New girl in my office

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No it's not. If you offer them help, then it's them accepting your offer, not an attempt to use you. If they, without knowing you, demand your help without offering anything in return, then you're being used. If you're already friends and they ask your help, that's not using you either, it's a friend asking other friend a favor. Note that favours to friends are something you can always refuse from.

Offering to help someone you barely know is a good way to get to know someone; I think that's what he was getting at.

Last edited by Fireblossom on 06 Sep 2019, 8:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

He wasn't talking about simply offering help. He was talking about them dating me so that I can help them. That's called ulterior motive.

In the US, a young adult is normally called a girl, anyone under the age of 30. Much older adults will be calling young women girls.

I think cyberdad meant to use it as an icebreaker to get to know people. That's one common way to make friends, you know.
But we should probably wait for his clarification on this.

But if you read the rest of his post he basically stated that the reason women scientists won't date me is because I can't help them in their career and -- only after that -- he suggested that I help then however little I can. So I don't agree with the first statement, which is why I was objecting.

Many women have that "ulterior motive"----but many don't. Probably more don't than do.

I feel like many Aspergian men overanalyze these situations. I've been known to do that myself. And it's possible that a woman might sense that you overanalyze, and doesn't want to be bothered with all that analysis in their personal lives, since they have enough of it in their professional/scholarly lives.

I'd have to meet you in order to really determine whether you are "doing something wrong" when it comes to women. So this is not a judgment on you. I'm talking in general.

"Offering enough" doesn't mean just school stuff, it can also mean things like interesting or relaxing company. Personality matters. He simply gave you examples of concrete things like helping them.

Yes that is what people are, in fact, telling me, that I push people away by overanalyzing. This is also one of the factors that resulted in break ups with the girls I used to date.

But here is a big question. What about the girls with whom I didn't interact that much. How do they know I overanalyze? I mean sometimes people bring up overanalyzing even in THIS context. So is it somehow depicted in my mannerisms or what is it?

It could be. Impossible to say for sure for someone who doesn't know you.

Of course, these women don't "know"----but they suspect. They have an inkling. They have an "instinct" about it.

Based, perhaps, on the clothes you wear. Or how you seem to be very much into your research. It's always good to make sure your clothes are clean, and that they "match" reasonably well. A "perfect outfit" might be a wool sweater and chino slacks in winter; a button-down shirt and chino slacks in summer.

The only way for these women to really "know" is if you actually talk to them. If you talk to them, various preconceived notions in their minds might be debunked.

People often feel that I am a "certain way"---but when they meet me and talk to me, they found out that I am not "that way."

I am in the US. Somehow I was not exposed to that particular standard until my late 40s. I just went through hundreds of pages of school correspondence and myself and my friends didn't use "girl", we used specifics "I met Kim, in my class; I have a new roommate, "she"). So it's regional and/or I was in microcultures. Growing up my parents (from the Northeast) and friends (East metropolitan) only used "girl" for a female child (under 18, "12" was an exaggeration from the humorous chart I referenced). My school community was over 50% immigrant or first generation, so perhaps has different standards. I didn't generally watch TV or movies. I went to college in the Northeast. So when an ex-boyfriend went to a college in the South and started using "girl" for young women, it really stood out to me. I dumped him (he also started to interchange "girl" and the "B" word 'no offense intended' he said --- and more importantly he didn't share my Special Interest). I was working in the Midwest but in the metropolitan area with international colleagues and women were "women". It's just now, at my workplace, when the Midwest culture fused with Southern that I am exposed to "girl" applying to women. --- I was in the Northwest (metropolitan) briefly in my 20s and don't recall being called a "girl", but my memory could be faulty if it was norm and I temporarily complied, or more likely observed and did not participate in the unfamiliar standard. Then again, I am very naïve and a mentor of mine recently said to me, "Welcome to the real world."

