I think one of my best friends is racist. What do I do?

Page 1 of 2 [ 32 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

diniesaur
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 2 Sep 2011
Age: 30
Gender: Male
Posts: 758
Location: in the Ministry of Silly Walks

01 May 2014, 8:37 pm

He's been my friend for almost seven years now and has helped me through a lot of crap...he's been SO nice to me in spite of having to take a lot of crap from me over the years, has been a good influence on me, etc....and due to not picking up on social cues very well I didn't notice him being possibly racist until recently. He's not SUPER OVERTLY CRAZY racist (like "white people are better and everyone else should go to concentration camps") but he's still insensitive and hurtful to people sometimes.

Here's why I think he's racist...

For one thing, every time he sees a black person he starts making racist black people jokes. I understand that sometimes people like offensive humor, but isn't there something wrong if the FIRST and ONLY thing you think to do when you see a black person is make black jokes?

He makes a lot of racist jokes and I know there's that whole "right place right time" thing, but sometimes he ends up hurting people's feelings and he doesn't CARE about it--it seems to make him mad that their feelings are hurt when he makes those jokes. Last night, he upset an Asian person by making a reference to Asian parents being stereotypically strict (commenting on a video about a mother abusing a baby and saying something like "that's worse than Asian parents") and the guy got mad and he got mad that the guy was offended.

He said, "If someone said something about me being white I wouldn't be offended" and I had to explain to him that it's different because he hasn't grown up being constantly reminded that he's white, and seeing no white people on TV except for side characters and "exotic" people and stereotypes, and being bullied or made fun of because of being white, and that this guy is probably pretty tired of Asian jokes at this point in his life. He sort of understood but he was still more mad at the other guy and said "People like him are the reason we can't say anything in this country without having to worry about being offensive" (which I find ironic since Autistic people REALLY can't say anything without having to worry about being offensive).


ANYWAY, I don't know what to do here because I always thought of racism and any other kind of bigotry as a HUGE dealbreaker for friendships...I can deal with homophobia and stuff like that with certain people because I'M LGBT (and most homophobic people are gay anyway). But those people are different because they need help and I can give them perspective and show them that I'm still a person...I don't think I can do that with racism since I'm just a white person too (so I can't use myself as an example or something).

What do I do? It's a great friendship and I don't want to lose it but at the same time I don't think I'll ever be okay again knowing that he's racist and that I really can't do anything about it...or IS there some way to make someone less racist? I really don't know what to do with this situation.



1401b
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 21 May 2012
Age: 125
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,590

01 May 2014, 9:28 pm

You *think* he's racist? Sounds more like as*hole. He just needs somebody to kick the sh*t outta him a couple times for being rude.

If he really is racist and if you like him and like being around him then you only have 3 choices.
1. Get him to stop being racist. (how is your problem)
2. Ignore it.
3. Become racist too.


_________________
(14.01.b) cogito ergo sum confusus


Sweetleaf
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 Jan 2011
Age: 35
Gender: Female
Posts: 34,987
Location: Somewhere in Colorado

01 May 2014, 10:26 pm

1401b wrote:
You *think* he's racist? Sounds more like as*hole. He just needs somebody to kick the sh*t outta him a couple times for being rude.


^this, that is the only way some people learn. Lol my dad was working with someone and this someone got beat up...well he showed up to work and my dad and other people where wondering why he looked beat up. Well apparently he told a couple homeless people they should stop being lazy and get a job like he did...well they didn't take to kindly to that. It would seem sometimes people need their asses kicked.


_________________
We won't go back.


Meistersinger
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 10 May 2012
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,700
Location: Beautiful(?) West Manchester Township PA

02 May 2014, 12:49 am

Distance yourself from this guy as far and as long as possible. It's called guilt by association.



Klowglas
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 Apr 2013
Gender: Male
Posts: 545
Location: New England

02 May 2014, 1:46 am

Racism is the belief that one race is superior to others, what he's doing is stereotyping, which a lot of jokes are based off of... Is he insensitive? Yes, but not racist.

And I wouldn't hope physical harm on such a person, they think they're being funny, wanting that to happen is worse than actually making racist jokes imo.

