confusion about mixed signals
Hi all,
I'm really really in need of advice. I'm an NT in her 20s who has recently fallen very hard for an aspie guy. We've been friends for about 3 weeks and since we met we've kept daily contact, through instant messenger, phone, and hanging out. It was one of those very fast friendships because I think that when we met, we had both been in a state of loneliness for quite some time and needed to connect with a kindred spirit. Also, we share a similar sense of weird humor so we tend to keep each other cracking up and get along quite well. When we're together it's as if we're kids hanging out and goofing around. Anyway, when we first started hanging out it didn't seem that hooking up was even in the picture, but gradually we started doing what I can only construe as very subtle flirting...well, it was flirting on my end, but I'm not quite so sure it was on his. By light flirting I mean calling him cute or asking him if I can stay over when I'm in town (we live in different cities). His reactions to these range from not reacting to a simple "ok" or "yeah". Basically, I have no freaking clue as to how he feels about me. Sometimes he seems interested, like he sometimes gets very excited to see me or talk with me on the phone. He's called me very cute before and even drew a sketch of me as a gift. Other times he seems very indifferent like he doesn't care if I fell out of his life or not. It wavers between these two and I'm so confused I want to break down with frustration. I've never been interested in an aspie before and have dated only NT guys so I don't know what to make of his reactions or his behavior toward me. The NT guys I've dealt with in the past were straightforward, assertive and generally overt about their interest) Yes, I know all aspie guys are not the same, but perhaps some of the guys have been in a similar situation can offer me any insight on what might be going on here? I want this guy to be my boyfriend, and I feel I'm giving him the opportunity, but at the same time I feel very vulnerable because the times when he acts indifferent to me are very hurtful. Unless I know for sure that he feels the same way about me I don't want to take the risk of confessing to him my feelings and possibly getting rejected. What should I do??
Maybe he's taking you for granted (the indifference) as a form of letting down his guard (trust) due to a comfort level (trust/love) of not having to constantly please/entertain/cater to you.
That didn't come out quite right.
His brain might need that type of down time-while with you; as, while you are gone that is what it does.
It might be something of the nesting side of the coin on his end. And you two will have to find a balance to be (ONE). So...
This abstractedness of an actual solid pair issue without being addressed...can equally devestate the both of you.
I reccomend showing him your post, so he has your concrete feelings on paper.
_________________
"I'm sorry Katya, my dear, but where we come from, your what's known as a pet; a not quite human novelty. It's why we brought you.... It's nothing to be ashamed of, my dear, but here you are and here you'll sit."
I would say he has the same uncertainty you do. That's always been my problem.
I think he's interested in you. Drawing a sketch of you is like something out of a movie. You're his inspiration. And as for the flirting, I don't think we aspies are as casual in when we do that sort of thing as NTs are. I think his flirting means something.
As for his occasional indifference, don't take it personally. Sometimes we can become detached, because our logic and emotions are separate.
He could just be afraid to show his feelings for the same reason you are. Romance is scary, and being autistic makes it more scary.
I think you should take the chance.
I look back at my life and I see several chances I had for romance, but I was too oblivious to catch hints and no one would be straightforward.
Last edited by TheMidnightJudge on 21 Sep 2008, 9:11 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Ok, so he called you very cute, he drew you a sketch which means he "wasted"(For lack of better words) at least an hour or so. When you two are together you act like kids. Um, yeah, this is what you call ATTRACTION! Its called comfortable.
On the flip side he has times where he "seems" indifferent to you. He responds in short answers like yeah or ok.
Umm, sorry if this "seems" simple to me, but I am on the spectrum and you arent, chalk it up to experience. He MOST LIKELY digs you. Ive never met the guy, never heard his side of the story. But by your description, it reminds me of me before I got into the military.
Simply put, he just doesnt know what to do!! ! He definitly doesnt want to drive you away being to serious, but he's done what he feels will be seen as flirting. He drew a picture of you, that means he was thinking about you.
Unless that picture had devil horns and a pitchfork, or a scowl on your face(for any reason other than you've made it at him in that whole "why you little" joke anger attitude), you're in good terms.
