"ladies and gentlemen, honored guests!"

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funeralxempire
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23 Feb 2023, 6:37 pm

Joe90 wrote:
I prefer how things were 30 years ago. There was more acceptance but less wokeism. Gay people were becoming accepted (in the adult world anyway) but being homophobic wasn't frowned upon either. Non-whites were becoming more respected and the racial slurs were becoming unacceptable but there wasn't any "if we don't have any non-white employees then we'll be called a racist, prejudiced company". People were just people, regardless of skin colour, which is how it should be, not race being nitpicked.
And gender was just part of social norms, which if we as autistics have learnt anything it's that social norms are part of life and the minority can't change it. There wasn't as much pressure on gender as there was 60 years ago, people were more free to be who they wanted, and males and females were beginning to be treated as equals (for example, women's rights), but there were still only two genders; male and female. People have been transitioning genders for years so I don't really count that has wokeism. But with all these new names for all these new genders and not being allowed to say certain things any more and looking at a future where gender may no longer exist, it just kind of scares me.
Humans seem to evolve depending on developed lifestyles that become the norm, and I feel that with gender becoming abolished it might lead to the sex of humanity starting to deteriorate until humans don't need a sex any more, everyone will instead physically become genderless, and it will wipe out humanity. Thankfully that won't happen in my lifetime.
Most people view gender as tradition and part of our culture. I mean, I get why people get excited when they first discover what the gender of their baby is, hence the gender reveal parties. Will gender reveal parties become offensive and be banned? It's boring to say "aw, I'm having a baby person". I like "oooh, we're having a baby boy, paint his room blue!" and "oooh, I'm having a baby girl, paint her room pink!" That's what every pregnant woman I have met usually say. When my mum was pregnant she didn't want to find out the gender until we were born, and she said it was always like a lovely surprise.
It just feels cultural and traditional, that's all. Most people I know do agree on this. Do you see what I'm talking about?


I see where you're coming from, but a couple of things I'd bring up.

Many of the same people attacking wokeness now were attacking the tolerance of 30 years as overly politically correct.

Improvements when it comes to sexism or racism or whatever didn't make the problems go away, so the struggles against them had to continue. It's like saying some people should accept being second class citizens because second class is marginally nicer now when really, they're entitled to be 'first class' like everyone else.

People were just people when they tried to talk about being discriminated against, but not so much when they were being mistreated. They were accused of pulling the race card or being feminazis or whatever, no matter what they wanted it was always attacked as too much.

For some reason, everyone knows going backwards on these matters is bad, but a lot of people feel like well, haven't we done enough, isn't a half-assed improvement good enough? and that makes me wonder if they'd tolerate having smaller harms inflicted upon themselves, or if they'd insist that no harms be done to them?

I'd imagine they'd prefer no harms, which is fair. Right now there's people hoping that instead of smaller harms that soon it will be no harms, but apparently that's too woke and smaller harms must be tolerated because the anti-wokes will get angry that change (change that doesn't significantly impact them) is occurring.

My mom was kinda like your mom, she didn't want a boy or a girl, she wanted a healthy baby.


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Joe90
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23 Feb 2023, 6:46 pm

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My mom was kinda like your mom, she didn't want a boy or a girl, she wanted a healthy baby.


My mum didn't want one gender more than the other, as long as the baby was healthy, but she still felt excited at the thought of which gender the baby was going to be. When she was pregnant with my brother she thought he was going to be a girl, so she got a surprise when the midwife handed him to her in the delivery room saying "it's a boy!" Then when she was pregnant with me she thought I was going to be a boy. She wouldn't have minded having two boys of course, then when the midwife handed me to her and said "it's a girl!" she was surprised again. Although I've never been pregnant, I can still imagine that "ooh, is it a girl or a boy??" excitement. But I'm afraid wokeism might abolish the "it's a boy/girl!" exclamation in the delivery room and instead just the boring "it's a baby human!" - something you know already. When the last time a character in a TV soap was having a baby I remember people at work were talking about whether it will be a boy or a girl and everyone seemed to be getting excited about it. Although I don't watch TV soaps much I still got caught up in the excitement and I watched the episode just to see. I just think gender is so interesting and exciting. You can't call me a hater for thinking that (not saying you, just in second person).


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funeralxempire
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23 Feb 2023, 6:58 pm

Joe90 wrote:
Quote:
My mom was kinda like your mom, she didn't want a boy or a girl, she wanted a healthy baby.


My mum didn't want one gender more than the other, as long as the baby was healthy, but she still felt excited at the thought of which gender the baby was going to be. When she was pregnant with my brother she thought he was going to be a girl, so she got a surprise when the midwife handed him to her in the delivery room saying "it's a boy!" Then when she was pregnant with me she thought I was going to be a boy. She wouldn't have minded having two boys of course, then when the midwife handed me to her and said "it's a girl!" she was surprised again. Although I've never been pregnant, I can still imagine that "ooh, is it a girl or a boy??" excitement. But I'm afraid wokeism might abolish the "it's a boy/girl!" exclamation in the delivery room and instead just the boring "it's a baby human!" - something you know already. When the last time a character in a TV soap was having a baby I remember people at work were talking about whether it will be a boy or a girl and everyone seemed to be getting excited about it. Although I don't watch TV soaps much I still got caught up in the excitement and I watched the episode just to see. I just think gender is so interesting and exciting. You can't call me a hater for thinking that (not saying you, just in second person).


It's funny how much people value other people's genders, even in contexts where it might not matter.

I don't think wokeism (or whatever it's being called next year) will abolish people exclaiming that, but it might make people rethink if it's as big of deal. If people don't think it's a big deal, they might not do it, but that's not it being abolished, that's it losing popularity.

That's kinda what I've been getting at all along, a lot of changes are just because people like something else instead or don't care. It's kind of a popularity contest and the people in our bubble don't always reflect the broader world.

Most of the people around where I live also dislike anything they consider woke, but they all define it differently and all have issues where they agree with stances other people would call woke. Probably because 'woke' is just a snarl word in most usages.


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23 Feb 2023, 8:51 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
Trueno wrote:
I quite like “yo, doods!”


A "dude" is still...a dude.

A male person.

Better would be:

"WORD UP! Party people!"


Cant get more "inclusive" than that! :D


That discriminates against non-party people. :lol:

Comrades, join our party.

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https://youtu.be/AbP1DVeJCT0



Where_am_I
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23 Feb 2023, 9:14 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
Joe90 wrote:
I prefer how things were 30 years ago. There was more acceptance but less wokeism. Gay people were becoming accepted (in the adult world anyway) but being homophobic wasn't frowned upon either. Non-whites were becoming more respected and the racial slurs were becoming unacceptable but there wasn't any "if we don't have any non-white employees then we'll be called a racist, prejudiced company". People were just people, regardless of skin colour, which is how it should be, not race being nitpicked.
And gender was just part of social norms, which if we as autistics have learnt anything it's that social norms are part of life and the minority can't change it. There wasn't as much pressure on gender as there was 60 years ago, people were more free to be who they wanted, and males and females were beginning to be treated as equals (for example, women's rights), but there were still only two genders; male and female. People have been transitioning genders for years so I don't really count that has wokeism. But with all these new names for all these new genders and not being allowed to say certain things any more and looking at a future where gender may no longer exist, it just kind of scares me.
Humans seem to evolve depending on developed lifestyles that become the norm, and I feel that with gender becoming abolished it might lead to the sex of humanity starting to deteriorate until humans don't need a sex any more, everyone will instead physically become genderless, and it will wipe out humanity. Thankfully that won't happen in my lifetime.
Most people view gender as tradition and part of our culture. I mean, I get why people get excited when they first discover what the gender of their baby is, hence the gender reveal parties. Will gender reveal parties become offensive and be banned? It's boring to say "aw, I'm having a baby person". I like "oooh, we're having a baby boy, paint his room blue!" and "oooh, I'm having a baby girl, paint her room pink!" That's what every pregnant woman I have met usually say. When my mum was pregnant she didn't want to find out the gender until we were born, and she said it was always like a lovely surprise.
It just feels cultural and traditional, that's all. Most people I know do agree on this. Do you see what I'm talking about?


I see where you're coming from, but a couple of things I'd bring up.

Many of the same people attacking wokeness now were attacking the tolerance of 30 years as overly politically correct.

Improvements when it comes to sexism or racism or whatever didn't make the problems go away, so the struggles against them had to continue. It's like saying some people should accept being second class citizens because second class is marginally nicer now when really, they're entitled to be 'first class' like everyone else.

People were just people when they tried to talk about being discriminated against, but not so much when they were being mistreated. They were accused of pulling the race card or being feminazis or whatever, no matter what they wanted it was always attacked as too much.

For some reason, everyone knows going backwards on these matters is bad, but a lot of people feel like well, haven't we done enough, isn't a half-assed improvement good enough? and that makes me wonder if they'd tolerate having smaller harms inflicted upon themselves, or if they'd insist that no harms be done to them?

I'd imagine they'd prefer no harms, which is fair. Right now there's people hoping that instead of smaller harms that soon it will be no harms, but apparently that's too woke and smaller harms must be tolerated because the anti-wokes will get angry that change (change that doesn't significantly impact them) is occurring.

My mom was kinda like your mom, she didn't want a boy or a girl, she wanted a healthy baby.

Brilliant post, FuneralX.

Just so nobody reading the forum is given the false impression about the UK being great for POC 30yrs ago....

As a POC, I can tell you racism in the UK was rampant 30yrs ago, and racial slurs were not becoming unacceptable. Having racial slurs thrown at us was part of daily life. Being attacked by racist white people was part of daily life. Being frightened for your and your family's safety when they were in a predominantly white area, was part of daily life.

I don't get why certain white people think they have the right to speak about racist experiences they know nothing about.

