WTF! does my coming off as intelligent scare people?

Post Reply New Topic

So even at the last appointment I went to when I talked to the psychologist, she commented that I did seem very intelligent but seemed rather uncomfortable about it...and its not the first time I've had people make that comment while seeming a bit intimidated it seems. I mean is it possible the combination of what seems to be high intelligence and a lot of mental issues needing sorting out is somehow threatening. Just not sure what to think about it. Also when she left when the appointment was over she seemed kind of self conscious about that I seemed to know more about psychology than her and I don't even claim to at all.

Also my first year of college someone I hung out with a couple times pointed out that people kind of kept their distance because I seemed intimidating and that my choice of clothing, metalhead attire, didn't exactly help. But slowly everyone kinda stopped talking to me because I kinda got a little carried away drinking a few times so I think they got kinda fed up and I felt rather sh*tty about myself for it. I guess I just don't understand why I freak people out, I mean even during a lockdown a girl said she was suprised I wasn't the psychopath with the gun....uhh I just don't get it. I just feel like such a freakish outsider at times.

Hmm. welcome to the club -- I think a lot of us get some version of that "I thought you were a psychopath" from time to time-- or "I thought you were a total prick" which can be a version of the same thing. Partly for most NT's being "shy" means that you arn't likely to speak in class or do other things that would show off your smarts, whereas a lot of aspies are pretty confident about those kind of group situations, as long as we think we know what we are talking about; when people see us doing something that intimidates shy people, yet we don't relate well in an unstructured or one on one setting, they think either that we are too arrogant to bother dealing with people (which from time to time may be true), or else kind of unhinged in someway. To that end, I think another issue is that when a lot of us are feeling stressed by too much sensory stimulation or having to deal with social situations our stress/distress reads as hostility - we can't hide our emotions quite the way NTs do. Sometimes I think we say provocative things either with out meaning to, or to get a rise out of people without realizing how people will take them in a particular context. Your mileage may vary on all that.

On the psychologist thing: I remember reading somewhere (and I tried to google it but couldn't find the reference) that counselling/psychotherapy usually doesn't work well if the client is more than one standard deviation of IQ above the therapist. Most counselors are going to be reasonably bright sure, but if you are in say the top tenth of one percent, you are going to have a hard time finding a therapist who can keep up with you. As a rule don't like those kind of reductionistic notions, nor do I put a lot of stock in measuring IQ, but that said it certainly fits with my experience. I'm sure your sense that the psychologist is kind of intimidated is true-- a lot of the standard tools in the therapists bag rely on getting people to develop intra-personal awareness, and get beyond black and white thinking, which if you are bright you have probably already done. . Those tools also work better if the client believes that the therapist is a trustworthy authority figure with a lot of knowledge and wisdom who has nothing but their best interests at heart-- and again if you critical thinking faculties are well developed you are not buying any of that. Furthermore if you are smart you do a much better job or rationalizing your (possibly) mal-adaptive or ineffective coping strategies, or skewed world view-- so much so that you start convincing the therapist too-- and they start freaking out because at that moment they have lost control of the conversation. All that said if the therapist sticks to basics-- helping you identify emotions, (Carl Rogers basic emphatic response) there's no reason they should not be able to help someone of any degree of intelligence. The problem that approach can be time consuming, and it requires the therapist to put his or her ego on the back burner to a greater degree than a lot of them are comfortable with. There is a bunch of literature about counselling really smart people-- basically the advice is: let them direct how they want to be counselled. You might consider asking the psychologist point blank about her feeling intimidated. If she isn't willing to acknowledged that and deal with it then you may have a better chance of getting somewhere. If not.. well at least you wont waste more of each other's time.

Well I did like her, I mean she seemed like a good psychologist...but maybe instead of asking so personally I could just ask if its possible I come off as intimidating to people at the next appointment.

Sounds like a good plan to me-- sorry, I guess I read my experience into yours, and I agree, "asking point blank" might seem a little harsh at this point if things are going okay. Good luck BTW

Are you saying that she thought you seemed uncomfortable being intelligent or that she was uncomfortable about you being intelligent?

Regardless, intelligence by itself shouldn't intimidate people. How could it?

If you are coming off as initimidating to people, it might be due to the way you present yourself to them. For example: If you are surly or abrupt, for no apparent reason, then this might make someone feel quite uncomfortable. This would be true if your IQ was 70 or 170.

It can be a bit harsh, depends on the psych. You really can't tell how they will take it before you say it (unless you really get to know the person ahead of time. AFAIK, even NTs have issues with it when dealing with people who are new to them, hence why most people resort to the so called 'tried and true' topic such as weather and celebrity BS. I am pretty sure part of it is gauging the so called 'opponent'.)

Yeah people may not realize it, but if one of us on the spectrum has a special interest involving the mechanics of human nature... it can help in some ways, but can also hurt as well.