But you shouldn't drop him because of his insensitivity, human beings are flawed creatures and in no friendship are you going to find the perfect paragon, if he's a good friend, keep him and tell him to be more sensible of others.



Venger
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 15 Apr 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,519

02 May 2014, 1:58 am

Explain to him that there's a societal "taboo" about racism. Meaning that people often freak-out over the slightest hint of it, even if you aren't completely serious such as when making a mildly-racist joke about something for example.

Of course he may already be aware of the taboo as well, and finds stereotyping funny for the slight shock value of it.



League_Girl
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Feb 2010
Gender: Female
Posts: 27,280
Location: Pacific Northwest

02 May 2014, 2:22 am

The OP's friend reminds me of my ex except he didn't make racist jokes and stereotypical jokes about people. Yeah he would also get pissed if I took him seriously or got upset with his joking. I have also talked to him about it but he still kept at it so either he didn't care or he just didn't get it. He saw it as who he is and felt it was changing who he is if he had to stop it with me so he expected me to pick up on it and thought I would start picking up on it when he does it often enough and I get used to it. No for me, I just stop taking the person seriously and take everything they say as jokes but I will not do that in a relationship so that was why it bothered me.

Either your friend is an ass or he doesn't get it.


_________________
Son: Diagnosed w/anxiety and ADHD. Also academic delayed and ASD lv 1.

Daughter: NT, no diagnoses. Possibly OCD. Is very private about herself.


linatet
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 8 Sep 2013
Age: 29
Gender: Female
Posts: 934
Location: beloved Brazil

02 May 2014, 6:20 am

I don't know if saying what I would do is a good advice, but I wouldn't be friends with this person anymore. This is actually good for him because I would be preventing him from receiving a punch in the face.
sometimes people do those kinds of insensitive jokes because they are clueless. In that case explain it to him, if he is only being insensitive he will understand and stop. If he is racist or ass he will keep on doing it.
I disagree with the users that said this is not racist, only stereotyping. The division line really is a blur. Also don't you guys think that there is something wrong if the first thing he thinks of when he sees a black person is a racist joke? Maybe you guys don't know but humour and teasing is used by humans to establish hierarchy.



jrjones9933
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 13 May 2011
Age: 55
Gender: Male
Posts: 13,144
Location: The end of the northwest passage

02 May 2014, 7:16 am

Stereotypes harm people. The research on academic performance is clear, just search "Stereotype Threat." Therefore, perpetuating stereotypes discriminates against the people who are stereotyped. Inform your friend that he harms people with his stupid jokes, and he still doesn't stop then you shouldn't have as hard a time acting on the decision to cut him off, or at least yell at him until he stops. Which do you consider worse, yelling or making racist remarks?



Last edited by jrjones9933 on 02 May 2014, 7:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

Venger
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 15 Apr 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,519

02 May 2014, 7:27 am

Sweetleaf wrote:
1401b wrote:
You *think* he's racist? Sounds more like as*hole. He just needs somebody to kick the sh*t outta him a couple times for being rude.


^this, that is the only way some people learn. Lol my dad was working with someone and this someone got beat up...well he showed up to work and my dad and other people where wondering why he looked beat up. Well apparently he told a couple homeless people they should stop being lazy and get a job like he did...well they didn't take to kindly to that. It would seem sometimes people need their asses kicked.


lol, Actually that guy probably got beat-down by someone he knows for some other reason. And then claimed afterwards that it was by two random homeless people who were "ganging-up on him". :roll:



sacrip
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Oct 2008
Age: 51
Gender: Male
Posts: 844

02 May 2014, 8:20 am

This is the complexity of people: otherwise good, helpful people can be racist or homophobic or otherwise irrationally prejudiced. We always see racists on TV as rude, angry or selfish and not the guy who helped you change your flat tire or volunteers at the animal shelter. So I'm not surprised you didn't notice for a long time.

It sounds kind of like you're wondering if it's ok to still be friends with him, and I'd say it is. He's not a bad guy, just has a bad view. Don't try and change him, but just let him know you'd prefer he keep his racist opinions to himself when you're around.


