that gets lorded over him, a way for you to be like 'can't get mad at me, not my fault' every time. And if, when you choose to talk about your autism with him, you yourself feel like it's a cop out, there's no way he won't also perceive that it's a cop out, not if all that he knows about autism is what you tell him. Your very word choice that you would only bring up your autism by "response" is why bringing it up makes you uncomfortable. If you can bring it up in a controlled way, where anger and shame are going be minimal (ie: a situation where emotions aren't deep, not in a fight or a situation that usually sparks a fight), to truly talk about it as adults, that'll do you both a world of good. And do this a lot, multiple times, not just once and then expect him to understand. Relationships constantly need communication.
Yes, he should bother to learn about autism too, but I'm giving you advice, not him. Besides which, even if he read up a ton about autism on his own, that won't help him in learning YOU specifically. You're still an individual with their own unique identity, there's only so much he can learn about your particular issues from articles about a condition you have.



I have a hard time believing that he doesn't see how his verbal abuse, fueled by anger, is affecting you so poorly. But again, I can't give advice to him, only to you. Of course he meant it when he said it, most of us don't spew words randomly. But when he tells you afterwards that he didn't mean it is really his way of saying 'I don't think that way of you now or most of the time, I wish I hadn't said those things, because I know it hurts when I say them, and I don't want you to be hurt now, or most of the time.' Think about when you're angry at someone, don't you think ill of them even though you usually don't? That's what anger does. I'm not going to say your too sensitive, but it does seem like you dwell on what's said in anger as if it were the general feelings he has about you. But that's not true. You're focussing on the bad, probably ignoring the good. (See, you've not mentioned anything good about the relationship, so I'm left to assume that there IS good that you're pushing out of your thoughts, because most relationships have good in them too.)



I'm not sure I've ever heard of such a dysfunctional sex life so full of miscommunication ever (not that I hear a lot about people's sex lives.) Him being turned off by having to beg you for sex isn't his fault, and he should let you know that he doesn't like feeling that he has to do that in order to have sex. (albeit not in a fight would have been a good way to let you know.) I still don't really know if you miss the sex for sex's sake and for the chance to get to bond with him, or if you're only missing the self-esteem boost it gives you. Since you haven't said that you dislike sex, I'm assuming that you truly do miss it for it's own sake as well. He watches porn because you've made yourself sexually unapproachable to him. He feels like he can't have sex with you and that's why he's turned to porn. This of course is likely tied in strongly with all the other problems you as a couple have, but when was the last time YOU initiated sex? When he used to beg you for sex, did he try to get you into the mood at all or did he just kinda, well, ask you for it? Did you ever tell him what he could do differently, back when he used to beg, to turn you on so he wouldn't need to beg? Why don't you approach him tonight, when he's looking at porn, and initiate something with him?
Yours isn't the only self-esteem that's taking a hit when you don't have sex, his definitely is. Especially if he feels like he could only beg you for sex earlier on in your relationship too. You're not making him feel wanted anymore than he's making you feel wanted. Which is just dumb because you're both still in this relationship and probably both still want each other!



Talking about autism and how it applies to you should help this. But you need to initiate the conversation.



Sounds to me like it's a list about you hating him and being scared by him. This list is entirely about what NOT to do where most of the items on it are 'Don't talk to him'. I know you're on the spectrum, but surely you understand that a list that primarily involves you staying away from him emotionally makes it look like you hate him? It makes you look like you are purposefully trying to withhold who you are from him. The bullets from that list that you've chosen to share here (minus the recycling) REALLY do read like a list that could be, oh 'How to not be intimate but maintain a relationship.' By the way, did you tell him that you see that list as what you do to try to make him happy, (or at least, not make him angry)? Or did the conversation happen such that he only told you what he thought of it?

From my perspective, it seems like you're missing the point of a relationship, which is to share yourself with someone else. When you choose to not share weaknesses, when you choose to not talk to him about your shared interests, you're choosing to not do things that all good relationships need. They need you to be vulnerable, they need you to talk about your shared interests. Your way of making your relationship better is flawed right from the start, you're simply striking those important things out of your relationship, as if to say you can fix those aspects of it by simply not HAVING a relationship.

