NTs and their façade of tolerance.

Post Reply New Topic

To say that I am pissed is an understatement.

Some people, whom I have come to see as friends, had problems with me. That is not the issue; no friendship is perfect. The major... ANNOYANCE is that they couldn't be bothered to say it straight to my face. I had to learn that fact from someone else.

And my family asks me why I have trust issues.

I care for them, I really do, and they couldn't bring themselves to tell me my problems? Trust is a two-way street, as*holes.

Must be great being NT, to be able to make friends and discard them at will.

f**k them. Pretenders. I don't know who it was (I had a nagging feeling), but now I have to watch myself. Even "close" friends are not above suspicion. After all, you best friend can become your worst enemy.

I understand what you are saying. I have had this same thing happening to me over and over in my life. Person #1 pretends to get along with me then all of a sudden I hear from person #2 telling me I have done something weird,wrong or unusual and person #1 is upset with me. I used to wonder why person #1 couldn't just bring that concern to me in the first place. I imagine it is because they are afraid of me although I don't know why. If anything I am afraid of them because they go behind my back and I don't know what to expect.

NT's get insulted when they are told they are doing something annoying or that is bothering others. Thats why they won't tell us straight out what we are doing and just avoid us. I'd rather be told. In fact I tell every friend I have early on that I can be annoying and I won't notice it but they need to tell me when I am and it's not rude and I won't get mad, in fact I'll appreciate it. They usually do and we get along fine. It goes against their nature to say something like that to people unless they are trying to insult them or they dislike them. They think it's nicer to just leave you alone.

Try what I do, it really works. I rarely have people drop me now. I do have them tell me I'm being annoying though, and thats cool. When they tell me I stop.

_________________
I'm giving it another shot. We will see.
My forum is still there and everyone is welcome to come join as well. There is a private women only subforum there if anyone is interested. Also, there is no CAPTCHA.

The link to the forum is http://www.rightplanet.proboards.com

NT's aren't the only ones who call themselves our "Friends" and then complain about us behind our backs. I believe it's human nature. I think this culture teaches us that you don't want to "Hurt someone's feelings." I know a few people on the spectrum who have been too cowardly to let me know that something bothers them.

At the same time you have to be careful when you get information from third parties because you never know how much of what they are saying is actually fact instead of fiction.

Based on my experience, very few people will tell you. That includes people with autism. It could be due to fear of conflicts, social interaction issues, anxiety, or because they know if they tell you, it will lead to a bunch of questions being asked and then they will end up with a long discussion because the other person is clueless about your perspective of them and they don't understand why you have that view on them and they are still having to deal with you so they find it's better to just ghost and if they feel there won't be a change in your behavior, no point in telling you, same as if your judgment of them will leave them clueless and confused and they still don't learn. And of course it could be because they don't want to offend you or hurt your feelings. Of course online you would think it would be easier to just tell them because you tell them and then don't read their PM again or their next IM but nope. Instead people also ghost online.

I am guilty of not telling people. Instead I just disappear. The thought of telling them makes me so nervous to a point I am scared so that makes me be less frustrated about people not telling me. I wonder if this is normal for everyone?

I'm guilty of not telling people sometimes what they do that bothers me. It's pretty hard to do, even though I totally understand the need and desire to know and that it won't make the person mad. It's mainly because I didn't know I had AS till middle age, and I basically became very aware and observant of what is typically polite and impolite. I'm guilty of being pretty mean to one particular person with AS who I talked to online and some on the phone and even though I was aware that I myself might not get the hints that I was giving this person, I was annoyed that they didn't catch on to them. When I finally spoke up about the particular thing that bothered me I was asked "why" and even though I know this person probably didn't mean it this way, they asked more questions about why I couldn't do certain things that the particular thing of theirs that annoyed me would force me to do and even though I KNEW LOGICALLY that this person was not acting like a spoiled bratty child, the questions registered in my mind as such. They probably did that because I have four children and I've only been asked those challenging types of questions by children when I've told them no and they want me to prove to them why "no" is appropriate. So, I got angry and picked a fight over the next thing that came up.

I'm an aspie and if it's hard for me even when I know for a fact that this person was only wondering why I felt the way I did because they felt completely different and actually enjoyed doing what their habit that annoyed me would force me to do, then an NT who has absolutely no clue at all about it will just drop us when we don't take the hint or when we don't immediately apologize and stop whatever it is we are doing that is annoying them, even though we feel that we are doing something good.

One of the things I do is talk too much. I bet ya'll never would have guessed that, would you? LOL. But I do. I have to watch myself and I'll notice when I'm doing it but I so WANT TO tell the person the information or story that it's very hard to make myself stop. When I don't, I annoy people. I'm aware of that. I'm not at all offended when it's pointed out to me and I do apologize cause it can be damned annoying to be cornered by a motormouth but it breaks so many rules of manners to tell somebody they are talking too much. You hint, and you hint more specifically, but unless you know the person well it's almost impossible to tell them.