_________________
Everything would be better if you were in charge.


1401b
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 21 May 2012
Age: 125
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,590

02 May 2014, 2:57 pm

Regardless
Regardless of all logic, if he was attempting humor, and if he cannot see that he failed epically -without anyone needing to tell him he failed- never mind speeches about kindness and sensitivity, and then modify his attempts to achieve his desired outcome, (entertainment and laughter), and pay attention to the feedback, rinse & repeat...

Then he's a moron and he's not really trying to be funny but simply trying to mask a scared insecurity.
And that's kinda sad.


_________________
(14.01.b) cogito ergo sum confusus


Rocket123
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 Dec 2012
Age: 62
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,188
Location: Lost in Space

02 May 2014, 3:17 pm

Meistersinger wrote:
Distance yourself from this guy as far and as long as possible. It's called guilt by association.


This is a difficult and touchy situation. I agree that others will assume you condone the behavior, because you associate with the individual.



Klowglas
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 Apr 2013
Gender: Male
Posts: 545
Location: New England

02 May 2014, 5:16 pm

linatet wrote:
I don't know if saying what I would do is a good advice, but I wouldn't be friends with this person anymore. This is actually good for him because I would be preventing him from receiving a punch in the face.
sometimes people do those kinds of insensitive jokes because they are clueless. In that case explain it to him, if he is only being insensitive he will understand and stop. If he is racist or ass he will keep on doing it.
I disagree with the users that said this is not racist, only stereotyping. The division line really is a blur. Also don't you guys think that there is something wrong if the first thing he thinks of when he sees a black person is a racist joke? Maybe you guys don't know but humour and teasing is used by humans to establish hierarchy.


It's not racist because there isn't any thought of one race being superior to others, there's no intent to undermine the race, or to show that his race is better.


jrjones9933 wrote:
Stereotypes harm people. The research on academic performance is clear, just search "Stereotype Threat." Therefore, perpetuating stereotypes discriminates against the people who are stereotyped. Inform your friend that he harms people with his stupid jokes, and he still doesn't stop then you shouldn't have as hard a time acting on the decision to cut him off, or at least yell at him until he stops. Which do you consider worse, yelling or making racist remarks?


Stereotypes have been used since antiquity, and have been very instrumental for story-tellers, I'd be willing to bet anyone hurt by a stereotype enjoys several fictions where they're used extensively, It's an extremely important tool for the story-teller. See : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stereotype ... nd_culture



jrjones9933
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 13 May 2011
Age: 55
Gender: Male
Posts: 13,144
Location: The end of the northwest passage

02 May 2014, 5:31 pm

So, Klowglas, you're using that definition of racism where it's a terrible, awful thing that only happens in KKK meetings and such. By your definition, the Ole Miss fratboys hanging a noose around the statue of the university's first black student isn't racist.

Also, trepanation has been used since antiquity, and is a very useful tool for healers today. You first!



Klowglas
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 Apr 2013
Gender: Male
Posts: 545
Location: New England

02 May 2014, 6:46 pm

Yes that is racist because there is an intent to degrade a whole people, stereotypes are depicting characteristics be they positive or negative, there's no intent to degrade the people because the intent is entertainment, like using a jewish banker isn't at all racist, it's just a character portrayal.

I think the above part in that wikpedia page can clarrify the issue:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stereotype ... _attitudes

Quote:
Stereotypes, prejudice, and discrimination are understood as related but different concepts.[8][9][10][11] Stereotypes are regarded as the most cognitive component and often occurs without conscious awareness, whereas prejudice is the affective component of stereotyping and discrimination is the behavioral component of prejudicial reactions.[8][9][12] In this tripartite view of intergroup attitudes, stereotypes reflect expectations and beliefs about the characteristics of members of groups perceived as different from one's own, prejudice represents the emotional response, and discrimination refers to actions.[8][9]

Although related, the three concepts can exist independently of each other.[9][13] According to Daniel Katz and Kenneth Braly, stereotyping leads to racial prejudice when people emotionally react to the name of a group, ascribe characteristics to members of that group, and then evaluate those characteristics.[10]

Possible prejudicial effects of stereotypes[3] are:

Justification of ill-founded prejudices or ignorance
Unwillingness to rethink one's attitudes and behavior towards stereotyped groups
Preventing some people of stereotyped groups from entering or succeeding in activities or fields[14]


So stereotyping might lead to racism but it isn't racism itself: