An aspie behaviour code

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Sorry if I post something that has already been up before, but I don't have the patience to dig around.
Anyway, after skimming through the politeness thread it struck me that lots of us seem to feel down because we're different and so many think of it as a given thing to interact the way NTs want us to, but why should we really? There is the gay pride parade (sorry for making that connection, but I happen to be bisexual, so it's easy for me to associate to that example) and gay people often have a very accentuated behaviour code they feel proud over as I see it, and they are a minority. So, why not us as well? If you're interested in this idea, how about contributing with a few rules of conduct on the matter? In short, this is meant to be an aspie manners definer list - a "how to raise your aspie child to be an aspie". Mostly I'm interested in listing what would be bad to try to abandon and good to enhance.

Here's my example (in case I'm not making sense):

Aspies should accentuate their binary behaviour (disability to be mentally analoguous). I think it's been an advantage for me, because it has helped me see a broader spectrum while peddling between my extremes than I've noticed in the minds of NTs, so it would be disastrous if I was to waste my time and energy on learning how to balance myself when I'm around people. I'm seeing things more clearly than if I were to be more neat and tranquil. How could we learn to make this a good style of communication as well as a great tool for facilitating progress?

I realize it seems hard to confine this to a list rather than discussions, but at least I'm after as many rules as possible listed here than discussing only one or two of them. How about it peeps?

Should we do this? Be proud of our lack of social contact? Hmm. Tough question.

I will say this - learning how NTs interact, and being able to act the way they do, this is a highly useful skill. It will help take you places. Even if you don't care for the social contact itself, you often need to network to advance professionally.

Yes, I know, that's because it is an NT-ruled world. But because it is such a world, these skills are useful.

If we go out and say that we should have pride in this, then we are also saying that we should have a world where these skills are significantly less valued. Which probably hurts NTs.

I'm undecided on this issue myself. I hope others post here with their (informative) thoughts.

I'm undecided on this subject as well...

I'm not disagreeing with you, just commenting that it causes me pain to have that expectation placed upon me, and would like people to accept me for who I am, not someone who has everything right in the way of social situations. Either way one of us will be hurt (I'm speaking for myself, I don't know what anyone else's thoughts are?) so a compromise of some sort would work. Currently I have no idea what to do with this difficulty, but I know there is no way I'd change myself just to feel accepted. I'd put up with the pain and just get on with whatever I'm doing to avoid changing who I am.. I don't really know what to do about aquiring some social skills though, because that would be like a learned activity that wouldn't come naturally to me unless I practised an awful lot so it would have an on/off button, if you like. I don't know how comfortable I'd be in accentuating my behaviours either... Hmmm...

I agree with you in questioning this, but you say it may hurt NTs, and with what I had in mind that's not necessary at all. I was thinking of an alternative just like people can choose between catholicism and protestantism e.g. This alternative hasn't been formulated with an inclination to the positive aspects of aspie behaviour, so here's the attempt.
But it doesn't seem to be an interesting idea judging from the lack of responses. =)

It is strictly Darwinistic to simply go by the rules most people make and that excludes the benefits of the rational ability, which is what mostly separates us from animals. Even NTs seem to benefit from the inventions of intelligent people, who are a minority on the planet. Wouldn't it be a good thing if we could even invent a behaviour code that made many more people become better at exceeding themselves and less dependant on the herd?

Yes, this would mean a breakthrough and as such would be painful to install onto the masses as with all change, but what would benefit 1) humanity and 2) aspies, most in the long run? To simply formulate a few rules that could be beneficial isn't going to hurt anyone, right?

There's nothing wrong with revising a social code every now and then, if the goal is to repair apparent flaws. In this case, the problem is that aspies have trouble (of whatever kind of level) with the current code and most nt's don't.

However, if we even managed to do such a thing (make the social code better for aspies in general) it wouldn't make a significant change to the world. Besides aspies and NT's there are heeps of other people with other issues with any kind of social code. And if we neglected them the whole purpose of the revisement still wouldn't be realized; now only NT's and aspies would profit and others wouldn't. In other words: the demographics of WrongPlanet would change, but WrongPlanet would still continue to exist.

That's why I think that if a social code would be revised it should not only cater to certain groups of people, but to every individual. Different cultures make this difficult, so right now there's not much hope for a change. But as long as people have the ability to think, a change is never impossible.

