Interactions with blacks

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Okay...I am going to say this here.


How do I defend myslef against bullies who happen to be blacks or indeed, anyone who isn't the same coulour as me, without someone going 'OMG! Racist!'


Why did I use the term 'blacks' rather than black people? Well, simple. I was talking about bullies, IMHO, bullies don't deserve anything that points them out as humans. In my experience, it is mainly black people that tend to do that.

I agree with this. And talking about complete strangers and blacks, this is totally generalizing and it's my experience only. My son has been treated better by blacks than whites-again, I'm talking in the realm of strangers and the communites we have lived in. I have seen a pronounced cultural difference in how "different" children are perceived. When my son was non verbal, or echolalic, and played around people (unable to play with them) whites and blacks reacted totally different. Whites were annoyed and either slithered away, or actually told him to leave (one cute little girl asked me to get him to leave). Blacks always let him play with them, not caring if he could understand what the game was, not caring if he faded out of the game. They would talk to him but not demand his attention. He felt comfortable running in and out and talking at the other kids.

Adults have been pretty much the same. There is an instant familiarity and that includes teasing, invading personal space, asking for favors and being generous.

I say this, because I don't see this type of teasing as cruel but inclusive. "I'm just messin' with ya" is a way of saying that he is the one that is being goofy and you're not.

I have seen some really strange teasing rituals among NTs of all races, groups and genders. I once even had a coworker who used to burst in on people and holler, "What the hell you think you doing?" to make them jump. I've seen people growl, "Get outta here" and similar things they don't mean when they tease.
It's often hard to tell when people are serious until you get to know them a little.
There may be some geographic styles, too. In my early neighborhood, people frequently answered a question by saying "So who wants to know?" When I moved down South, people seemed to feel that it was a rude response.

"Blacks" is preferred (i.e., it is used in government statistics, school tests, and on commercials) where I live. Some would even consider "black people" impersonal and the same as lopping all the members of the race together. "African-American" sounds patronizing because it has too many syllables (not to mention it is not entirely accurate, as you can have white African-Americans who emigrated from South Africa or Egypt).

Maybe you'll meet a black person (now that is a phrase that is commonly used here) who doesn't bully you, and you'll change your mind, Sighold.



Yeah, I know, they are, but why are they making fun of me...because they think I'm goofy. A little making light of me now and then is fine, as I think most people would agree to as well, but when it is costing me time and money, I think I tend to get a little agitated. Then I think the teasing is unjustified and becomes a confrontation. Then I wonder why people can't just do the job they are paid to do instead of go through elaborate (stressful for me at least) social interaction just to avoid doing it. Lae is right people are so deceptive.



So did on some occassionas I but, like at the call center I worked at, I couldn't bring myself to make a joke about a caller after their call was finished, like everyone else did, because I couldn't find anything bad to say about the caller, I did my job so well or maybe I was so engrossed in fixing the technical problem that I just didn't have time to get mad at them. This leads into a whole other topic all together...but I'd like to discuss that later.

Well, all I can suggest is that these people are looking for lightness. My husband and I go into the same coffee shop at different times (we don't go in together). When he walks in, they say up front, "We're out of coffee, you'll have to go somewhere else. . . nope I mean it" or "I''m not serving you" but then they take his order and serve him. This has happened to him with several different employees. With me, they just make light conversation at most, usually just a greeting. But while hanging out there, I have noticed that they are "rude" to their personal friends. They cuss and throw things when their friends order stuff.
I wouldn't look at it as a waste of time, but friendly banter.

I meant it was maily black people/blacks that tend to use race as a way of getting off undisciplined. Of course, this is just my expierence.

I know. And you also said



which was what I was mainly responding to.



She's saying "OMG! racist" in front of somebody else so they will believe her and get on her side. So don't give other people any reason to believe her claim. I.e., don't make the claim that blacks are subhuman because they bully you. Is this at school, in front of other students or in front of the faculty? Or is this at work in front of other workers or in front of the management? The answers to those questions may affect how you should respond. If you are dealing with faculty or management I should think that they have enough reasoning capacity to separate the color of your skin from your tattling. If anything, make the bullying the issue, not race.

