would you have rather have been downs, cerebal palsy, or....

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AnAutisticMind
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29 May 2009, 2:33 pm

have muscular dystrophy, or non autistic mental retardation??

you are much luckier than you think in life....count your blessings

if anyone here has any one of those afflictions, please don't think i am being insensitive....this is an aspie/autism site, so i am comparing those afflictions with autism...and i would appreciate any feelings you might have with your afflictions

and if anyone who has autism along with any of those others, i say god bless you


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KingdomOfRats
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29 May 2009, 3:35 pm

no one is luckier,or worse off,it's definitely not judgeable by the label.

One lady am went to the same classes in special school with had quite obvious MR,but she went on to do voluntary work as a steward at the commonwealth games in manchester,and got a job out of it,she used to go all over the country as a steward for concerts,and did the major queen one a while back [as in the band queen,not the royalty queen].
She's worked in security as well,even though she used to steal from everyone at school.

Am have a CP-type condition affecting left side,[am say cp-type and not cp,as the hospital lost the records three times,whilst going through testing,had refused to be dragged in to redo it all again],it's mild and not a big thing,causes problems with the way am walk [stiff,jerky,wonky walk from left], and struggle with raised edges and stairs unless use other leg to go up each one first,almost all support staff am have know nothing about history with cp,only one found out this week when was wearing a new leg brace,they asked mum about it.
Point to mentioning this,is,CP like Autism and AS-differ a lot in experiences and severity,up until recently,another thing they all have in common is people with the most profound forms can have better quality of lives than people with weaker forms.
Wishing had another disability would be silly as they're just as unique and left to fate as ASDs are.
Try to deal with having autism/AS/PDDNOS/Retts,rather than wishing were something different as that'll never happen,can only make the most of what have got already.


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29 May 2009, 3:58 pm

i'd still rather be normal.

which i am not.

therefore, i am sad.


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29 May 2009, 4:06 pm

KOR is right.

Autism can be very mild - a person with mild autism/ Asperger's Syndrome might be able to have friends, have a family, get a job etc. Autism can also be very severe, some people with autism cannot take care of themelves and cannot communicate sufficiently in any way. Cerebal palsy varies even more - some people just walk funny and have mild problems, some forms are severe and cause problems with breathing and swallowing and cause the sufferer to die as a child.
As for Down's Syndrome, I've noticed a lot of people on here think that mental retardation and Down's Syndrome are always really bad. They can be, obviously, but according to the Down's Syndrome association, one in five with Down's are in paid employment.

It is silly to compare things really, and say who is worse off - there will always be people worse off than us. There are people living in very poor countries who do not have enough to eat and die from preventable, curable diseases. It does not do any good to compare, I don't think.



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29 May 2009, 5:01 pm

I wholeheartly agree with KOR as well, no one is luckier, i volunteer at a childrens specialized hospital in long term care unit ranging from severe MR, cerebral palsy, brain damage, down syndrome, severe autism, to everything you can think of, but none of them are easier or better off or luckier. I think each handicap has its problems and has its differculties no matter the severity and diagnosis.

KingdomOfRats wrote:
no one is luckier,or worse off,it's definitely not judgeable by the label.

One lady am went to the same classes in special school with had quite obvious MR,but she went on to do voluntary work as a steward at the commonwealth games in manchester,and got a job out of it,she used to go all over the country as a steward for concerts,and did the major queen one a while back [as in the band queen,not the royalty queen].
She's worked in security as well,even though she used to steal from everyone at school.

Am have a CP-type condition affecting left side,[am say cp-type and not cp,as the hospital lost the records three times,whilst going through testing,had refused to be dragged in to redo it all again],it's mild and not a big thing,causes problems with the way am walk [stiff,jerky,wonky walk from left], and struggle with raised edges and stairs unless use other leg to go up each one first,almost all support staff am have know nothing about history with cp,only one found out this week when was wearing a new leg brace,they asked mum about it.
Point to mentioning this,is,CP like Autism and AS-differ a lot in experiences and severity,up until recently,another thing they all have in common is people with the most profound forms can have better quality of lives than people with weaker forms.
Wishing had another disability would be silly as they're just as unique and left to fate as ASDs are.
Try to deal with having autism/AS/PDDNOS/Retts,rather than wishing were something different as that'll never happen,can only make the most of what have got already.


