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Cashew_wasp
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24 Nov 2024, 11:39 am

So, I feel like a lot of the time that I have higher empathy towards animals the humans. If a friend's parent dies, I don't really feel anything, I'll try to make them feel better, but my efforts wont have the intended effect. Whereas, when I see a bird with a broken bone or such, I'll try to gently approach it as I call animal control. When I am introduced to a new person, I have a tendency to only ask things that I'm interested in. I remember vividly one time at the gorilla exbibit at a zoo, one of the gorillas was hiding under a blanket, rocking back and forth, holding her baby, No one else betted an eye, there were over 20 people there, and they where all laughing and talking, but I had to go over to the side for like 20 minutes. That was probably the biggest emotional reaction that I had that year, I was f*****g hysterical, over a being that wasn't even my own species. I have cried when people close to me die, but never when they were in a sad situation. I was wondering it this is an Autism/Asperger's thing or just me being odd. :star:



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24 Nov 2024, 12:42 pm

I think sometimes I understand what an animal wants better than I understand what people want.


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24 Nov 2024, 2:17 pm

I think it's because autistic people are not very receptive to social conditioning, which is why we don't understand neurotypical people very well when they express themselves as socially conditioned individuals. resulting in animals being more relatable because they are not socially conditioned and are just expressing what they are feeling rather than what would be socially acceptable.



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24 Nov 2024, 2:42 pm

That's mostly the reason for my tree change and spending the last 20 years talking to alpacas.
My partner wears a t-shirt saying "DOGS....because people suck!"



bee33
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24 Nov 2024, 3:05 pm

Animals make me even more uncomfortable than people because I have trouble understanding what they want or what I should do around them, and I can't ask them.

Having said that, I would like to have a cat but I can't because of my chronic fatigue. Even though cats require little care it's still more than I am able to manage.



lostonearth35
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24 Nov 2024, 3:21 pm

Animals aren't launching nuclear missiles into the air or sending hate mail to women and minorities. They don't have creepy cults, hate groups, and have existed for millions of years without politics or religion. They don't even roll their eyes at me if they see my collection of Funko Pop figures. They aren't committing mass shootings or stabbings.

So why shouldn't I like animals and not people? I don't go to bed at night worrying it's going to be my last night alive because the animals are going to start WWIII with us.

Although ant behavior is so similar to humans its scary. Like when they invade a termite mound in Africa and brutally murder all the termites, including the queen, even though she's like a million times bigger than they are. Amazon ants enslave other ant colonies and basically brainwash them with their pheromones. And then there are the murder hornets that are killing off honeybees. But they're acting out of instinct, they're not aware that what they're doing might be "wrong".



funeralxempire
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24 Nov 2024, 3:28 pm

Humans are animals, there's no need for the false dichotomy.


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bee33
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24 Nov 2024, 3:32 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
Humans are animals, there's no need for the false dichotomy.

I suppose one could clarify by saying "other animals."



Edna3362
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24 Nov 2024, 3:53 pm

Not me, though.

I don't want being a human and having to do with the nature of it.
... And I don't have any inclinations towards other creatures.


Does not caring and not thinking about something better than not wanting and not liking to do with something?


And probably because I don't have the social need.
Never bad enough to substitute animal companionship from any human companionship.

The same vein as to virtual from real life.


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24 Nov 2024, 4:01 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
Humans are animals, there's no need for the false dichotomy.


Humans are animals, but not as humane.



utterly absurd
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24 Nov 2024, 8:04 pm

Yes. All other animals are better than humans.

I think I have about as much empathy for humans as for anyone else, but I'd much rather spend time with nonhumans. Humans are the only animals who will judge you, insult you, bully you, exclude you, make you do stupid things for no reason, etc. There are plenty of humans I like, but if I'm meeting someone I don't know this is the last species I'd want them to be.


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24 Nov 2024, 8:23 pm

utterly absurd wrote:
Yes. All other animals are better than humans.


Chimpanzees make humans seem like angels. :nerdy:


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24 Nov 2024, 9:38 pm

Double Retired wrote:
I think sometimes I understand what an animal wants better than I understand what people want.
I was using "animal" in the sense of 2a...I think they are often more understandable.


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24 Nov 2024, 11:17 pm

lostonearth35 wrote:
Animals aren't launching nuclear missiles into the air or sending hate mail to women and minorities. They don't have creepy cults, hate groups, and have existed for millions of years without politics or religion. They don't even roll their eyes at me if they see my collection of Funko Pop figures. They aren't committing mass shootings or stabbings.

So why shouldn't I like animals and not people? I don't go to bed at night worrying it's going to be my last night alive because the animals are going to start WWIII with us.

Although ant behavior is so similar to humans its scary. Like when they invade a termite mound in Africa and brutally murder all the termites, including the queen, even though she's like a million times bigger than they are. Amazon ants enslave other ant colonies and basically brainwash them with their pheromones. And then there are the murder hornets that are killing off honeybees. But they're acting out of instinct, they're not aware that what they're doing might be "wrong".


Interesting observation. there are more commonalities between the insects you mentioned and human beings that show correlations but might also indicate causation. Generally, they are all complex societies, Specifically the division of labor and social hierarchy.

In those insects, each individual has a role that is determined biologically (Queens, Workers, Drones). In humans, the roles are divided culturally (Farmer, doctor, soldier), cultural rather than biological because we didn't evolve to be complex societies but rather our exponential growth in numbers as a result of the agricultural revolution naturally arose the need for specializations.

they even exhibit altruistic behavior much like we do. they sacrifice themselves to protect the colony, we go to war and die for our country.

So, the murderous behavior you mentioned could also be a natural characteristic of complex societies where the group is dependent on the individual to function and the individual is dependent on the group to survive. for individuals to behave in this way they must identify with the group, which tends to frame everything else as a threat, as an enemy, as a demon ... nazis identified quite strongly with their group!

I'd like to think that we are better than the insects, but we behave the same. so, either we are acting on instinct as well, or the insects know it's "wrong" but do it anyway just like we do.



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25 Nov 2024, 1:05 am

No I don't think animals are better than people, but I know what they mean when they say it's so. Animals are simpler usually. But I'd rather meet a person than a tiger.



utterly absurd
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25 Nov 2024, 1:17 am

ToughDiamond wrote:
But I'd rather meet a person than a tiger.

I can agree with this. But if a tiger kills you it's because they need to eat, while if a human kills you it's because they decided to despite knowing it's wrong. That's more how I was thinking of it. But I've also been feeling very cynical lately so maybe that's affecting my view. I want to think we're as good as other animals, but I'm finding it hard to believe that.

Also, more humans are killed by humans than by tigers. But of course other factors go into that.


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