I struggle with being "too much" for people; anyone with me?

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That's cool one of my closest friends is 73 (also on the spectrum) and he is pretty unconventional for his age too. Fortunately for him he works in the creative field, so it's easy for him to blend in with other creatives, as they celebrate the unconventional. I see that you're a retired physicist. That is super interesting!

Surely you must realise that by expressing your frustrations with this annoying person in your life in this manner, it inevitably makes me feel bad about the intense nature of my own character, as I obviously identify with this person you are referring to. How can your comment not make me wonder if the people in my own life feel the same way about me as you do about this person? That it's "stressful" and "exhausting" for them to be around me. I've already expressed in my original post that I worry about this very thing - that my shortcomings make people think I'm weird and cause them to dislike me. Your comment is kinda pouring salt on the wound and I fail to see any use to it, unless its intention was to let me know exactly how much I might be annoying others. Correct me if I'm wrong.

My intention was not to bring you down. I could never know how much you are or are not annoying others since I don't know you. The person I was thinking of has good qualities as well as I'm assuming you do too. Also, I'm far from perfect myself.

Ok, so what was your intention? What good, useful or practical thing did you intend for me to gain from your comment? Or was the only purpose of your comment for you to get something off your chest, and perhaps you didn't really consider how it would be read by the author of this thread? I'm not being hard on you for the sake of it; I'm calling out your action because I feel like it was inconsiderate and I'm sure you don't want to come across in that way, so perhaps it's something for you to take away and think about.
As you said, no one is perfect, and I completely understand that being a fellow AS individual you may also struggle to see how you're coming across in a social environment at times, so I want this interaction to be useful. I feel like your original comment wasn't very socially savvy, because it came across as abrasive, which is fine - we all make mistakes and I can understand and forgive that, if you can see where I'm coming from.
But please, if you disagree, let me know what your actual intention was and how I failed to interpret that intention?

One of my closet friends I met in college during a summer work program. I invited him over for a chat. We talked for about 3 hours straight. Let me rephrase that, he talked for about 3 hours straight. After about an hour, I inserted a few words. He immediately picked up on the changing topic and proceeded to talk for another hour. After that I inserted a few more words and he went roaring away on the new topic. After 3 hours, I told him that I had to eat supper and go to bed and asked him to leave. I figured he had years of conversations that were bottled up inside him and they were dying to escape. We have been good friends for over 50 years.

I live a couple thousand miles away from him now. After college I found it difficult to find work. In part this was due to a major engineering recession that struck in the 70's. But after several months of hard looking I finally stumbled into employment. He was also in physics and after graduation found it difficult to find a job. So he went back to school and double majored picking up a degree in mathematics. Anyways after his second graduation, I instructed him on the steps (following after my footsteps) to find a job and he followed them and obtained his first job. I am retired now and so is he after 40 year careers. We met recently and he asked me a question that I guess he had been thinking about for many, many years. He said "What ever possessed me to help him find a job? He said you will never know how dramatically that changed my life forever." I told him that the reason why was because, "He was my friend."

Whoa, Nelly. You should be grateful when people respond to your threads, and not jumping down their throat because of some reaction you had when they did. You should not be "calling out" other members who are valued members of this site.

Your intensity is misguided here. I like Magna, and don't want to see him bullied in this way.

I should be grateful even if his response to my thread is hurtful and not in any way constructive? Should I just zip it and let him say whatever he wants even if its hurtful just because he's a veteran of the community and I'm a newbie? It looks like you're just siding with the person you already know and like. That is incredibly unfair.

I came to this forum, opened up and shared a vulnerability with you all, hoping to meet people who share my struggles and to possibly get some constructive advice. I was grateful for each comment that I got and thanked everyone for their contributions. Then Magna posted a comment which basically said that he knows someone who has the same vulnerability as me and that its exhausting to be around that person. I saw no way in which that comment was constructive and in fact it was very hurtful to me. I let Magna know this and gave him the opportunity to explain himself in case I misunderstood something. How am I bullying him? And please don't invalidate my feelings by saying that my intensity is misguided.

Although originally tempted to be generous toward you, at this point I'm just going to be careful toward you. Got nothing further to say.

I see that you enjoy making definitive statements without justifying a single one of them. How was Magna's comment in any way productive or constructive and not simply inconsiderate? How was I bullying him? Why has my expressing my hurt and aiming to resolve the situation by talking it out made you conclude that you need to be careful of me? It's interesting to see how quickly you've villainised me and yet if you were the good guy here, wouldn't you be able to answer all those questions with ease?

You might take this too personally, treefiddy. Before you bite my head off:

Just because that person is considered exhausting, it doesn't necessarily mean that you are too. People manifest differently and I personally know some intense people who are generally considered very interesting, even fascinating, if on occasion tiring... Keep in mind that "normal" social interaction is supposed to keep on the surface of things and people aren't used to put a lot of emotional and intellectual resources into it. For most NTs - especially extroverts - it's supposed to work the other way around: it should recharge those resources, not deplete them.