Of course I understand why you're doing this. You're scared and probably have already tried and failed trying other solutions to these problems, because he gets angry at you. Very importantly, I suspect you're also probably scared that they're not fixable and so if you face them head-on, if you bring them to the forefront, you'll inevitably end broken-up if you can't fix them. And you desperately don't want that. But you need to tackle these issues head-on if you want to fix the relationship.



Your relationship seems broken for 1 or 2 reasons primarily. First one is his anger/abusive tendencies, which has caused you to lose your self-esteem. The second one are really, really serious communication problems. Probably because he's angry a lot, you can't share what you need to share. But you NEED to be able to talk to him, you NEED to be open about your thoughts. The very first thing you can do to help is to get him to understand who you are as an autist, because it affects every part of your life and every part of your relationship with him. AND it's possibly the only way he'll be able to understand your actions. It seems that he's very confused by you. If you're not prepared to get outside yourself and let him know who you are and what you're feeling, (and this includes all the good too! When was the last time you told him you love him? You've told the forum you love him, have you told him you love him?) this will never get better. It still might not even if you do that, but I think it's necessary. Also, I think he's got incredibly low self-esteem too, and he sees you as being the cause of that too. Keep that in mind, not because I feel like you need or even should take responsibility for his self-esteem, but because I don't think you've ever thought about him as having low self-esteem himself. (His perspective in a nutshell: My partner doesn't have sex with me and it never appeared that she wanted to, she has to remind herself to not share herself with me, and I don't understand why she does or says things a lot of the time, meaning I'm horrible at reading her, I can't control my temper and I yell at the woman I supposedly love...if he's got any sort of morality, he's feeling pretty rock-bottom too.)

I like the idea you have of a list, even if I don't really like your list. Why don't you instead make a list of things that you do makes him [i]happy[\i], not just un-angry? Do it together as a couple. Get him to make one too. Make lists of things that you SHOULD do, not that you shouldn't do.

Last edited by cavernio on 25 Nov 2013, 10:34 am, edited 1 time in total.

Lots of people advise you to get out, but we only have your story. I wonder what he would say?

You don't understand him. He don't understand you. Its a problem. You have to solve it. You either solve it or get out. Give yourself 3 months, work bloody hard at it. If it fails then get out.

Neither of you have a clue. You have to begin by realising this is absolutely true both ways. He is as baffled as you are. Neither of you understands. Equally neither of you intended to f**k-up. And its no-ones fault.

I am assuming you don't think he is an evil bastard, that inside there is a good man who is very confused and unhappy?

If you both can't start by telling each other its no-one fault, you haven't got a chance really. If you can both commit to being more interested in a solution than in blaming or moaning , it don't matter what rows have passed between you, you can move on. You have to let all blame flow away. Every single drop of it. You only need explanations.

There is no intent from either of you here to be unhappy. There is no intent to have a crap sex life. No intent to be angry and annoyed, or to be annoying. No intent to be irrational and hurt.
Just a couple of brains and a heap of chemicals, triggers, perspectives.

You need explanations for why you are the way you are and why you react to each other the way you do. And you need some ways to get out of trouble quick and a shared dedication to conscilliation.

He absolutely HAS to learn about autism, there is no choice about that as you have zero chance without that. If he wont do it off his own back (perhaps he is scared or simply hasn't a clue how important it is for you both to learn each others deep down ways of being) It maybe looks uncaring but you have to forgive him for that, and he will need to learn by talking about it with you directly. Talking about it is not an excuse for your behaviour, its just an explanation.
He is wrong not to want to find out about it, you are wrong for not explaining it. Oh well.

You will need to learn to work out why he is so genuinely hurt by your list and how he can say things in anger that he does not mean.

When you learn to apply different rules to other people thinking than you do to your own, you have begun to understand. It is perfectly possible to not think like you do, to not mean to hurt, to not mean to get angry, to not mean to betray, to not mean to damage another persons confidence.

Can you do some of this by emailing each other by any chance? Sometimes its easier to back down, say sorry, be constructive when it is not in the moment, and its through considered writing where you can think how it sounds, then add some extra love. Then we you get together you have made some progress. Celebrate that.

If he don't respond with equal acheivements (not attainment) after a fixed time leave.

Sorry I am rambling on.
Good luck.

