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cyberdora
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23 Jan 2025, 9:00 pm

CockneyRebel wrote:
It was clearly a Nazi salute and he did it with intention.


Yeah, he's not that ignorant to not know, and he did it twice for effect. the similarity of his salute with the US nazi salute from social media suggest he's communicating deep set beliefs he holds for those with eyes to see.



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24 Jan 2025, 2:43 am

When the whole world's looking at you, you might as well give them a show


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24 Jan 2025, 10:37 am

roronoa79 wrote:
Oh, and f--- any of you who enable conservatives' deflection that this is because of autism. You sicken me.


Some Are Excusing Elon Musk's Disturbing Salute As Autism — And Autistic People Have Thoughts
Quote:
As some experts and advocates may tell you, autism symptoms and gestures that appear like targeted hate toward people are typically two completely different things.

First, while autism can cause people to struggle more in social situations, it doesn’t mean it excuses cruelty and disrespect, whether intentional or not. While some individuals who are autistic may struggle to interpret social cues or engage in social settings, that doesn’t mean they’ll jump to controversial actions.

“Neurodivergent people are just like anyone else and are able to learn social norms, context and impacts of their actions,” Jennifer Vincent, a licensed mental health counselor who works with autistic and neurodivergent individuals, and has nearly 20 years of experience, told HuffPost.

Shea Belsky, a Jewish person and autistic self-advocate, also emphasized this point based on his own experience. “Autism does not make it impossible for someone to feel shame, empathy or guilt for their actions,” he told HuffPost. “I do not believe for a second that Elon was oblivious to what he was doing.”

Additionally, as autistic X user @FowlCrown, Siena, stated in a post that autism and a Nazi salute are not a cause-and-effect situation. “im autistic and wouldn’t make any movement even close to a nazi especially in front of a cROWD at such a heightened political time,” they wrote.

There’s also the argument of dyspraxia, a movement and coordination disorder that’s common in autistic children. Some on social media suggested Musk’s salute could be a product of that.

When discussing a condition, especially in public conversations and debates about controversial topics, talking to people who have it firsthand is also vital.

“For me, I experience a lot of sensory challenges, including being very sensitive to noises, smells, visual stimuli,” Dawson shared. “I also need a lot of alone time, and can easily take on the emotions and stress of those around me.”

Of course, that’s only one example. Autism will look different for each person who has it — and that doesn’t mean hate speech and gestures are a part.

“I feel it’s important to look at the background and overall context of the individual, not their neurotype in isolation,” Dawson said. “Musk’s track record with the far right is undeniable and should be what is focused on here.”

Acknowledging what’s behind this particular debate ― and the impact it has
All of this begs the question: Are people associating Musk’s gesture with autism doing so because they believe they know how autism works, or because they want to throw a blanket defense for Musk (and perhaps more specifically, the far right)? After all, some X users posted photos and videos of Democrats with their arms out, appearing to demonstrate the same gesture. But others argue these images are not the same as Musk’s gesture.

After asking Dawson, she said it could be a combination of both. “People often reach for anything in defense,” she said. “The fact that it is being brought up highlights a continued misunderstanding that’s being perpetuated recently.”

When asked how the excuse for Musk made them feel, the people with autism we interviewed used words like “abhorred,” “incredibly angry,” “infuriated” and “saddened.”

We have a long time saying here at Wrong Planet "Autism is an explanation, not an excuse"

The author of the article made the assumption that the only people bringing up Autism are people defending Musk's actions. Are we sure about this? Autism has been cited by people as a cause of mass shootings, break up of families so why not a "Nazi Salute"?

Either way, all these people weaponizing the term Autism for political gain hurt us as a community. The author of the article did not ask me how I feel about it. I feel frustrated.


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24 Jan 2025, 10:49 am

A lot has been made about that Musk did the Seig Heil/I Heart you salute twice.

The rally was held in the Capital One Arena. The gesture was made twice so the people on both sides of the arena could see it.


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24 Jan 2025, 2:38 pm

Conservative parent: "It's clearly not a Nazi salute! Liberals are just a bunch of snowflakes!"
Child of conservative parent: "So, is it okay if I do that salute at school?"
Conservative parent: "Hell f---ing no!"


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24 Jan 2025, 7:17 pm

roronoa79 wrote:
Conservative parent: "It's clearly not a Nazi salute! Liberals are just a bunch of snowflakes!"
Child of conservative parent: "So, is it okay if I do that salute at school?"
Conservative parent: "Hell f---ing no!"


Since Elon made Nazi salutes great again I can only imagine they're coming back in style.

Child of conservative parent: You just don't get it. You're too old to be with it.
Parent: I used to be with it. Then they changed what it was. Now what I'm with ain't 'it' and what's it seems weird and scary. It'll happen to you.


Of course, if anyone sees the Seek Kyle and asks about it you deny doing it to own the libs through gaslighting or something.


