Absolute Certainty versus Existential Crisis

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16 Oct 2005, 12:55 am

I do believe in a God myself. Not as some dogma or doctrine set out by some religious organization(s) do. I believe that You all must find Your own way for Yourselves.

I see God not as a controlling Us to make Us to do what God wants, for God has giving Us Our freedom to choose, what We want do in Our own lives. To live Our lives the best way We can for Ourselves. For God created Us for a Purpose, that is for Us to get Know God and We to get to Know God Ourselves. For God is intelligent and God created Us to be intelligent also. For God created Us in God's image and We are in God's image.

For these are the thing I myself ponder and wonder about in my life as I am. I see it as a spiritual journey to get to Know God in My life as I am.

That is what God means to Me.

Mithrandir
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16 Oct 2005, 1:36 am

Thagomizer wrote:

Facts are dubious, sometimes dangerous things. Uncertainty and doubt are worse than being certainly wrong, in some cases. The most frustrating thing about religion, to me anyway, is that while I can rationalize why my faith would be worth believing in, and how one could be justified in believing it, I am still not certain that this religion is actually *needed* to explain anything. In the end, virtually all arguments for or against the existence of a supreme being negate each other. If there's a way to know God, I am certain it is not through philosophical reasoning, as that, to quote Ambrose Bierce, is a route of many roads leading from nowhere to nothing.

So I propose a hypothetical question for everyone to answer, no matter what your beliefs. If, somehow, you were faced with irrefutable proof of the existence or non-existence of God, how would you feel? What would you do differently, if anything? As I am not certain at the moment what absolute certainty in either case would do for me, I can currently provide no answer.

"I don't want the Facts, I want the Truth!" Is that what you are saying?
I see lots of Descartes in your arguement.

If what you say is correct then I foresee an apocalypse.

What would I think if I found the proof? First major disbelief. After a while and after lots of scientific input, utter ecstasy. I would be stunned.
The event would dwarf the splitting of the atom.
The problem is human emotion and ambition to what is found out.

I have something for you Thagomizer.
"If evil should exist in this world, it would exist in the heart of mankind."

Thagomizer
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16 Oct 2005, 1:25 pm

Mithrandir wrote:

I see lots of Descartes in your arguement.

I have never read Descartes, and know too little of him to comment. To that I can only say that originality does not exist. My first post, however, is not an argument, but a description of the limits of philosophical reasoning. If I were to argue that one cannot gain any real wisdom through philosophical reasoning, that would be a philosophical argument.

Quote:

If what you say is correct then I foresee an apocalypse.

What about what I said? If someone actually found irrefutable proof about the question of God? No doubt it would. But the thread question is really only concerned with personal truth. Even with the said certainty you may not necessarily be able to share it with others.

Quote:

I have something for you Thagomizer.
"If evil should exist in this world, it would exist in the heart of mankind."

To examine evil I could see it as an absence, rather than a tangible thing, or as a philosophical viewpoint, diametrically opposed to good. But either way you are correct. What this has to do with the thread question I have no idea.

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16 Oct 2005, 2:09 pm

http://www.utm.edu/research/iep/d/descarte.htm

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14 Nov 2005, 4:48 pm

AbominableSnoCone wrote:

Assassin wrote:

No such thing as absolute certainty. 400 years ago they were absolutley certain the world was flat.

Thats not true actually. Columbus discovered America about 500 years ago, and the idea that he was the one who proved that the world was round is a myth... A large percentage of intelligent, educated people at that time had seen evidence that the earth was round. So, its more like 1000 years ago that everyone was certain the Earth was flat

Well, my point was, at ONE TIME they thort the world was flat. Till about the time Galileo (no reference to -Ace lol) came along.

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14 Nov 2005, 9:50 pm

Assassin wrote:

AbominableSnoCone wrote:

Assassin wrote:

No such thing as absolute certainty. 400 years ago they were absolutley certain the world was flat.

Well, my point was, at ONE TIME they thort the world was flat. Till about the time Galileo (no reference to -Ace lol) came along.

Copernicus.
Newton really closed the argument.

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16 Nov 2005, 12:43 am

I've studied the Ainu people a little bit and they believe that there is a form of life in everything. Is it a fact? No. Is it truth? Maybe. Is there an objective truth? Possibly. Is being a being in itself, or is it separate? Does it need the traditional idea of a "god" to be a being?

If there were an irrefutable proof that g0d in christian mythology doesn't exist, I'd be hella happy. In my opinion, if he were a god, he'd kind of be like a baby playing with the Red Button. If I were his dad I'd spank him.

If there were irrefutable proof that there is nothing in everything, well, that's the way I see it. I once remember a scifi teen book in which christopher pike mentioned that the smallest particle is space. So we might as well be space. I'm space, your'e space. We're all nothing. This is an illusion, so there is no being - and since there is no being, there is no god. If that is the irrefutable truth, it would make me very happy indeed. There would be no difference between life and death.

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