Too many dealbreakers

Post Reply New Topic

I don't know why I'm doing this to myself again.
But every time I think about relationships and dating, that heading comes to mind, and I just forget about even trying. "Too many dealbreakers."
In a first world country, everyone seems to be looking for the "perfect relationship," or "the one," or whatever. Standard is very high for what people expect. Even normal things like benign habits, location, job, or weight range can be enough to be a "dealbreaker" and exclude people from consideration.
And I know I shouldn't but I have been reading dating advice again, opinions about a few minorities that apply to me, and the opinion about whether or not people would date someone like me seems very common - "absolutely not under any circumstances."
Too many dealbreakers. Trans, genderqueer, alexithymic, autistic, and in future, mostly nonverbal. It's just too much work for people, it seems. No one is going to want to take that on, according to fluff opinions I read. Too much work. Their standards demand a perfect partner, after all.
Is the margin really this narrow? Are people really this exclusive and petty, or is an online opinion distorting the real world reality? Are people willing to get involved with someone who is a little (or a lot, in my case) different?
I just can't see it happening. Am jaded. It seems to me people can't accept any sort of difference, and the minute they realize you are, you suddenly have "too many dealbreakers."

The trans thing is kind of a big deal.. Definitely a dealbreaker for me, and I suspect for the majority of people aswell. I'm not trying to be rude, but it's just how it is.

Yeah, I think this makes perfect sense.

There's this idea, IMO, with being different that you can and should have it all. In my case, I have "the look" of being everything the majority hates without being any of it. I'm a cisgendered hetero white guy, extremely religious by today's standards, conservative redneck, gun-nut, #MAGA right-winger Tea Party Republican. I've been called some horrid things, bullied for being a ph@g, and...ok, and this REALLY hurt...even been hit on by gay men because even they made assumptions about me. And that was because despite my VERY STRONG feelings about certain things, I have always been nice, respectful, open-minded to a degree, and unashamed to have gay and other "different" friends.

It took meeting a rare kind of woman, someone who held similar opinions and values but likewise open-minded for me to have a successful LTR, have children, and so on. I've had other relationships that pretty much worked and could have stayed LTR, but she was my best friend. I'm sure I could have made things work with someone else had I wanted to. But I'd have to make sacrifices and compromises I'm not sure are worth all the work. Even now I still don't get everything my way as it is. It's just she doesn't demand I radically change for her.

I've dated women who did. One girl used men as a way of gaining status and maintaining her lifestyle (and married accordingly). Another girl made no bones around her friends that she was "training" me. And there have been two girls who were absolutely wonderful that I just saved the trouble of having to deal with me! Whether I'm doing the leaving or not, I'm having to give up certain qualities I'd prefer in a woman in favor of something that matters more to me. I've found in the process, and this is more relevant to the topic, that personal change has come easier for me the less she forces or imposes it on me.

You'll find you have fewer dealbreakers, IOW, when you have the right person who is clearly on your side. You'll come to understand what habits or, I dunno, "orientations" for lack of a better word, or maybe "predispositions" or whatever grate on that person's nerves, even though they force themselves to smile and tell you everything is fine. So you WANT to change for that person. And when that willingness is there, you'll work on it. You'll find it's not nearly as difficult as you thought it would be.

As an example, I never thought I'd be a good dad. Then I became one, though I was deathly afraid of it. I did it for her and because having kids was important, not because I really wanted to have children. But they grew on me and I've grown along with them.

I quit teaching because, well, I sucked at it. 6 years later, not sure HOW it happened, but I'm back in it.

I've never been athletic. To support my wife while she trained for her first race, I became her running buddy. Next thing I know, I've joined the YMCA, helping her train for her first 10k, am swimming laps in the pool, building up my cardio on arc trainers, working through runner's knee, and researching the best ways to survive my first triathlon (gonna be at least 2 years away, but...).

Can't explain it, except she's just the kind of person who inspires me, not the kind of person who fills me with dread. The right person will make you WANT to change while initially overlooking your faults or shaming you for your differences.

I can't be much more help than that. If you're afraid you have too many dealbreakers, I suggest maybe imagining the kind of person you COULD trim potential dealbreakers for, and then work to be the right person for THEM. Sooner or later you'll meet a few people that are pretty close to that and you'll be more likely to mutually hit it off.

In your case, some of your personal traits seem to me paradoxical. I don't usually respond to these kinds of posts, but I can identify with someone when it comes to those kinds of paradoxes. We are on opposite sides here, but like you I'm "a little different." I am a bit of ironic pastiche of hard, conservative values against a friendly, open-minded, "liberal" facade (not intentional, just how I appear to others). So it can be confusing to others until they get to know you. What worked for me was just staying close to people who believe the way I do while ignoring the hate. That helped me get accepted within agreeable social circles and find a dating pool of nice people who would be more accepting romantically. While they were ultimately nice to me, I made an effort not to punish them with my quirks. That way I could stay true to myself without annoying anyone quite as much as I might have.

You can't force two people to be happy together regardless of how stubborn it looks.

It's not petty to have preferences, everyone has preferences. Sure, bitter people claim not to have preferences and claim other people's preferences are "wrong" or "petty", but that's just something they say to make themselves out to be a victim and to blame other people for the reason they are single.

As for things like not wanting to date someone transgender or disabled (in any way), why is that petty? It's a major thing for almost everyone. Sure the pool of potential dating partners is small, but that's life, you have to deal with it. Blaming other people saying they are "exclusive and petty" is concentrating on negatives when you need to be looking forward and concentrating on positives.

Unfortunately yes, you're right it is the response of most people. But why? Take a transwoman for example (since the procedures for women are better than those for men) who is completely post op. She has had all her work done, and is anatomically not different from other women. Why should her being trans be a problem then? Because of her history? Does that also mean that someone with, say, a history of drug abuse who no longer uses, or an alcoholic that no longer drinks, is also discounted because their history isn't perfect? What about someone with a criminal history when they were younger, who is now on the proverbial straight and narrow?
I'm not saying there's anything wrong with you and other people saying that a transgender person is not the partner for you. You're entitled to like whoever you want, obviously. But I do see a lot of people replying NO! NEVER! to the very question of dating a transsexual (or an autistic) regardless of that person's individual differences. It's just a blanket no, no consideration, no accounting for the fact that the person might be an intelligent, interesting, fun, good company, etc.
But it's just no. Dealbreaker. It just seems unfair to outright dismiss people without even knowing them because of one element of who they are - but this seems to be the way the dating game is.

Yar, I don't express things very well at times. I'm not saying it's petty to have preferences. I'm more commenting that it's sad that people aren't considered on their own merits, organically. Instead they're sorted like job applicants, and those who don't look perfect in every way on the surface are just thrown out of the competition, without any due effort to get to know that person. I have known other people who have said they would never date someone with certain attributes, but when they met someone who did and they hit it off, then ultimately it wasn't a big deal anymore. They got to know the person and liked what they were, despite their preferences not fitting. If they'd treated finding a partner like an interview, only the best applicants get through, then they may have completely rejected and missed the person they ended up loving, without ever bothering to get to know them. What seems unfair to me is sorting people based on predetermined standards, and completely ignoring people as individuals - and flawed individuals at that. It just seems so superficial to think that people are willing to put no effort in to a relationship with someone if they aren't perfect. You're not going to love everything about your partner. Everyone is going to have habits and attitudes and so on that you dislike.
And if you're meaning me in your comment - I'm not blaming anyone. I was commenting that it's a shame things are this way, when people can't even have a chance because they're sifted out just based on one thing about them. I may be a bit jaded and put off because I see these attitudes around me, but I'm not bitter. Nor am I in any way a victim. Just discouraged. It's hard to see the positives in this area when every opinion you come across basically says that no one else in their right mind would ever touch you with a ten foot pole.

How's that?

Dealbreakers are all about creating a manageable dating pool. If you understand that link, then the online dating environment makes a lot of sense. People cannot manage 1,000s or millions of potential partners, so they cut down the pool by introducing criteria to make it smaller. The aim is to get an interesting and manageable dating pool, consisting of a similar number of people as in the stone age (which we are adapted to). For NTs, that's perhaps 100 people, possibly even less than that. The more people somebody has in their dating-pool that are potential partners, the more restrictive dealbreakers. That's why young attractive girls (and guys too) have very elaborate dealbreakers. It's not because they require those, but to limit the pool of potential partners.

As an ND or autistic, you also need a manageable dating pool, but just using random sub-cultures or interests will not be an effective solution. The dealbreakers should have to do with ND preferences and improving compatibility in the dating pool. Without that, you'll end up with an NT-sized dating pool where most of them are incompatible.

This is how it is, for everyone it can't be negotiated it is a part of life. You just have less common issues that most won't accept. Just keep looking and hope you eventually find someone for you.

Of course. I'd say I'm slightly different though: I don't have any direct willingness to change anything at all, but I have a strong desire to adopt the interests of a love interest. That's mostly how I change, not by working on quirks.

As for deal breakers, I really have none in the conventional sense of it. I don't need a love interest to share interests
with me (we'd explore and adopt each other's interests instead), I'm okay with a love interest not sharing my values and beliefs, and I don't need us to create a single social identity. I even want us to keep our social and cultural identities intact. I do have some dealbreakers that are ND traits, mostly in how I want to do courtship and some ND relationship preferences, but those are only relevant with NTs.

it seems like you believe that online opinion IS distorting the real world reality and i would definitely agree with you there. online opinion tends to be extremely black & white and real world reality has a lot more shades of gray.

maybe try flipping it around. your "dealbreakers" make it easy for you to pick out people who you are incompatible with and expose people who you are. i think you have a knack for seeing people openly, not as a list of traits and "dealbreakers", and that's a wonderful aspect of yourself that you can offer to others and receive in return.