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24 Jan 2025, 8:23 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
Rehashing what I have posted and written about in other threads. Others trying to debunk the idea that it was a Nazi salute have posted on social media very non MAGA celebrities and politicians using the same salute.


How many of those comparisons are relying on a single out of context image when offering up examples of normies doing the same thing as Musk?

It one thing to have your arm in a raised position for an instant, it's another to do the entire motion of a Nazi salute twice at a rally in front of swarms of modern day far-right extremists.

It seems like yet another example of how the far-right relies on equivocation and other tactics to muddy the waters when they're called out for socially repulsive behaviour.


https://www.indy100.com/news/elon-musk- ... azi-salute

Quote:
How has Taylor Swift been dragged into all this?

Well, Musk has been sharing reposts defending him and two of them have included out-of-context posts comparing a screengrab of Taylor Swift waving.

"My god. Not her too," one post read while the second read: "Does this mean Swifties = Hitler youth?" and also included a photo of Adolf Hilter doing the Nazi salute.

Fact-checking website Snopes has confirmed the image of Swift is fake, citing a report from fact-checking organisation the Polish Pravda Association which says an unidentified user "horizontally mirrored the picture, making it appear as if she extended her right arm — the arm designated for performing a Nazi salute."

In the original undoctored image, Swift extended her left arm as she blew a kiss and waved to the crowd during a concert performance on ABC's "Good Morning America" back in 2014 which can be viewed on YouTube.


So to make it clear, the people who are doing this "debunking" are a mix of liars and dupes and you shouldn't fall for their horses**t.


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24 Jan 2025, 8:38 pm

roronoa79 wrote:
Conservative parent: "It's clearly not a Nazi salute! Liberals are just a bunch of snowflakes!"
Child of conservative parent: "So, is it okay if I do that salute at school?"
Conservative parent: "Hell f---ing no!"

What's concerning is that virtually everybody except for a small number of right of center folks and the antidefamation league agree that it was a Nazi salute. And the ADL is likely only covering for it because it wants the Israelis to be able to keep getting their weapons to engage in their crimes against humanity.



cyberdora
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Yesterday, 9:17 pm

the ADL kind of exposed themselves a little here.



cyberdora
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Yesterday, 9:22 pm

roronoa79 wrote:
Conservative parent: "It's clearly not a Nazi salute! Liberals are just a bunch of snowflakes!"
Child of conservative parent: "So, is it okay if I do that salute at school?"
Conservative parent: "Hell f---ing no!"

Watch the video I posted, timestamp 3:27
It's suspiciously identical to a neo-Nazi salute.

I'm not sure Musk spends his precious time watching Hitler videos like trump (who according to his ex-wife, the late Ivanka, he wanted emulate Hitler's oratory skills). But I am sure given Musk's favourable disposition to modern far right groups, I'm almost certain he's seen nazi salutes like the one from the video because that was taken from the news headlines and Musk does monitor current affairs from X.



cyberdora
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Yesterday, 9:25 pm

ASPartOfMe wrote:
The author of the article made the assumption that the only people bringing up Autism are people defending Musk's actions. Are we sure about this? Autism has been cited by people as a cause of mass shootings, break up of families so why not a "Nazi Salute"?

Either way, all these people weaponizing the term Autism for political gain hurt us as a community. The author of the article did not ask me how I feel about it. I feel frustrated.


I think Musk himself has used his autism in the past to excuse his social awkwardness. It's one thing to make socially awkward comments, its another thing to consciously commit to a salute that he must have known would be construed as neo-Nazi.



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Yesterday, 11:54 pm

cyberdora wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
The author of the article made the assumption that the only people bringing up Autism are people defending Musk's actions. Are we sure about this? Autism has been cited by people as a cause of mass shootings, break up of families so why not a "Nazi Salute"?

Either way, all these people weaponizing the term Autism for political gain hurt us as a community. The author of the article did not ask me how I feel about it. I feel frustrated.


I think Musk himself has used his autism in the past to excuse his social awkwardness. It's one thing to make socially awkward comments, its another thing to consciously commit to a salute that he must have known would be construed as neo-Nazi.


A reality TV star on 90 Day Fiancee named Niles keeps using HIS autism as an excuse for a multitude of awful things, like outright LYING, lying by omission, avoiding responsibility, and he's even begun clinging to groupthink lingo terms. He pretends that habitual lying is "masking", for instance.

There's no excuse for his poor behavior and by the same token, no excuse for Musk's either.



cyberdora
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Today, 3:16 am

It's possible Musk has certain compulsions and idiosyncrasies that could be linked to his autism. However, his feeling he should do what he must have known was a Nazi salute (not once but twice) was his own decision. You don't become the world's richest man by make a series of faux pas that infuriate large sections of the population. It may also be a sense he's now untouchable, based on his extraordinary wealth and having the protection of trump.