Indeed, I have no idea about what clothes match and what don't. I am also really messy. I forget to tie my shoes, tuck in my shirt, cut my nails, brush my hair, shave, and so forth (when that girl went into the office I had unkept beard, which I shaved probably a week later). I am also unaware about most of these things. Like the reason I mentioned tieing my shoes, tucking in my shirt and cutting my nails is that my mom nags me about it when I visit her. Otherwise I wouldn't even mention it since it would never cross my mind.

As far as my clothes style, my mom bought most of my clothes. I have a suspicion she disagrees with most of the people on what clothes are good to wear. Like for example she doesn't like it when I buy myself clothes with big signs on it and she likes to buy clothes with just lines or squares without any signs. Yet other people sometimes complimented me on my clothes with signs. But, at the same time, I also remember others telling me that the clothes I put on aren't age appropriate as in I am older yet I wear clothes for younger kids. But at the same time my mom didn't like clothes with signs even when i was younger either.

But, back to what we were talking about, here are two questions:

1. Most of my life I was unaware about it. Now I am aware, but I am 39, so what to do with all this time I lost? What if I decide to take care of my clothes now, will I get a girlfriend then?

2. Right before you mentioned clothes, I asked you how do women know about me overanalyzing. So why would they get an idea that messy clothes implies overanalyzing in particular? The only connection that I see is that people with Asperger do both. So could Asperger awarenness be the culprit here? Like back in the 90-s when Asperger was unheard of, would htey really draw that connection?




a) The problem is that they don't talk to me -- as the example of this girl in the office illustrates.

b) If I look at people that do talk to me (such as my mom or my ex-s) somehow misconceptions don't get corrected -- they only get worse.

I agree. I was only disagreeing with cyberdad who thought that they all do, which is not true obviously.

So since, as you said, "more don't than do", then I can't use that excuse that "well I am not established in job". So back to the real issue: why am I so unpleasant to be around?

Well, I would rather them like me for my personality than for my brains. People know I am smart, but they don't know I am a human; so I want to be perceived as a human for a change.

As far as helping them with grants or publications, I won't be able to do it even if I wanted to. After all, I wasn't able to do it for myself -- which is why I am back to school on the first place. I only got myself one grant, back in 2009, because my then-girlfriend nagged me to get one and she was the one who was helping me -- otherwise I don't have time to figure out how the whole grant thing works. As far as publications, yes I was trying to publish my own papers over and over, and they were rejected over and over. Out of 29 papers I have online only 3 got published. So I am in the process of asking professors to help "me" get my papers published -- so how am I supposed to be able to help someone else with it?

I "could" help them with homework -- already helped a woman from Jordan simply because I have trouble saying no (and no I wasn't hoping for anything: I knew from get go that she is married with kids and I knew that muslims aren't exactly into adultery and neither am I -- so yes the whole thing was about me not being able to say no). But you know, every time she asked me "how are you doing", I knew she was about to ask me for help with something. Thats an example of feeling used.

It can go both ways. For example, US education suffered because they tried to accommodate blacks too much. And that is something I heard from my dad who, in turn, heard it from professors at UC Berkeley, that are supposed to be liberal. Anyway, what those UC Berkeley professors were saying is this. If American high schools were to try to raise their education standards, the black students won't be making it. But since its not politically correct to say "well black students are less prepared", what would happen instead is that the schools would be accused of racism. Thats why the schools have to keep lowering their standards in order to avoid that accusation. And, from what they said, US education nowdays is a lot worse than it used to be in the 60-s.



This brings me to the other point. When I complain as to why don't girls approach me, sometimes I am being told "well its mans job to approach". I always knew it was just an excuse in order to avoid telling me the truth that I am just not likable. Well, what you just said confirms this. Since women are natural change angents, that implies that they will approach. Or do something pro-active to include me. So why don't "natural change agents" do anything when they see me standing in the corner? Is it perhaps because they think that I deserve it?!