I went from finally getting an official diagnoses this year to working professionally with students from K-21 who have autism and other neuro disorders.

Being the only Aspie teacher in the environment is very interesting.
My mere presence sometimes seems to have a dramatic effect on the social environment.
While I seem to be readily identifiable and relateable to the students, the staff sometimes has difficulty trying to figure out how to relate to me. In return, I sometimes seem to have difficulty trying to accept how NT staff strive to modify undesireable behavior while seemingly lacking any understanding of why the student is using the behavior.

This year has taught me that people on the autistic spectrum sometimes interact with the world in ways far different then the NT population. I think that we aspies definately need to value our differences in order to be at peace with ourselves. However, even if we are a culture, we are a subordinate culture.

The NT dominate culture will continue to view people on the autistic spectrum as disabled.
In education this means that they will continue to engage in behavior replacement methodologies.

I am not opposed to teaching people on the autistic spectrum how to be socially acceptable.
What I am opposed to is doing so without validation of the legitimacy of our differences.

In a sense, what I would like to see is cultural awareness having precedence before behaviour replacement.

Exactly irishmic. The real issue isn't 'what kind of social code is the best?' but rather 'how can we all get along?', which ultimately leads to no social code at all and a higher way of thinking than to rely on a certain formula for the greater part of one's life. As this is unknown territory for most people and/or cultures or regular experiences have thaught them to have a defined path to take in life, I think that we're still far from a global change regarding the general view on Aspies, and even much further from abandoning negative stereotypes altogether. Just because there aren't enough people willing to see the need for a change, most people 'll continue to believe what they think is good instead of exploring for possible improvements.

I agree with you both, but my idea wasn't intended as some method for us aspies and other minorities to take over the world, but like you say, get along, so I'm looking for ways to make our behaviour appear okay to NTs but still not inhibit the potential it can have by giving it up. We seem to be of the same attitude but have different methods of going about it, because what irishmic mentioned, to get about a cultural awareness, is my intention as well, but to do that, wouldn't it be easier if we had a basic foundation formulated concerning what should go and what should stay? The best way to get that seems to me to be to formulate a social code for aspies.

I hear you, but I'm not sure about the effect it will have. While it may lead to understanding and accepting us for who we are, it doesn't have to mean that they will change. I don't know about you guys, but I believe that if different cultures really want to get along with eachother they're willing to do some self-reflection. By constructing an Aspie behaviour code we will do this, as we have to analyze our strenghts and weaknesses to come up with the best solution. However, this is still a way to blend in with the mainstream as the goal of the Aspie behaviour code is not to be seen as quirky and strange anymore.

The problem is that most NT's see themselves as the mainstream and therefore don't need to change. Of course, if the Aspie behaviour code is created some groups of NT's will be influenced by it but I don't think that the vast majority would. So, although I could possibly have a better life than I have because I have to face less problems, I'd still be left unsatisfied because we had to make an effort for it and others didn't. Not only is that unfair, it still renders us as impaired as opposed to them, while in reality nobody can say what is the right or wrong way to live a life. As long as they won't take self-reflection on the 'NT society', I'm stuck with the thought that they're not really willing to make to planet a better place for all of those with good intentions, but rather a continuation of their way, fearing a loss of identity. An acceptance of that kind receives nothing else than a rejection from me.

I am very proud of who I am and my so called "lack of social skills". I don't care what NT's think of me and i'm sick of jumping through hoops to look normal. Accept me for who I am. I'm not going to pretend to act a certin way just to be liked. I also think people with AS are BETTER then NT's becuase I feel we don't need the social interation that they do, we don't need to put up with that BS. NT's see this and fear us, that is why they want to make us "normal."

Not necessarily at all. Offering an alternative is not blending in the mainstream, it's working with the mainstream to create something with an identity of its own.



First of all, as you say, some would go over to our behaviour and things would be a little easier for us. But then secondly, how do you see that as more effort than as things are now, when we have to strain like hell to try and fit in and simultaneously give ourselves up, for something probably most of us feel has more potential than what we're adapting to? And thirdly, NTs have to learn too, but they already have their rules laid out, which we still don't.