I have the sense not to say that in school, society doesn't listen fully. I said it here, simply because Wrong Planet isn't the kind of place where people automatically jump to the wrong conclusions.


((I don't know what facualty is.))
Lesson, school.


The scenario usually goes something like this:
((It's a he, by the way. I'm now talking about the most persitenet occurence))

R:*calls me/Dom insulting names* ((freak, spastic, ret*d, weirdo, that kind of thing))
M/D: *report it to teacher*
R: "No, I never. Miss,D/-my name- is being racist to me"

Faculty is an word used in the United States for the the people who run a school.

So the teacher doesn't do anything about it? I would think she would at least say something... to both of you...no, she did, obviously... that how you found out about what the black guy said to the teacher......he got called in after your claim (he wouldn't go to the teacher voluntarily, i don't think)....so she asked you if you had said something to him that was racist (i don't think she would ask this as if she thought you were, but she just has to ask it to find out for sure)...and so you denied it...and she said something to him about the bullying...and so you both got told by the teacher what about what each other claimed...no discipline was instituted...wow, these teachers solve nothing about bullying do they? lol. you know, welcome to the club, and that is why i stopped mentioning to teachers about bullying in about the 5th grade, lol

Hmm. Well, being black and aspie, I'll interject my own 2 cents into this debate. I would argue and say, that it is not the reaction of people who happen to be black who are joking about like this, but most NT's who do this. What they mean by "just messing with you" is that they may be trying to interject a bit of humor into a situation.

I have found this occurs often, as one of the things I have noticed about being aspie is that I forget to smile or carry any facial expression at all. NT's see this lack of expression as either boredom or anger and will attempt to interject some humor into the situation, or at least get some sort of an expression from your expressionless face by "messing with you".

This occurs and happens whether your black or white. Welcome to the real world.

You sir, I hate to say it, are a racist, whether you think you are or not. Skin color has nothing to do with any of that.

My experience, as a skinny whitebread suburban kid, is that if you approach any sort of person with no preconcieved notions their own personality comes through. If you approach them as a black person or white person, that shows up too. I honestly don't notice the color of the person I am talking to half the time, I bet you can't say that, can you?

It seems to me that the community in the US that is identified with Black people is a much more co-operative, friendly and community minded one than the upper middle class suburban one I came from. Generally well to do folks got there by stepping on people and stabbing them in the back. I have been in the corporate world, was raised in the country club world, and that is by and large what I saw.

In this world, You have lots of "friends" and you scratch their back, and they scratch yours. But the moment a whiff of scandal taints your life, they will evaporate and tell everyone they have always disliked you. Never happened to me but I have seen it happen.

After years of slavery, then separate but equal, then people with opinionsl like yours keeping them back with overt and hidden racism, black people in the United States have to depend on one another a lot more than you or I do. Without each other, they would have been in a hopeless situation, but with each other they could get by. For example, one slave song was directions on how to find the underground railroad, for more: http://www2.lhric.org/pocantico/tubman/gourd.htm This song was sung by all so everyone could memorize the way to freedom. There was no advantage to any single person, all were stuck and singing the song gave them a taste of freedom and a satisfaction that the people watching them had no idea what they were saying. Poverty and opression can bond people better than most other glues, sadly.

Obviously criminals and hooligans of any colour are to be avoided, sadly that is the brush most white culture seems to tar black culture with, throwing them in jail at an alarming rate completely out of whack with any possible reality. We have the highest percentage of our poplulation in jail of any nation in the world, and that population is about 70% black. They aren't that criminal, we are just that racist. No way in heck 10% of the population does 70% of the crime, just not possible. The racism inherent in the system gives the white kid probation and the black kid hard time for the same damn thing, for no good reason other than they think the white kid is more likely to turn around and go straight.