I was quite young and immature when I started to find out how other people perceive me and I didn't take it well . In time, I realised on one hand that I can control my behaviour and the impression I leave on people (at least to some extent) and also that I don't have to do that with everybody or all the time - it's my choice when and how I do it. Second, some people are just not a good match, it doesn't mean they hate you or think badly of you: I know a woman who's voice (both pitch and volume) instantly triggers a migraine or tinnitus for me. I don't spend much time around her, but I don't resent her in any way and think she's a very nice person. It's neither her fault or mine we can't be friends.

I think accepting both your nature and the nature of others is a good first step to find a better balance with people and your own emotions too. Sometimes it doesn't matter if they find you "exhausting", you might just not be a good match, and sometimes you can decide to hold back a bit and temper your own behaviour in order to not come across as "too much" right off the bat.

Peace

Thank you for your thoughtful response; I really appreciate it, but I don't think the first thing you said was very kind. Please explain what made you feel compelled to say "before you bite my head off"? What have I said to make you come to that conclusion about my character? Perhaps I am indeed ignorant of some unjust behaviour on my part. BeaArthur accused me of bullying Magna, yet wasn't kind enough to help me understand how my words might have been interpreted as bullying, thus giving me a chance to apologise and correct my behaviour. Ironically, this is exactly what I was trying to do for Magna - to help him understand how his words came across as hurtful.

I will try to help you understand my perspective. I shared a vulnerability of mine on this thread and as far as I could see, Magna's comment was in no way constructive; at best it was simply something he said without thinking, which is fine, as I told him. All I wanted was for him to either acknowledge that he made a mistake - that his comment didn't really have a purpose per se as far as giving me advice or sympathy, and that he didn't really consider how his comment could have come across as abrasive given the context of the thread; or for him to explain if there was in fact an intended purpose to his comment that I failed to see.
I must admit, I expected this whole situation to be resolved quickly, as I assumed upon finding out that his words hurt someone, he would apologise and try to explain himself; instead, I feel like he failed to acknowledge my feelings and tried to brush off his comment as no big deal, without taking the time to make sure everything was ok between us. He then stopped responding and BeaArthur took over and accused me of being a bully and told me basically that I dare not speak out against someone who is "a valued member of the community", thus completely invalidating my feelings or my right to express them due to my being of a lower status on this forum.
I can't help but wonder - if the title of this thread was "I struggle with depression" instead of "I struggle with being "too much" for people", would they have treated me so harshly and elected to basically shun and ignore me rather than talking things out so we can all remain on good terms? I feel like I've been treated unfairly, despite the fact that I've been nothing but kind to the people on this forum and was more than willing to resolve things with Magna from the very beginning.

Also, thank you again for saying that people who are "too much" can also be perceived as interesting and I agree that some people are just incompatible and it's best to accept that everyone is different. Fortunately my best friends and partner all love to chat and share information for hours on end, so I am lucky to have found my tribe of those who can appreciate my intense passion for things.

Magna entered the conversation when the topic turned into a discussion about masking.

He said

Often people will use examples to drive a nail home. Magna's point was that sometimes Masking doesn't turn people off but rather the intensity of the conversation can drive them away. He didn't say you had a problem in this area. He was just trying to describe the topic of masking. It was not a personal attack against you.

You responded with

You obviously took Magna's comments personally.

Magna responded saying

That sounds like an apology to me.

Your response was

Which sounds like either apology not accepted or apology ignored. Magna doesn't know you. He just stumbled across your thread and wanted to interject his thoughts. My close friend that I talked about, who spoke for 3 hours straight when we first met was intense. Very few people can talk for 3 hours straight. I personally liked the intensity. Sometimes intensity can rub off on other people. But many NTs would have stopped him five minutes into the conversation and simply walked away.

ever since i was a kid i've always been really intense. Very talkative, very passionate, outgoing, so I can understand what you mean. For a long time i didn't think i could be autistic for this reason but i found out that these are actually different manifestations of autistic traits.

OK, I'll try:

I perceived Magna's comment as neutral. This thread reminded him of someone he knows and I don't think it was directed at you personally, he was just sharing his experience. After you let him know his comment hurt your feelings, he stated that was not his intention and that his comment wasn't meant to judge either you or his acquaintance - that sounded like an apology to me too. I'm not very familiar with Magna, but I've seen enough of his posts to think he's not a mean spirited person. Personally, I find it useful when I'm told my behaviour can be annoying or exhausting to others, as long as people don't get rude about it.

Your insistence that he did something wrong and your reaction to Bea was the reason for my own comment: I literally thought there's a 50/50 chance to take my comment into consideration or to react aggressively to it. Now, keep in mind, we're all on the spectrum here and misunderstandings happen all the time. There are also a few regulars who have a long history of taking everything personally, even when it has nothing to do with them whatsoever, then attack others and accuse them of ill intentions and offences that exist only in their own minds. Sometimes they cause huge drama over it, threads are being derailed and locked etc and this made some of us cautious when dealing with people who seem inclined to easily take offence.