I wouldnt say you have feelings for him, but I'd put it more in terms of INTREST. You're intrested in learning more about him, you want to spend more time together to have more fun with him. Ask him if he'd like to see you more often, do more together. If he says yes to that, then say something like, well when are you gonna ask me to be your girlfriend? If he says no, you let it go for a little bit.
Also understand that he has prolly been thrown around by girls, and not in a good way! We aspies do not get clung onto, or swooned for. We dont have a flock of seagulls trying to eat bread out of our hand. We dont even have a girl who says you look cute to us, 9 out of 10 times. We are seen as wierd, different, not as intriguing or intresting. He's shy, and inexperienced from what I read here.
Dont throw yourself at him to quickly or in one move, take it in baby steps. Do you want to spend more time with me? If yes than say, ask me to be your girlfriend then! Something that pushes him forward gently yet in the direction you wish to go. You're a woman, time to start acting like one. The good ones GET THEIR MAN, not get rescued by them.
The showing him the post idea sounds like a good one. Either way I would suggest telling him. One of you two are going to have to take that step, and if you both sit on the sidelines sending slightly frightened glances at each other the time will pass by.
If you look at things from his side, saying that someone is "cute" could mean absolutely nothing. It could be just something you say or he could be in that wonderful "friends" category. You probably have done many other of those "flirting" things, however it might have just went over his head. On the other hand, him calling you cute... ding ding ding, I see that as interested.
I would really suggest you tell him. And be straight about it (without being pushy). There is a good chance you will loose out if you don't.
_________________
Humm, guess I should put something witty here, huh?
A good idea in theory...but I'm too much of a coward to because I'm intensely scared of getting hurt. If he ends up not liking me, not only will I be emotionally devastated but it will probably be awkward to be around him after. The friendship means a lot to me.
I don't know anything about any possible past relationships or if he's had a girlfriend before or not. We've had personal conversations but mostly about self or family and not much about romantic stuff. He did say at one point that he felt like a loser when it comes to the dating game because he has a hard time socializing in general, and when I pressed him further he said something like "I don't know if I want to talk about this with you. I don't mind talking about this with friends who have boyfriends but not with you." I was taken aback when he said this because I interpreted it to mean "I don't want you to friend-zone me" but then again, maybe I could be reading my own desires into it. Statements like that are the little things which give me hope...however, the cold indifference he occasionally shows to me has balanced out that hope.
I should add: the drawing a sketch thing wasn't some spontaneous act. He draws, so I asked if he could draw me and he did. I would have done the same for any other friend if it were me who had the art skills. Yeah, I would like to think he did it because he likes me, but again..no proof.
Do many aspie guys tend to get turned off by something like that? Perhaps I've been making him feel smothered, for instance I've been going out of my way to contact him (usually IM or email...it's not like I'm phoning him or driving over to his place for no reason) almost everyday, even if for a brief hello. These interactions have been the highlight of my day for the last couple of weeks and I thought they were perfectly harmless...

Guess what dear? He's TERRIFIED of losing you. That last line you shared is all i need to know this. He doesnt want to ruin what he has at this point and would rather keep you as a friend then try to scare you off with his past.
And just because someone draws or writes, doesnt mean they'll TAKE REQUESTS! In fact, a lot of writers and artists I know HATE being asked to do something for someone else. They feel its a waste of thier time quite frankly. I dont mind doing it as much(Im a rhyming poet), and it COULD be that he was trying to be a good friend.
I highly doubt it though! He called you cute, that means he's attracted. He finished a task you set him on, instead of blowing you off(and aspies can be VERY FORGETFUL/BIG PROCRASTINATORS). And He keeps you laughing and vice versa.
At this point, you have no reason NOT TO TRY. If you dont try soon enough, he could become intrested in someone else(albeit unlikely) or feel you put him in (as you called it) the friend zone. As I said before, just take it in small steps, and be persistent. Ask if he wants to spend more time together, If he says yes, say ask me to be your girlfriend then. If He says no, pay attention to how he phrases it. He Is DEFINITLY SHY. HE DOESNT KNOW WHAT TO DO. TAKE THE LEAD.