The whole situation seems quite stressful.....You can try as hard as you want, but if he's not willing to make the effort too and work in the relationship.....It can't go well. A relationship is between two people, you can't carry everything yourself. If he can't do anything for you at all, there's not much that can be done about it. I know you don't want to leave him, but if Je can't treat you well from the beginning, nor at this point, he won't change his attitude, then.

Thank you so much for taking the time to read what I wrote and respond. This was very helpful and I appreciate it very much.



You're right, I shouldn't blame him for not taking the initiative to learn about autism when I'm too embarrassed to even bring up the topic. I've spent so much of my life trying to blend in that it's really hard to admit to being different. I don't WANT to get special treatment and consideration, but I am willing to do that for him all the time. Maybe he'd be more receptive to talking about it than I think. I will take this advice and try to talk to him sometime when we're not fighting. Hopefully it doesn't spark a fight, but I guess I'm going to have to get over watching my every step eventually. Life is just not worth living this way.



You can say I'm too sensitive. I am. I don't know when it happened, I suppose over the course of the years. The lower my self esteem gets, the more sensitive I become. As far as saying things in anger I don't feel all the time, well I honestly can't recall a time when I've ever done that. I'll explode and feelings that I've been hiding will become uncovered. I guess if this is something that people do often I will have to try my hardest to believe him when he says he doesn't mean it. It just doesn't make any sense to me.

I'm sorry I didn't mention any of the good. I often write him letters because he's mentioned this as well. I make him lists of the reasons I love him and why he means so much to me. I started doing this because he started shouting at me "WHY ARE YOU EVEN WITH ME!" When we would fight and it made me feel like a terrible person, knowing my partner thinks I only see the bad. I think it helps when I give him the lists, but it leads to a little resentment on my part because he won't reciprocate. A lot of the time I wonder the same thing. If I annoy him and make him mad so often what does he even see in me? But when I try to get him to say good things about me, he accuses me of manipulation. I don't believe he's trying to be a jerk. I really think he feels I'm trying to manipulate him and it breaks my heart. The lack of understanding between us is insane.



I'm sorry I guess I wasn't clear in what I wrote. Writing in first person is a struggle sometimes and I often have to go back and change my words when I proofread. It is not him begging for sex. It was me. I begged and pleaded and cried. Of course that was after I tried seduction. He is just not interested in having sex. It hurts me, I want that intimacy, without it I feel like we're just roommates. But I suspect his refusal to have sex may be due to his own self esteem issues. He is older than me and he is overweight, and while I could care less about either of those things I guess he does. I am rather thin right now, but a few years ago I was slightly overweight and our sex life was actually better. But I have my own issues so I don't really have a right to push the issue with him. It's been nearly a year since we've had sex and no matter how hard I try to understand, it takes a toll on me.



A lot of my rules are about not talking to him because he does not want me to talk to him at those times and has told me this plainly. I used to give him an hour to wake up in the morning before I tried to chat with him, but even that is not long enough. I made a personal note for myself the other day. He had been awake for 2 hours and 22 minutes when I tried to start up a conversation with him. I was immediately met with a lack of response. When I asked him why he was ignoring me he told me, "Babe, I just woke up!" I feel like there is never a time I can initiate a conversation. It's OK as long as it's his decision to start chatting about something, and it's OK for me to give simple responses. But it's not OK to try to have a conversation with some depth, and it's not OK for me to initiate a conversation. We both work very hard full time. We work different shifts. So unless it's my day off (which is rarely the same day off he has) the only time I see him is right when he wakes up, and right when he gets home from work if I'm lucky. How two people who barely see each other can fight so often is beyond me...

But back to the list, yes I did explain why I had it. It was one of the biggest fights we've ever had. But I felt really strongly about it and I made him listen to me after the worst of the fight was over. I went over every rule and explained them to him. He still thought I saw him as a monster, though I clearly told him numerous times I do NOT. But it actually was a step in our relationship, him actually listening to me for once. He HATES that I feel a need to write things down to be able to fully explain myself. But he let me write him a list of what I felt I needed in our relationship to be happy again. That was nice. I tried to get him to write me a list too, so I could remember, but it deeply insults him that I need to have things written down in order to organize and remember them. When we fight so many different thoughts get spewed out, and I have a horrible time trying to sift through them. I can never remember what point he's trying to make. Any advice on how to get him to understand this? I've told him word for word what I've written here and it still doesn't seem to get through to him how much I need things in writing..