When I see a flower on the road I take it aside so that the cars won't drive over it. I do the same thing with butterflies. Incidentally, I decided to go on backpacking trip on my own last weekend, and a butterfly flew into the car and was still alive but dying. I took it and I was going to find a nice place with water for it. But I couldn't find water since New Mexico is a desert -- even though it was in a forest. So I decided to take uber to town to buy a battle of water, which I did. So then I placed a butterfly on a flower and poured water over it, and lied the flower down with the other two buttles that I bought sot hat the butterfly won't fall off of it. Then I went to hotel. In the morning the first thing I did was check on the butterfly on a flower. It was still there. I took it since I was afraid people will go cut the grass or something so I decided I better bring it back to the forest where it is safe. But unfortunately I couldn't get uber, it was too far from town. So I started walking. But there were dogs and I am scared of dogs, so I realized that if dogs would scare me I would run and I might drop butterfly. So I placed it inside my backpack. It took me the whole day to get to the forest and by then it was completely dead and dried up.

I guess when I see things with people I am less likely to act. Patly its because I perceive flowers and butterflies as more of victims than people: after all, they are the ones getting neglected hte most, as evident by nobody else doing anything. The other thing is that I am too shy around people. Like with this whole butterfly thing, when I took the uber from the forest to town I made sure that the butterfly is in the backpack before the uber driver comes so that he doesn't see it. Well, if I were to do it for people, it is hard not to be seen. But still, I can do it sometimes. Like back in the relationship I had in 2007--2009, I stopped liking that girl in 2008, but I stayed with her out of pity because I was remembering how sick she was and how it drew us closer when I was taking care of her, so I didn't want her to feel "betrayed". I even asked her at some point "if our relationship would end, will you be able to find someone who cares for you" and she said "I don't know". I was really hoping for the answer to be yes since I was tired of that relationship but I felt too much pity for her to let her go. In fact, that memory of that girlfriend is what triggers me to take care of flowers and butterflies. I never did that before I dated her.



So is THIS why when I meet girls on dating sites and they reject me they refuse to tell me why other than they "have a sense". Mabye there is a reason why but they don't know just like you didn't know -- until you took time to analyze. So maybe if they were to analyze what is it about me that they don't like me, they "would" be able to answer? So what is your opinion, why don't people like me?



What do you mean? Did you say you gave me some power that you didn't want to give me? I am totally confused since me being naive I didn't see any of this until you just said it.



So are you saying that its not "directly" because you are a woman, but "indirectly"? Can you spell it out?



Thats not because left handed people are "bad", its because they don't have time to accomodate them.



Wow, that IS sexist. How did they even know your husbands contact info anyway?



I feel the same too!! !



I always make it a point that she says hi first: if she does, I respond, if she doesn't, I don't say anything either. 50% if the time, when I am lucky, she says hi. 50% of the time, when I am less lucky, she doesn't say anything. But she never says anything besides hi. So she never asked me what classes I am taking or teaching, what did I do in the weekend, etc. Nothing. She just sits there and does her work.

I also contacted that guy on facebook asking him about this issue, and he encouraged me to just let it go and said she isn't talkative anyway. But I remember she was talkative during that day when I asked her that question. So apparently he lies to me that she isn't, in order to prevent me from talking to her. I guess part of the issue is I don't recognize her face outside office so I can't really tell whether she talks to people or not. Its true though that nobody comes to visit her in the office (other than that one time). But its also true that she seemed talkative back then -- even if not now -- and also I don't recognize her outside the office, so who is to tell she doesn't talk when she isn't there?

Yeah sorry my bad! I mean't in order to break the ice....

Of course a long term intimate relationship requires mutual love but in order to get the girl to notice you (QFT) you need to offer something that other men they have met have not provided.

A lot single Aspie men are under some type of delusion that girls exist in some type of vacuum in some type of role play waiting for them to make a move....the truth is even average looking girls attract male attention all the time. They have plenty of options.

QFT it would be arrogant to think the girl in your office is single and has no options? she is either focused on her career or she is dating (and you are not aware) or sizing up current options from other males (or females?). Whatever the situation; in order for you to get a "foot in the door" you need to offer something to her that makes you interesting to her. That's how it works in the NT world.