In this light, I don't think Magna made a mistake, his intentions weren't mean and his post didn't break the rules or attacked you - this is just my opinion, but you can consult a moderator if you see fit. There is no rule here that all replies have to be helpful or supportive, some are just neutral and other times people just disagree with each other, sometimes vehemently, and that's allowed as long as they don't devolve into personal attacks or discriminatory comments. You're new here so you might not know, but The Haven sub-forum is for people who feel vulnerable and look for support and validation/shared experiences. Arguing and debating are not allowed there, even disagreement is discouraged to some extent.

You should also keep in mind that autism or not, people here have very different personalities, views, backgrounds etc. Many of us feel we have to walk on eggshells around people IRL and feel too tired to do it here too. Even if they can come across as abrasive or harsh in their manner, I grew to appreciate greatly some people here because the content of their posts is usually interesting, insightful and essentially helpful, even if their expression can come across as unsympathetic. YMMW.

Oh absolutely, I would do things like invite people without looking around at the circumstances or finding out if something was okay or not.

As for the going into details on interest, I have had the same problem this one new cat cafe opened and I would tell every costumer details about cats from all their names to their behaviors. It was "Do you work here?" Maybe they found me condescending.

First of all, thank you for taking the time to comment and try to help me understand how you perceived the situation.
In response to your comment above - I don't have to perceive it as a direct, personal attack in order to feel hurt. I was hurt because I felt that the comment was inconsiderate of me in the context of this thread (which is about my struggle/insecurity). As I said - I had already expressed my worries about people disliking me for this quality, so he (and you all) knew that it was a sore spot for me. No one can tell me that I don't have the right to feel hurt by something, just because it doesn't make sense to them.
The worst thing about this whole ordeal is that I've been made to feel like he had the right to say what he said, even though he failed to consider my previously mentioned insecurity, but I didn't have the right to get upset by it. Not a single one of you sympathised with me and said something along the lines of "perhaps Magna should have worded his comment in a gentler way considering he knew this topic is something you struggle with." Instead, I feel like everyone is implying that Magna is blameless and I overreacted; this can be incredibly damaging to a person, as its an invalidation of their emotional pain.



His comment was posted on a thread I created talking about myself and my vulnerabilities - this considered, why is it strange that I would relate his comment to myself? But to be honest, I never really believed that he is a mean-spirited individual with the intent to hurt me personally. Despite that, the nature of his comment coupled with the title and content of this thread (me and my insecurity) could have easily been taken badly, so I pointed this out to him and offered him a chance to correct me if I was mistaken.



I have to disagree with you on this because saying "my intention was not to bring you down" can also be interpreted as him excusing his behaviour and implying "well it's not really my problem that you got upset, as it wasn't my intention to bring you down, so I don't have to apologise." Since this interpretation also makes sense, I don't feel like anyone has the authority to tell me that my interpretation was somehow invalid or inferior and that I should just take it as an apology even though I don't necessarily believe that it is one.
Again, I feel like Magna is automatically being perceived favourably and given the benefit of the doubt, whilst I've been automatically perceived as a bully and not given the benefit of the doubt.
In my opinion, if it was a genuine apology, he would have actually said the words "I'm sorry." And I promise you that if he said the simple "Sorry", my next response would have been "that's totally fine; it was just a misunderstanding." And I believe that it could have still been resolved in this way, if we talked it through.



Thank you for your response and attempt to explain you pov.
Please read my response to jimmy m above, as I shared my view of some things which you both addressed, namely how I didn't need to perceive it as a personal attack in order for his comment to be read as hurtful in the context of this thread and also why I didn't believe Magna's reply was a real apology.

I understand that you all must have had experiences with sensitive people who take things too far and that's fair enough, but I must tell you - please don't say to those people "before you bite my head off" or anything of that nature. I really enjoy your comments and have positive feelings towards you, so I hope you don't take this as a dig at you; I just want to be helpful so you don't upset sensitive people in the future. Comments like that can be hurtful because they shame people for their sensitivities and imply that those who are emotional are crazy; the imagery of biting someone's head off is something you would attribute to a monster, and of course that's just a figure of speech, but I hope you can see how it's can come across as judgemental and ostracising.

I believe that Magna's only "crime" was that he didn't consider how a person who struggles with being "too much" could potentially be hurt by a comment of him describing that he finds that quality "stressful and exhausting". As a result of him not giving it much thought, it did hurt someone and everything that happen since then is just a mess which I wish was handled differently by myself as well as others... BeaArthur accused me of bullying which I feel is understandable from an emotional perspective since she was desperate to defend her friend at that point, but the severity of her accusation was unjustified and probably not the best way to handle things. There's definitely a lot to be learned from this whole situation.

The Haven sounds like a place for me only in the sense that I can feel vulnerable at times, but I would never discourage someone to disagree with me, as long as they can explain why; I believe there has been plenty of evidence in this thread that I can acknowledge my flaws. But thank you for recommending it to me.

I respect that everyone here is very different and that misunderstandings probably occur quite often as a result of that. I just wanted to be heard and honest, but I understand that many people don't want to deal with heavy topics or difficult truths, as they may come here to relax. I am more than happy to be considerate of people, but not so readily if they are inconsiderate of me. I hope that doesn't sound too harsh; I feel that it's only fair.