In the end though, people are people. I tend to maybe go overboard to give people of color the benefit of the doubt as they have had a hard road in the USA and it hasn't improved in my neck of the woods all that much, as far as I can tell. It is lovely when I go abroad as no other country in the world that I have been to has the level of disregard for a race that we do. I suppose somalia, iraq etc are worse, but do we really want to argue over who is at the bottom of the barrel? Don't we want to be fighting for the top spot?

I live in the swankiest subdivision in a largely black & impoverished area, picture families walking dogs up and down the sidewalks in front of well kept stately 2000+ square foot homes on 1/3 acre, all made from stone & brick, with lots of stained glass & solid wood and you will get the picture. Not dangerous by a remote stretch of the imagination. Golf course on one side, catholic girls school on the other, and a college campus on the third & fourth side.

Even with this, because of my zip code and suroundings, I have called tree services about 10 times apiece and they won't come out to look at my ^%&*&^ tree. When I lived in a largely white area and called the same services, they were out within a day, and I am closer to them here AND my neighborhood is 10x nicer and safer. I am going to start patronizing local businesses, not because of their color, but because they don't treat me like crap because of who my neighbors are, as they are my neighbors.

Best thing about my neighborhood is being 60% caucasian and 40% black, I never have to worry about living next to a racist. People that would treat a human being with a family and friends and hopes and dreams different because of a SKIN PIGMENTATION DENSITY DIFFERENCE, are not anyone I want to live anywhere near. Thankfully they would never live here, so I am safe from their ilk for some time.

take care,

Jester

Thanks for your input, ma_137. I had been hoping a black person could comment on this. And it turns out you generalize the "just messin" response across all NTs, regardless of race.

As a black person(undiagnosed) here's my advice. Instead of assuming all blacks do this how about asking the specific people why do they tease you? I don't really find your post to be offensive, I'm just annoyed when people believe blacks have the sole rights to certain human behaviors. A lot of time would be saved if people used just a little common sense.

How many times, have I put in my own experience?

I generally don't approach anyone, as an FYI for everyone.



I would like my question to be answered: How do I defend myself against bullies that happen to be, can I even say 'black' without it being racist, of a certain skin colour without them turning it into a race issue and thereby, getting away with the behaviour?


As for racism, probably omni-racism including auto-racism. In other words, I hate everyone.

I don't expect very helpful answers.



I don't believe that. Any human is free to imitate, to the best of his or her ability, the behaviors of other humans.

The behavior I experienced that I wrote about it my initial post in this thread I have only experienced from blacks, and it has happened so many times that I had to question whether it was a cultural thing.

In Sociology class I learned that culture does exist and exists in different forms. Sometimes it does cross boundaries, and sometimes the boundaries aren't always clear. I used to wonder what soul food was. Soul food would be considered a part of black culture, spread throughout America. About a year ago, I read somewhere about the origin of soul food. Its nothing more than what both whites and blacks eat in the rural south, but outside of the south, where only blacks prepare it, it's called soul food.

It is easy, work on not being racist. Once you don't see the color as an issue, then it ceases to be an issue.

If you are seeing that you are dealing with a "black" person or a "white" person, that introduces race. If you just are dealing with a person, then if they bully you, you will react properly. In that case if racism comes up from their end, you can tell them to stuff it, as you will know you aren't so those kinds of insults will roll right off.

A jerk is a jerk, and they come in every color of the rainbow indescriminately. I was slighted the other day when the clerk of an autoparts store locked the door as I was about five feet from it at five minutes before they closed, with the store full of people. I yelled that he was a jerk, and all I wanted was 5 quarts of oil, why would he do that to me? If he did it because of my race being different from his, and the other customers, that is his issue to deal with. I called him a jerk and he deserved it.

I would get just as mad if the situation had been reversed and I were one of the customers in the store and saw that done to someone with a different race than myself. I would set down my stuff and leave, that is no way to run a business.

take care,

Jester

Last edited by jester69 on 25 Sep 2006, 11:29 am, edited 2 times in total.