A good idea in theory...but I'm too much of a coward to because I'm intensely scared of getting hurt. If he ends up not liking me, not only will I be emotionally devastated but it will probably be awkward to be around him after. The friendship means a lot to me.
I don't know anything about any possible past relationships or if he's had a girlfriend before or not. We've had personal conversations but mostly about self or family and not much about romantic stuff. He did say at one point that he felt like a loser when it comes to the dating game because he has a hard time socializing in general, and when I pressed him further he said something like "I don't know if I want to talk about this with you. I don't mind talking about this with friends who have boyfriends but not with you." I was taken aback when he said this because I interpreted it to mean "I don't want you to friend-zone me" but then again, maybe I could be reading my own desires into it. Statements like that are the little things which give me hope...however, the cold indifference he occasionally shows to me has balanced out that hope.
I should add: the drawing a sketch thing wasn't some spontaneous act. He draws, so I asked if he could draw me and he did. I would have done the same for any other friend if it were me who had the art skills. Yeah, I would like to think he did it because he likes me, but again..no proof.
Personally, if a woman liked me for more than just friendship, I'd like for her to say so. Probably a big part of his reticence could be that he's anxious that, if he told you he was attracted to you or had strong feelings for you, you'd run away very far and very fast. (Been there, done that.) Or, best case scenario, you would simply ignore his expressions of feelings. (This happens to me a WHOLE lot more and drives me bonkers.) I wrote a woman a 3-page poem once because I loved her... no response from her. At all. We can't work in a vacuum, especially in social situations.
Any way you look at it, he sounds about as anxious about the whole thing as you do. Be straightforward and honest. I mean, be VERY literal with him. The part about talking with "friends with boyfriends" is that they are, by definition, "out of bounds" (already spoken for) and presumably objective sounding-boards for the things he wants to talk about. I do this all the time with people I know. Talking with you about it makes it subjective, and he may not want to have to deal with the anxiety of trying to interpret what you mean or don't mean by your response or lack of it.
Then again, we are all different, and I've been even further out in Left Field than normal this past summer...

_________________
"His age was indeterminate. But in cynicism and general world weariness, which is a sort of carbon dating of the personality, he was about 7,000 years old."-Terry Pratchett
I've been married to a man with AS for the last 10 years ( together longer).
There are some things you might find helpful
1. Do not expect him to guess or know what you are feeling/thinking - unless you tell him.
2. If you want to know how he feels about something - give him time to answer, give him time to think about it.
3. If he is under stress or anxious - recognise that you will most likely not get the answers that you are looking for if you are trying to talk to him
4. Let him know with an "I" statement , how you are feeling about things if you are having a difference of opinion ( if you stay involved with him that is sure to happen. e.g I feel upset when you do not respond when I have asked you a question. I would really like you to acknowledge that I've said something , even if you do not have a response right now ", That would be helpful for me.
5. He may adore you, but may have trouble expressing that through words, and will need a bit more alone time than NT males.
6. I love my AS husband, and for all the kinks we have to work through regularly it is still worth it. I have a wonderful unique, intelligent and quirky husband
I'm really really in need of advice. I'm an NT in her 20s who has recently fallen very hard for an aspie guy. We've been friends for about 3 weeks and since we met we've kept daily contact, through instant messenger, phone, and hanging out. It was one of those very fast friendships because I think that when we met, we had both been in a state of loneliness for quite some time and needed to connect with a kindred spirit. Also, we share a similar sense of weird humor so we tend to keep each other cracking up and get along quite well. When we're together it's as if we're kids hanging out and goofing around. Anyway, when we first started hanging out it didn't seem that hooking up was even in the picture, but gradually we started doing what I can only construe as very subtle flirting...well, it was flirting on my end, but I'm not quite so sure it was on his. By light flirting I mean calling him cute or asking him if I can stay over when I'm in town (we live in different cities). His reactions to these range from not reacting to a simple "ok" or "yeah". Basically, I have no freaking clue as to how he feels about me. Sometimes he seems interested, like he sometimes gets very excited to see me or talk with me on the phone. He's called me very cute before and even drew a sketch of me as a gift. Other times he seems very indifferent like he doesn't care if I fell out of his life or not. It wavers between these two and I'm so confused I want to break down with frustration. I've never been interested in an aspie before and have dated only NT guys so I don't know what to make of his reactions or his behavior toward me. The NT guys I've dealt with in the past were straightforward, assertive and generally overt about their interest) Yes, I know all aspie guys are not the same, but perhaps some of the guys have been in a similar situation can offer me any insight on what might be going on here? I want this guy to be my boyfriend, and I feel I'm giving him the opportunity, but at the same time I feel very vulnerable because the times when he acts indifferent to me are very hurtful. Unless I know for sure that he feels the same way about me I don't want to take the risk of confessing to him my feelings and possibly getting rejected. What should I do??