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29 May 2009, 5:11 pm

AS do have a few good sides, like the way someone with AS can truly enjoy living as a hermit.



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29 May 2009, 5:18 pm

Zoonic wrote:
AS do have a few good sides, like the way someone with AS can truly enjoy living as a hermit.


haha


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Padium
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30 May 2009, 9:41 am

How about we look at something that truly has no upside to it? I am transexual, this means I will end up changing my entire identity to live as who I should be, and give up almost everything in life at some point. But in the end, I have heard that people with this condition tend to appreciate their gender (after changing it) more than people born into it... Hmmm... I guess there is an upside. I am sure I could find an upside to all of those conditions as well, even if it is just a greater appreciation of what you do have. We as humans take a lot of stuff for granted, and don't realise how lucky we are to have what we have until we either have it taken from us, or suffer in some other way. I didn't choose to be born with any of the conditions I have, so instead of wishing they were something else, I attampt to live with them, and make the most out of my life while managing them. If I can't do that, then what point is there to living?

When we try dissociate ourselves from our afflictions, rather than learning to live with them, we create a world where we can only move backwards, and not forewards towards our end goal.



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30 May 2009, 10:31 am

Hell no! Autism/Asperger's Syndrome are much cooler than those lame afflictions you speak of. I asked my brother about this once (who is nt) and he agreed that having autism would be far superior to having down syndrome (for example) because autism is extremely mysterious.
For example with autism you may magically start having magical mathematical prowess one day, whereas with down syndrome you're basically screwed.



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30 May 2009, 10:45 am

Padium wrote:
How about we look at something that truly has no upside to it? I am transexual, this means I will end up changing my entire identity to live as who I should be, and give up almost everything in life at some point. But in the end, I have heard that people with this condition tend to appreciate their gender (after changing it) more than people born into it... Hmmm... I guess there is an upside. I am sure I could find an upside to all of those conditions as well, even if it is just a greater appreciation of what you do have. We as humans take a lot of stuff for granted, and don't realise how lucky we are to have what we have until we either have it taken from us, or suffer in some other way. I didn't choose to be born with any of the conditions I have, so instead of wishing they were something else, I attampt to live with them, and make the most out of my life while managing them. If I can't do that, then what point is there to living?

When we try dissociate ourselves from our afflictions, rather than learning to live with them, we create a world where we can only move backwards, and not forewards towards our end goal.


Well, if you're changing from female to male, then there are lots of upsides to it. For example, testosterone will allow you to experience extreme horniness, the likes of which you cannot possibly imagine (and highly enjoyable I might add). Anyway, so long as you have you health. (And this is directed to anyone on this forum). I can assure that there are ways to enjoy life.



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30 May 2009, 11:06 am

If I had my choice I wouldn't even be a human. I'd be a dolphin and hope that I never had to see one. I would swim as far away from them as possible and hope they wouldn't have the technology to out distance me.

Why is it everyone thinks human is the species to be? Are they really that great?



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30 May 2009, 11:31 am

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
Why is it everyone thinks human is the species to be? Are they really that great?


We actually covered that very issue in my Phil 220 class, Morals and Ethics. The issue has to do with human sentience. As a dolphin, which is the closest animal to having human sentience, you would not likely be able to rationalize those feeling ou have desiring to be such. From the argument of sentience, and self awareness, they go into the issue of animal rights, and how humans have the obligation to act in their best interest, while preserving our own (yes we can eat meat, but we still need to treat livestock with dignity). But based on this, humans have a higher capacity for both sorrow and happiness, so we can have greater ups, and greater downs. The ideal situation where we experience more, and higher, of these ups does make the experience of being human superior, however, in the case of someone who primarily feels depression, being an animal, and not being capable of the same despair, would be superior. And thus comes speciesism...