Thank you everyone for your thoughts, I don't have enough time to respond to some of the other comments right now but I really appreciate you all taking the time to offer your advice and comments.

Just something to think about.....what will you do if he decides to leave you?

This is one of those moments where you don't just pack your bags and walk out the door - You FLY out that door.

Unless you want to go to couples' counseling and try to make things work.


Being name called? Big dealbreaker there for me.

Sex twice a year? Another big dealbreaker.

Feeling like sh** 98% of the time because of the relationship I'm in? Yeah, another dealbreaker.

No idea if this will help but

I have read your previous posts and from those it seems to me like your childhood was marked by serious emotional and psychological abuse. I cannot understand how anyone who grew up in those conditions would be capable of a healthy relationship without some serious therapy. You haven't mentioned being in therapy.

As for your partner, he sounds like a narcissist. He is INSULTED and HATES it that you are writing things down. Written things are proof. Narcissists will hate any sort of proof that points to them being less than perfect in every way. I really hope I am wrong about this but either way, you will benefit from therapy. If you partner has a rage at the mention of either you or both of you going to counseling you can pretty much guarantee he has NPD.

Good luck. you poor thing.

I'm starting to think that the people saying this is an abusive relationship, reading what you just wrote. I'm thinking as well that perhaps just up and leaving will be the best thing. There are many signs that you are, the first being that you've become a shy, sensitive person who's a shell of the person she used to be.

He does sound like a narcissist, and now you've made him sound *very* controlling. What you have isn't healthy for you or him. Why does talking to him stress him out?

When I'm angry I'll sometimes lose sight of what I'm being angry about. And you could be right about his anger. If it happens as much as you're saying, I can see that it would be rather hard to see that that's not what he feels for me.

Sorry I misunderstood who was begging for sex.

I guess if you're still going to be with him, his anger and control issues need to be addressed, and you both need to find a way you can communicate when anger isn't the standard, when it's not stressful. Communication is supposed to be cathartic, not inflammatory.

He don't sound like a narcisstic to me. Read a little about narcissim and then come back and tell us yourself f you think he has this personality disorder!

And I am not even sure at all sure about him being abusive (I think the jury is out).

I can imagine that he is just a confused and very frustrated bloke, possibly emotionally immature. He is in a broken relationship with a person with a whole load of her own communication issues. Is he maybe just a fallible, decent bloke who gets angry with you, life and himself because he don't have the tools to understand it?

Only you know this here, as you haven't told us enough to judge otherwise.

He knows nothing about autism and gets hurt by lots of things that do not need to hurt him, You do the same. You need to learn that NT people REALLY can say things they do not actually mean "in general".

I am NT. The other day I had the beginnings of a row with my autistic friend whom I adore, and always will and believe to be the most amazing human on this planet. However, as well as being my hero, he is also a VERY frustrating and incredibly annoying twat - but only sometimes. He makes me say s**t I don't mean!!

The other day he was winding me up and I was over sensitive. The poor bastard was in a really bad mood as he was really really tired from work. I was suggesting we do all all sorts of brilliant stuff - things I had organised and done for him at my own great expense and effort. I wanted and needed enthusiasm back for my effort, and all I was getting was crap, negative responses back.
I missed his mood, I didn't realise he couldn't hear me at that moment in time. Life was mean to us both.

I am a kind, caring, calm, patient and honest person yet I exploded in anger, it was unusual as I am often chilled, yet exploded and said "f**k why do you ALWAYS have to be such a bloody negative moaning bastard"

I am a happy person yet I can still get angry and say s**t.

It just came out. He is NO such thing. He is an angel to me, normally. He only heard the word ALWAYS and it hurt him cos he thought I meant it as a massive general truth, I was shouting it (I very very rarely shout but I lost it, I don't know why, he was just so negative and I was so disappointed with him).

But I honestly didn't mean it and when I told him this with the deepest deepest sincerity, he believed me. Cos we have those tools, and references and history. Most of all we have immutable trust. That trust is the result of a lot of effort but it is worth the world to me.

The best advice here I think, is whoever said that you need to learn about autism and NTs (both) AWAY from the context of an argument.

There are only two of you in the relationship, so you are both differently thinking, its not just you that need to explain yourself. If he shows real regret at the angry responses you have a starting point to learn to trust again.