As for going back on topic. Most people do not like being showed up in any way, intelligence being one of them. It could also be the Psych got caught 'off-guard' so to speak due to her pre-concieved notions about you due to various stereotypes. Stereotyping exists for a reason (sad but true). It is kind of a 'guideline' of sorts, in order to assess an individual on the fly. A good example would be what you stated (Which I can easily relate to. You look the part of a metalhead, so thus most people will resort to various stereotypes on it, such as the whole "Angsting brooding psychopathic drop-out with low intelligence, basically a meathead." one. Trust me, said stereotype is far from the truth, but it basically gets associated as such due to media liking to pounce upon the 'bad'.

You can't change how society/human nature functions. I have dealt with it for long enough and I don't pay it any mind anymore. It may disenhearten you at times, but just stay true to yourself IMO. If you aren't doing harm, then you aren't. Everyone, including NTs, get set off in different ways. You don't need to cater your personality to fit what they view as what it should be. Yeah it can cause conflict and might get you burned a bit. (I definitely did, but it didn't stop me from keeping my own identity.) It is how humanity functions.

So basically the issue boils down to a mix of human nature and ego. I still wouldn't hide your intellect in any ways. If you have an outstanding quality as such, I wouldn't mask it completely.(it is still possible to go overboard on it, so just gotta watch that you don't go completely into professor mode and completely steamroll the conversation). Some people will get all sorts of uncomfortable and whatnot, but for each of those that get like that, others will respect you, hell, maybe you will get friends that way too (which I have.)

@ DeadalusRex: Not all of us on the spectrum are horrible at hiding our emotions. Some of us wind up doing it a bit 'too' well and it just comes off as an obvious poker face (which can garner the same results as being completely horrible and out in the open when it comes to outbursts and the like.), or we wind up coming off as an emotionless freak.

Because a lot of NTs are illogical bigots.

She seemed uncomfortable about me being intelligent. Also I don't know why it should intimidate people or how it could, just seems like it does. Also I am not entirely sure how exactly I come off, I mean maybe people take my nervoursness or feeling intimidated by being around people I don't know that people confuse for being abrubt or surly.........those really arent the first terms that come to mind though when describing myself.

But yeah it seems specifically the combination of me being intelligent but seeming a bit off to people is intimidating to them, or makes them uncomfortable.

By intelligent she might mean that you're highly intuitive. I've gotten that comment from people and always took it as kind of condescending because it seems like they mention it as if they weren't expecting it and are embarrassed.

"Oh always so smart, you just seem to have an answer for everything"

"No kids, no career, you shouldn't waste the gifts that God gave you" - That one makes me wretch a little.

"Your kind of like a female version of that guy from Cheers, you know something about everything"

"Fracking know it all!! !"

Usually when people says these things to me, they aren't being friendly, then they usually walk away.

I've seen my new psychologist once so far, she seems intelligent enough, though I was kind of going through my Meeting-new-people thing...

She's actually an intern, it's all I can afford, but every session is reviewed. I hope she is as intelligent as she portrays herself to be.

i grew up thinking i was three standard deviations below stupid. evidently childhood impressions are lasting because i still feel the same. still, all of my therapists, save one, have been intimidated by what they call a "statistically rare intelligence". one openly admitted my intellect made her uneasy and insecure. after my diagnosis, she said she had to go home and remind herself that even though i'm so smart, there are other things she knows more about - i.e. social things. i figure people are uncomfortable with extremism in any form. and therapists -- even despite being exposed to behavioral extremism on a regular basis; even despite actively practicing equanimity and detachment -- are still subject to human response. meaning if something is deviated enough from garden variety, even the people formally educated to deal with such variation will react (at least minimally). that said, in my experience, people will need more time to adjust to the idea of you, the more different you are... i guess because you sit, by some margin, outside the comfort of their previous experience. the people who are worthwhile, though, will put their intimidation aside and give themselves the opportunity to get to know you, apart from their own apprehension.

Intelligence is intimidating because people don't like it when other people are more mentally capable than them.

Having high intelligence is generally seen by people as a form of superiority. This causes people with high intelligence to be intimidating to others, just like how big, tall people scare the hell out of smaller people.

Then again, I'm no psychologist. Just what I think/I've seen.

Many times when a person comes across as intelligent and the therapist feels that they have some unstable or very emotional behavior, they will slap a dx on of Histrionic Personality Disorder. Once you get that, it's damn near impossible to get rid of, because anything you do or say can be attributed to it.

Histrionics do often come across as smart whether they are or not because they want to make an impression on people. They also seem to overreact to things and blow things out of proportion or they can be very polite and nice. Well lets see how that could be a little bit of a problem.