Love and Dating is overreacting about the friend zone.

Last edited by ZachGoodwin on 10 Jul 2017, 3:49 pm, edited 4 times in total.

No, because it's still a man. A man with implants and his penis turned inside out granted, but that's not enough for the majority of men. Especially when you consider the machismo aspect of the male ego. I appreciate that comment might "offend" some people but I'm afraid that's the reality of how most men think.

Agreed. We can't hate on people here, but facts are facts. Appearances and anatomy to a degree can be altered to fit how you feel inside, but you can't change how you were born. Not a good PC or WP answer, but it is what it is. You can't dictate to anyone, male or female, what their preferences ought to be. If you want it to be "fair," you have to go back to the days of arranged marriages and let your families or the state duke it out on your behalf.

On a side note: Completely by accident, but our parents inadvertently picked us out for each other. My wife's mother latched on to me when I rescued my then-gf from her abusive bf. My mom practically adopted my gf after they met and treated her like a favorite daughter--I NEVER saw my mom treat anything I dragged home like her. So between our respective families colluding to keep us together, I don't think we ever really had a chance with anyone else.

Anyway, I mean, to make the playing field "fair," there's gonna have to be some authoritative involvement. I don't expect many folks to really go for it, though, but arranged marriages and relationships do happen in some places.

I used to get in these intellectual conversations with a trans woman who was a particularly hateful and heinous person. Once I put all the pieces together, I figured out he was living as a post-op lesbian woman and was beleaguered by his inability to attract lesbian women. That led me to conclude his motivation was primarily to get a LTR with a woman. Since he couldn't cut it as a man, he thought he could do better as a lesbian radical feminist. Had the surgery and everything, too.

And to me it just shows nobody can really have it all their way. You can't force genuine acceptance any more than race laws can end racism (doesn't make it right, just sayin) or Supreme Court decisions can force acceptance of gay marriage. 2+2 will =4 in the minds of most no matter what you force them to say or try to make them believe.

And thus you'll never resolve the problem of finding a partner if it's really the case that most men won't go for trans women. But, hey, if Rick and Maya can get together on the Bold and the Beautiful, why not, right?

"Too many dealbreakers. Trans, genderqueer, alexithymic, autistic, and in future, mostly nonverbal. It's just too much work for people, it seems. No one is going to want to take that on, according to fluff opinions I read. Too much work. Their standards demand a perfect partner, after all.
Is the margin really this narrow? Are people really this exclusive and petty, or is an online opinion distorting the real world reality? Are people willing to get involved with someone who is a little (or a lot, in my case) different?
I just can't see it happening. Am jaded. It seems to me people can't accept any sort of difference, and the minute they realize you are, you suddenly have "too many dealbreakers." "

end of the day, no matter who you are, you're gonna have the stuff you will or won't accept. that's just how it is. i don't think it's fair to label it "petty" tbh.
you have your prefs, OP...why may others not have theirs?

i think, were i you, i would be looking to date within what must be a niche and closed world where everyone knows everyone kinda thing. i used to have a casual acquaintance that liked to date trans-females and from him i learnt a little of the clubs that exist etc (that's in london tho)...you must have similar in your area?
you could try mainstream date sites i suppose but then you might be exposed to the freaks and have to deal with them crawling out of the woodwork. if you can tolerate that and sort thru the chaff, you may eventually find the right person tho? no harm in trying, after all.

people CAN and DO accept difference but, it's the same conundrum as finding "The One"...one never knows where they are, how long to wait, and when they will appear, if ever.

You can't transition without extensive psychotherapy to determine that you are truly transgender and you need your body to match your gender identity to be happy. But obviously you know better than this person's psychotherapist that she was really a failed man and not a "proper" transgender woman, which is why you insist on misgendering her. All you prove with this comment is that you are very ignorant of what transgender actually means.

It seems from the LGBTQ section of WrongPlanet that there are a decent amount of transgender and non-binary autistic people here. I'm disappointed that so much transphobia is present, you would think such a place would be more accepting of difference than elsewhere. I guess autistic people are just as prone to hypocrisy as everyone else.

The person in question was unable to get an operation stateside and somehow managed to go overseas to have it done...and the operation was botched, anyway. This is a person who displays a pattern of poor judgment. I can't go into a whole lot of detail for lack of time, but this was someone who was clearly mentally unstable and delusional. I didn't use the term "failed man," so I don't know what that's all about. I believe this is a case of a neurotic, narcissistic attention hog.

If you want to go there with the hypocrisy angle, explain to me why it is this guy can't seem to attract a radical feminist lesbian woman. The way you make it sound, he's entitled to such a partner. Dang, not even the cisgendered hetero world works like that.

Hypocrisy? Nah, I'm just being honest. You cannot dictate to people what their preferences in a mate must be any more than you'd want me to dictate to you what trans or LGB should be or do.