I can only speak for myself, and my impressions... if I'm not interested in a friendship or relationship with someone, I will not invest the time in them. When someone one is interested in me, it takes a sledgehammer to awaken me to it, because I do not trust my own sense of what it going on - too faulty, too many questions. Pressure makes me uncomfortable, and it has taken a lot of work to learn to stay with that feeling instead of escaping it. Talk to him - clearly, and in definite terms (as opposed to how one might talk more generally to one who easily grasps implications and meanings). That he takes the time, that he expresses, that he want to share a small part of himself with you so quickly, are good signs. Keep breathing, and let me know what happens.
M.
_________________
My thanks to all the wonderful members here; I will miss the opportunity to continue to learn and work with you.
For those who seek an alternative, it is coming.
So long, and thanks for all the fish!
Probably the most important statement right here. If he flat-out refuses any advance you make, then there's a good chance he's not interested. However, if he runs away (literally or figuratively), or if he says he's busy or what not, he's probably just scared.
Too many of us aspie men have had bad experiences with women, and NT women in particular (hence some of the more jaded posts myself and others have posted about women on this forum), that many of us would rather flee than deal with the unexpected.
I'm not saying that you shouldn't initiate, by all means go for it as he will most likely not initiate on his own... What I'm saying is you need to make him feel comfortable about it, and you need to state it outright that you want to go out with him. You can say it casually (i.e. ask him if you want to go out for lunch or dinner sometime), but the important thing is that you say it, as any nonverbal cues will fly right over his head and he'll never pick them up. Conversely, don't be so quick to interpret any nonverbal cues he makes, since they probably don't carry the same connotation to him as they do to you.
ValMikeSmith
Veteran

Joined: 18 May 2008
Age: 55
Gender: Male
Posts: 977
Location: Stranger in a strange land
I couldn't have said this better myself:
I am almost totally blind to flirting and other body language. I can only hear what you say.
If my friends tell me a girl likes me because she's flirting I think they're joking.
If I do notice flirting I mistake it for being silly and teasing and making fun of me.
My own expressions also vary in intensity between totally flat and almost normal.
If I or someone is not expressing, it's meaningless quiet nothing, not indifference.
I assume people mean what they say. A denial of interest is taken literally as a rejection.
There are some things you might find helpful
1. Do not expect him to guess or know what you are feeling/thinking - unless you tell him.
2. If you want to know how he feels about something - give him time to answer, give him time to think about it.
3. If he is under stress or anxious - recognise that you will most likely not get the answers that you are looking for if you are trying to talk to him
4. Let him know with an "I" statement , how you are feeling about things if you are having a difference of opinion ( if you stay involved with him that is sure to happen. e.g I feel upset when you do not respond when I have asked you a question. I would really like you to acknowledge that I've said something , even if you do not have a response right now ", That would be helpful for me.
5. He may adore you, but may have trouble expressing that through words, and will need a bit more alone time than NT males.
6. I love my AS husband, and for all the kinks we have to work through regularly it is still worth it. I have a wonderful unique, intelligent and quirky husband

thanks....these are a very helpful points of view...any no. 7 or more?