When you meet a new therapist you are often a little nervous and you sometimes come across a bit stiffer than you usually would. If you are smart and you say something intelligent more than a couple of times, or if you do demonstrate that you have done some reasearch to get a basic understanding of the conditions you could possibly have, they can interpret it as you using that to try to impress and manipulate the therapist. Yes, histrionics do that but not every person who takes the time to read about and learn about their possible conditions and who has looked at other conditions as well is a histrionic. A nervous, stiff and well informed consumer could make him sustpect HPD.

Now, lets say the next time you go in, you are more relaxed and comfortable and smile and even make a joke or two or mention something in passing that isn't related to your therapy, that can be attributed to HPD as well. HPD's sometimes try and be very friendly to "win over" someone so they can either manipulate them or just feel some sort of control in the situation. That can make him scratch his head and really consider whether or not you have HPD.

So far we know that if you are nervous at your appointment and you paid attention in school and are concerned about your health so you read consumer level information, you may be a histrionic. We also know that if you are polite and friendly and nice and attempt to be pleasant, you also may be a histrionic.

Lets say that on your third visit, when he's really suspecting you of being HPD, you come in very upset. You've had a lot going on and that morning you just had the last straw and you can't take it anymore and you break down crying. Over everything really, over the whole damned situation but at that small point in time you are focused on the thing that got on your last good nerve that morning. Say it's nothing huge, but it's more than just burning your breakfast toast. Maybe you got a flat tire and had to put on that donut that you can't drive very long on and you have no money, you get paid in two weeks, you have to go to work, all your bills are overdue and you are suspecting that the friend who offered to loan you the money to get you over the hump is going to back out, you don't live near bus service so when that little donut fake tire blows, probably this afternoon, you will be s**t out of luck and out of a job cause you'll have no way to get there, and then you'll be out on the street with nowhere to go and you can't go stay with your boyfriend because you two are about to break up because he's taking a job out of state where he can't take you with him and on top of that you're late, etc. So all thats whats upsetting you but you bust out into tears and tell him you had a flat and are so upset over everything else thats going on you can't get the rest out to tell him, so he starts being dismissive because histrionics overreact to everything, look how you're acting over a tire nd you go off on him, tell him to f*ck off cause you have already picked up on the fact that he doesn't take anything you say seriously and you leave.

He writes Histrionic Personality Disorder on your chart and has his secretary send it in to your insurance company on the bill, and there you go, you are stuck with that for ten years.

That is a true story too. For real. It didn't happen to me, one of my friends from high school is a clinical psychologist. The friend is retired now and lives out here near me and we hang out quite often, and once when we were talking about my batsh*t crazy mother we got off the topic and into some stories of crap she's seen in the psychology field. Now, she told me a few doozies, worse than that one, but she told me that one because she said you can't always believe every dx you get because it's so subjective when it comes to certain types of disorders and she told me that story as an example. The chick in the story was her patient years after the original guy dx'd her in three visits, and no matter who she went to afterwards, they all took that dx as gospel and insisted on treating her as HPD. She wasn't. I forgot what L said she was, but it was something different. The drama she was upset over in the last visit was a tire I remember, but I don't remember all of it. I'm sure L changed the details anyway and just gave me something similar as an example, but you get the point.

She said that when they suspect HPD, many times they will remark on the patients intelligence in a positive way to see what kind of reaction they get. I don't remember if she told me what kind they want, but her point was that lots of times they focus more on finding a dx to pin on you than they do on listening to you and fining out what you are having problems with and helping you with them. She said HPD has symptoms that sometimes aren't even symptoms. If they suspect it, then anything you do will be attributed to it.

I don't know what to tell you to do, if you try to talk to him about it and he's suspecting that dx then that's just gonna make him more "sure". I'd say feel him out after a few visits and ask what he's thinking about you and all. If he does dx you with that or says he suspects it, tell him you want another therapists opinion as well. People do have HPD, it's a real disorder and treatable I guess, but when you said that about intelligence I immediately thought of that story.

Good luck and keep your eyes and ears open.

[quote="OliveOilMom"][/quote]
So if I think about this too much I will have to keep in mind that I am possibly screwed already, though I wasn't diagnosed with anything....either way I already know they could easily just see everything as symptoms of whatever disorder seems to be likely. Then I can probably except forced ECT or something f***d up like that. Anyways Two appointments isn't long enough to diagnose anything so if I don't go to anymore I doubt I have to worry about any of that.

I hope I don't just end up getting even more screwed up just for trying to get help for issues I have. Hmm, but not getting any help also has some bad risks as well........so yeah don't really know what to do other than not continue going to that therapist.

Last edited by Sweetleaf on 04 Nov 2012, 1:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Does coming off as intelligent scare people?

Yes.

At the very least, it can intimidate lesser-intelligent people and/or make them feel stupid when they try to express themselves to a person who can see right through their lies and deceptions and illuminate the core values of their miserable existences. At least, that's my opinion.