I would imagine it's even harder to point out other annoying personality features or annoying habits to someone when those things are things that you just never say to someone, such as their hygeine bothers you, or they are very selfish, or childish, or they always talk too loud, or their tone of voice sounds really weird and can they fix that, or why are they asking so many questions about obvious things, etc. Unless you are good friends with someone, or you aren't very invested in manners and you don't see saying those things as extremely rude, you will find it easier to just leave the person alone than tell them, even if you genuinely like them and enjoy their company other than this one thing which bothers you so much that you can't tolerate it. It's not easier to the person who is dumped at all and we would rather hear the truth about ourselves and how we come across, because if we aren't told we will never know to change it. If I hadn't been told I would have never, ever known any of the things that were so unlikable and annoying about me. I would have never changed them.

I do think about the way I did this person fairly often. Every time I run into them online I do feel a twinge of guilt. I did get mad about something else entirely and we had a falling out about it, but after all the questions that made me think "bratty child" I started seeing "bratty child" everywhere with this person, who is far from a bratty child but is an intelligent and friendly adult. I knew it was the way they came across and that I was in "seeing bratty child" mode, so I was very fed up and frustrated and couldn't explain it to them, well wouldn't is better, I would have felt like I was no better than the people who maybe made fun of them for this very thing if I complained about it, so we had a fight and didn't like each other for a while then eventually just kept each other at arms length and hold no grudge. I don't know what this person thinks about me, probably that I'm a bigger b***h than I am, but I honestly was a b***h to this person and I do think to this day I should contact them and tell them what it was that made me mad and what they said and how they said it that came across as childish and or bratty to me, because I'm sure this is not an isolated incident and like all of us, they know they come across wrong many times and really want to know when and specifics so they can stop it.

Should I contact this person and explain it, or would that just seem like I was coming back a few years later to just insult them and tell them their flaws? I don't mean it that way but I was asked and feel like I owe it to them.

So if I have that problem, and we all know that while I may not want to hurt people's feelings there are times when I certainly don't mind being very blunt about things, and I say all the things I do to people when I'm not even trying to insult them and I'm ok with it in those situations, could you imagine how hard it would be for an NT who can't understand anything about AS at all, to go against everything they are taught about social interaction and just basically say bad things to somebody who hasn't done anything wrong to them? It's pretty hard, that's why I give specifics to people about what I do, and check in with them every so often and smile and joke about it with them. I don't talk this much to NT's or to strangers, trust me on that, but I do talk more than normal folks do, AS or NT. Also I talk about obscure things nobody cares about too. So you can imagine how hard it is for them. It would be like if somebody told you that if you go up and kick that friendly dog right in the chest, it would help him. And in this analogy it would because he's choking but you can't see that. Telling us our faults goes against everything that people are taught about interaction. Asking them to do that seems unfair to them and way weirder than whatever it is that we are doing that is annoying.

Thats my two cents on it and my story of how I just got into a fight with another aspie rather than explain what was wrong in detail because it made me uncomfortable even though as an aspie, I knew better. It's gotta be downright impossible for those poor folks if it's this hard for us.

_________________
I'm giving it another shot. We will see.
My forum is still there and everyone is welcome to come join as well. There is a private women only subforum there if anyone is interested. Also, there is no CAPTCHA.

The link to the forum is http://www.rightplanet.proboards.com

It's really frustrating when people don't tell you what the issue is because it doesn't help to resolve anything. If someone has a problem with me I would want them to just tell me up front what the issue is. As long as they aren't being abrasive about it or anything I don't see why it would be a problem for me. It would work out so much better that way too because if there was a misunderstanding I could explain myself. Even if it's awkward, I think it would be worth it anyway because it could help to solve whatever the problem is.

I also agree that it makes it harder to trust people. If there's someone who's always talking bad about people I just try to keep my distance from them. I don't think it's worth it to tell people things about myself if they might use that information against me later on.

Well, at least you've learned that you can't trust anyone, at least not completely. Once you know that, it's not so hard. You wont be shocked when people stab you in the back or whatever, so it'll hurt a lot less.

Maybe they don't tell you what the problem is because they don't want you to fix it. It's probably more gratifying just to ditch you as a person.

My obsession with a narrow range of topics is because I have so much time alone.

Kind of a vicious cycle really. Socially isolated, so lose myself in books. When there IS an opportunity to chat, I am unable to think of anything BUT stuff I have been reading. Then people steer clear of me. Rinse and repeat.

In fact, I had been recently told by a native English speaker that I use odd, sometimes even archaic words. Yep. I read so much that I can confuse native speakers.

I guess that means sometimes, especially to people who just met me, I can come off as... snobbish...? Well. I'm not. I personally hate snobs, but there you are. C'est la vie.

Sometimes, I wish I am finished with stupid rote learning under-grad and can move up. The people who actually discuss things with me are post-grads or working in the field....