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30 May 2009, 11:58 am

Padium wrote:
We actually covered that very issue in my Phil 220 class, Morals and Ethics. The issue has to do with human sentience. As a dolphin, which is the closest animal to having human sentience, you would not likely be able to rationalize those feeling ou have desiring to be such. From the argument of sentience, and self awareness, they go into the issue of animal rights, and how humans have the obligation to act in their best interest, while preserving our own (yes we can eat meat, but we still need to treat livestock with dignity). But based on this, humans have a higher capacity for both sorrow and happiness, so we can have greater ups, and greater downs. The ideal situation where we experience more, and higher, of these ups does make the experience of being human superior, however, in the case of someone who primarily feels depression, being an animal, and not being capable of the same despair, would be superior. And thus comes speciesism...

Pffft, humans don't even act in the best interests of other humans how can you count on them to act in the best interests of dolphins? Which is why I agree with those who think there should be special areas for creatures like dolphins where humans are not allowed in that way there's a place for them to go when they've had enough.
That's a very nice essay, Padium, but to think humans respect sentience in any form is looking at the world thru rose colored glasses. Some humans do, but a lot do not and they have a lot of influence in the world. They don't care about anything but profit and they pretty much run America. Who can deny it?
They pretend to care about sentience when it's convenient for them but do they really? Most likely, not.
Only when they can get something out of it. $$$$$$$



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30 May 2009, 12:08 pm

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
Why is it everyone thinks human is the species to be? Are they really that great?



Are any species really that great?

Some would fare better in some environments than others I suppose.


Actually, I've decided I'd rather be me, whatever junk and joy I have to go through on the way.

That's because I don't have a choice and other people don't have a choice to be someone else.

You can't be anyone else other than who you were born to be: this goes for all genetic conditions and the human condition.

How "better off" and happy you feel you are is part perception and part situation.



Last edited by AmberEyes on 30 May 2009, 12:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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30 May 2009, 12:08 pm

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
Pffft, humans don't even act in the best interests of other humans how can you count on them to act in the best interests of dolphins? Which is why I agree with those who think there should be special areas for creatures like dolphins where humans are not allowed in that way there's a place for them to go when they've had enough.
That's a very nice essay, Padium, but to think humans respect sentience in any form is looking at the world thru rose colored glasses. Some humans do, but a lot do not and they have a lot of influence in the world. They don't care about anything but profit and they pretty much run America. Who can deny it?
They pretend to care about sentience when it's convenient for them but do they really? Most likely, not.
Only when they can get something out of it. $$$$$$$


True as that may be, it is still our duty to take the best interest of animals into consideration when doing things. How can an entire nation learn to do what is right if noone starts that wave? All it takes is one stone thrown into a pond to create a ripple which grows and evetually reaches the entirety of that pond, and as more people decide to throw their stones in as well, the ripples grow in number and strength, until the pond is consumed by the change in its waters. This is how any change occurs on such a large scale.



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30 May 2009, 12:28 pm

Padium, you would have to limit where people can live and they are not gonna have that. You think people in the US would let the govt or anyone else push them off properties for animals? My plan calls for regional cities and everything else pretty much rural but no one is gonna go for it. They want to live where they want and they aren't going to have it any other way. If people really cared about animals, so many of them wouldn't be endangered and they would have places to live which they don't. I don't think it's likely they will in this profit driven world. It's profiteering that robs them of habitat.

Ambereyes, I think aquatic life of all kinds and birds are actually luckier in many cases, than humans. The only downside to being a bird is most of them don't make it out of the nest because their siblings push them out too early and they die but if one makes it out and goes on to fly it would be a cool existence so long as no one shoots it and it doesn't get eaten.