One thing I'm very much opposed to is inert Darwinism-awareness, i.e. to be aware of something worse and let it happen without trying to improve it and work with nature (in the same way nature does, I mean). One important thing to say in defence of that position is that most NTs don't get things explained to them, they are told THAT things work in certain ways, but not how, which is in fact the only thing that says anything and makes someone understand something. It's more common in most educational systems to teach meaningless details the pupils ask the purpose of since they can't relate them to anything practical in their daily lives without the explanations. As long as that form of "education" is being taught there's no incentive in trying to understand and live and let live and so on, so there may be a way to show them and who better than us rational people to do that? =)

Hmm......I think that we have different opinions on what is mainstream and what isn't. That isn't unnatural, as the word itself is undefined and therefore undergoes a subjective view. My opinion of mainstream in this case, is the 'normal people'. And by normal people (again, in this case) people of cultures/groups that are not seen as odd, or are too unknown for the normal people to consider them a part of 'my kind of mainstream'.
It's like what happened with the Japanese; until WWII people from Western Society considered them as people from the Orient, and now there one of the major capitalistic forces of the world.
With behold of their own culture, they became part of the First World in the post WWII-era. How they did that is something for another story, but at least both parties in the First World were not as estranged from eachother as they were beforehand. So, by my subjective definition Japan became mainstream in the First World (maybe not as much as other countries, but nevertheless they've managed to become a major player in the game.).
Or, in other words, IMO working with the mainstream to create something with (or Japan's case with behold of) an own identity can lead you to become part of the mainstream itself.




I don't. That's why I didn't speak of more effort. My basic problem is just that while Aspies, with their 'other way of thinking', work all the time to change their attitude and continue to do so by constructing an Aspie behaviour code, while I don't believe that the majority of the 'NT society' would change their attitude. At least, in a form of tolerance at most, but still see us as 'neuro-disabled' rather than 'neuro-diverse'.



True, but having a set of rules is no excuse for 'not having to learn much more'. Societywise, if one was to split up NT's and Aspie's as different groups in this, they have a lead. But having a lead does not say that there's nothing else to improve anymore.
And moreover, it's not like as if they don't see that there are flaws. It's just that they lack to act upon it, willing or unwilling.



I have no doubt that there are many suitable persons for that role among Aspies, and know that it could serve a greater cause. But the problem with teaching is that you need people who're willing to learn. Unfortunately, we can't teach the whole society in an instant, so it has to be a delicate, step by step process. It might take years, but I'd more than gladly contribute to such a process. I might not have much hope in the majority of humans of today, but tomorrow is still open to every possibility.

It seems to be a concern of learning to 'Celebrate Diversity'

Difference is something that tends to cause anxiety in NTs and Aspies alike.

The recognition that the rules by which you navigate the world are perhaps not as solid as you like to believe can be deeply troubling.

I have always thought differently, and most often I get an off-hand negative response to my unusual suggestions (breaking the rules), but quite often, I offer perspective on a situation that is useful in its oddness.

(more often than not though, things I say, often out of place, are entirely useless and apparently irrelevant).

I used to work with my uncle, a highly skilled carpenter, and I would occasionally surprise him with odd solutions to problems, and he would appreciate what he would call my 'parallel thinking'.

The problem seems to be then, recognising when my perspective is going to be useful, which, with the difficulty I have picking up social cues, is complicated.

After long repeated frustrations I have learned to use random 'adjustment quips' to get someone to look again at what i suggest after it has been automatically disregarded as odd.

I don't like to feel that what is needed is an incredible amount of patience when dealing with NTs who I often find incredibly unoriginal and quite bounded by convention and as such, quite unwilling to make a 'thought experiment' to try out my way of seeing.

Pride is often an issue here.

Be gentle!

Celebrating diversity should be a concern for all that spreads far beyond the needs of the neuro-diverse community to include the concerns of racial, ethnic, religious groups, people with disabilities of all kinds, people of sexual difference and other 'others'. It is a skill we all desperately need to acquire to make the most of the potential offered by a diverse, integrated community.

What seems to be at the centre of this is a process of 'Othering' whereby we place divisions between ourselves and those who express difference instead of deciding to appreciate that difference and engage with it.

Last edited by mrliammm on 06 Jun 2008, 8:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I agree and also I really enjoy learning how to survive in this world.