As a side note, Essex is full of racists.

Oh and since Brexit, it's gone back to how it was 30yrs ago.....racist as f**k because the racists no longer have to hide how they really feel about us.


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Last edited by Where_am_I on 23 Feb 2023, 10:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Sonic200
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23 Feb 2023, 10:38 pm

Joe90 wrote:
I like "ladies and gentlemen". Just sounds so traditional and formal. Why do things have to change?


What do you think about people being required to say "happy holidays" instead of "merry Christmas"?



funeralxempire
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23 Feb 2023, 10:42 pm

Sonic200 wrote:
What do you think about people being required to say "happy holidays" instead of "merry Christmas"?


How do you feel about people being required to say "merry Christmas" instead of "happy holidays"?
:chin:


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23 Feb 2023, 10:47 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
Sonic200 wrote:
What do you think about people being required to say "happy holidays" instead of "merry Christmas"?


How do you feel about people being required to say "merry Christmas" instead of "happy holidays"?
:chin:


I have never heard of this, but some retail stores require the employees to say "happy holidays" to the customers. They don't allow them to say "merry Christmas." I don't know of places that require employees to do the opposite.



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23 Feb 2023, 11:34 pm

Sonic200 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Sonic200 wrote:
What do you think about people being required to say "happy holidays" instead of "merry Christmas"?


How do you feel about people being required to say "merry Christmas" instead of "happy holidays"?
:chin:


I have never heard of this, but some retail stores require the employees to say "happy holidays" to the customers. They don't allow them to say "merry Christmas." I don't know of places that require employees to do the opposite.


When I worked in a call centre it was policy that we were expected to say Merry Christmas, basically because too many people in Florida would be offended by happy holidays.

I've never had an employer in any customer service job mandate 'happy Holidays' even if it's my default.

Once the issue became politicized no matter what you say someone will complain.


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24 Feb 2023, 2:39 am

Sonic200 wrote:
Joe90 wrote:
I like "ladies and gentlemen". Just sounds so traditional and formal. Why do things have to change?


What do you think about people being required to say "happy holidays" instead of "merry Christmas"?


It is a cultural thing to say Merry Christmas. I don't see what's so offensive about it. Soon they'll abolish Christmas, to make who happy?
I don't even have a religion but I still celebrate Christmas.
And isn't calling it "winter festival" offensive to Australians because their Christmas is in the height of summer?

It was only until I reached adulthood was when I learned that the "eenie meenie minee mo" rhyme had replaced the N-word with "tiger". I always thought it was originally "tiger", and kids used that rhyme a lot in the playground. So they'd changed that before my time. Changing that isn't political correctness though, it's just plain offensive to have the N-word in the first place because it makes it sound like black people are animals or something. But that was how life was way back before my time.

Please stop implying that I'm a racist. I am NOT.

Quote:
Oh and since Brexit, it's gone back to how it was 30yrs ago.....racist as f**k because the racists no longer have to hide how they really feel about us.


What???
I voted remain, by the way.


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24 Feb 2023, 2:58 am

Sonic200 wrote:
Joe90 wrote:
I like "ladies and gentlemen". Just sounds so traditional and formal. Why do things have to change?


What do you think about people being required to say "happy holidays" instead of "merry Christmas"?


Required?


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24 Feb 2023, 2:58 am

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As a side note, Essex is full of racists


oh thanks


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24 Feb 2023, 1:56 pm

babybird wrote:
Sonic200 wrote:
Joe90 wrote:
I like "ladies and gentlemen". Just sounds so traditional and formal. Why do things have to change?


What do you think about people being required to say "happy holidays" instead of "merry Christmas"?


Required?


Sometimes an employer will mandate 'this is our preferred greeting to avoid flak'.

When I did tech support for Bright House they communicated that we were expected to use "Merry Christmas".


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24 Feb 2023, 2:01 pm

In one of my husband's former workplaces, the only person to send "Merry Christmas" to everyone was... a Muslim Arab.


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24 Feb 2023, 2:58 pm

magz wrote:
In one of my husband's former workplaces, the only person to send "Merry Christmas" to everyone was... a Muslim Arab.


They ain't really going to stop people saying Merry Christmas, are they? I mean, come on.
This is why people become anti-PC. It's not that we want to argue or anything, it's just things like this make a lot of people roll their eyes and worry about a future where so many common phrases are cancelled just because someone might be offended. Then it makes us sound racist, but we're originally not racists.
Years ago racism meant offensive stereotyping and discriminating needlessly against a race. Now it just means having an opinion or getting one's facts wrong or just feeling pissed off with all the PC crap that's being shoved down our throats.

Who has got offended by Merry Christmas? I'm certainly not offended by it, and I'm an atheist.


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24 Feb 2023, 3:09 pm

Joe90 wrote:
Who has got offended by Merry Christmas? I'm certainly not offended by it, and I'm an atheist.

Muhammad wasn't offended as well.
Actually, so far, I haven't encountered anyone who were.


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