How to ruin friendships, ... ask an aspi

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I've always had difficulties with friendships. Always had few (but good) friends (nevertheless).

Aspis struggle with relationships. I'm just fascinated by the process that ruins the friendships.

One thing I noticed as an aspi myself is that I can have a long memory for someone's mistakes. And taking things literally does not really help either.

My colleague (aspi in denial) screws it up by "ratcheting up" a conflict and never easing up on her ratcheted-up stance afterwards. There is no recourse or revisit of a conflict. Words are set in stone, forgiving appears not to exist in her aspi mind.

The result of this behavior is that intense friendships may be short lived; which makes me feel sad. She is a good friend, however, over time, conflict will ensue, and every new conflict is a scratch on a shiny surface called friendship. Also, the issues that are the subject of the conflict are big pink elephants in the room. Over time the number of elephants grows and grows, unfortunately they won't die.

Does this description look familiar?

To me: a lot. It's a family thing running through our veins as well as an educational one. It's very difficult to reverse the process.

Ditto all of the above. I think also being a female, women expect a certain level of sympathy/empathy which I'm just not capable of offering.

I think my problem seems to be that I am generally very nice, calm, don't leave the house much and people tend to... flock to me at first. They think I'm so wonderful with the kids, and "we get to paint at Liz's house" "we get to help make cupcakes at Liz's house" etc. So all of a sudden I'm this wonderful person living up the street that people want to meet. I'm always respectful of others for the most part, and am very naive... tend to take them at face value. How they present their self to me is how it is perceived, and when that vision changes... I won't accept it pretty much... but that usually doesn't happen. People always tell me "actions speak louder than words" and I'm just not getting the signals that I shouldn't be around these people.... anyway...

Then, they cling to me and I start shaking them off quickly once it happens. I'd rather be friends with their kids than them, personally, I am finding in many cases.

It seems, I'm not attracting the normal, every day people... but it seems quite the opposite, the most unstable of people seem to head to me. So far on my street, I have had 4 friends.

One only talked to me to get things from me all of the time. Part of my food stamps (yes, she came to me for my govt. assistance since I am having difficulty being able to work), and money here and there if she could get it from me. Since I have told her "no" 2 times, and once my son said to her when she pulled up "whatever you're looking for, you can just go home 'cuz mom doesn't have it to give you any more". That's pretty bad when an 8 year old recognizes the problem on his own.

The next is a nurse that lives right next door... she's very nice, but has this whole chaotic feel to her. It's like you can just tell she's ready to snap on someone when she gets a chance, but she always looks super super happy.

Another is a guy up the street who drinks all the time... a very nice guy, but still, ya know.

The last is the friend I just posted about not too long ago in "How do you 'break up' with a friend?". It turned out it seemed, to resolve itself... because she's been letting me parent her child for all summer pretty much, and finally decided she didn't like it when I told her child exactly what I thought the other night. She hasn't called since, or returned my call from that night, nor has she responded to questions about school via e-mail. Granted, it's only been 2 days, but after talking to someone every day all the time (very draining), when they just up and stop talking to you after you finally snap at their child, I think it's safe to say that's it, lol, and to be honest.... I'm glad I snapped at her and got that response... saves me the trouble of having to figure out how to do it on my own.

It is different when you don't have kids though... I'm not sure what I would be like without them, because everyone I've met has been because their children at one point or another used to come play at Liz's house... which is apparently some forbidden zone only the best kids get to go into, and they all love it here for some strange reason... I really don't understand it quite frankly... and every single one of them I've stopped talking to, has been because of my children's needs and them intruding or just flat out not caring about them one bit.

Wow! Thanks for your contributions. The thing that I forgot to mention is this, this pretty much describes how exactly things can go awry, (the two next paragraphs offer some context, then I describe my brains, and how they react):

Yesterday she and I left the office at the same time. I'd had a very busy week, not even a weekend, so I worked for a dozen of days in one row on a file for which a deadline had to be postponed several times. The deadline is now set some weeks from now, but I'm fed up with the file, and a different colleagues has not lifted a finger on this file. Now it is his turn.

In the elevator on the way downstairs we discussed the new deadline, the fact that I was sick and tired of this file, and my slacking colleague. Then she says: "Well, you have still a couple of working days ahead of you, you may even finish it." Later on, I realized that NT's might find such a remark offensive, I worked my ass off on this file, then suggesting that I am planning to shirk and that I have ample time to finish ... grrr!

Just when I realized the lack of empathy in her suggestion, I felt being offended and then a storm in my brain started raging, much like a PC that suddenly devotes all its processing time to one particular process, crowding out other processes. This gets worse when I'm tired. Luckily this time the storm ended quickly, and did not evolve into a full melt down.

However, a week ago I made a very similar remark and she felt offended. Her brains are faster, and the storm developed into a controlled rage within seconds. She was angry with me, "You just offended me deeply, this is the second time you make such a remark, this is really serious." I told her that it was not the intention to offend, but alas, it was too late. I then handed her a hand-written apology. That, in the end, saved me from hell. An hour later we were good again, but still, a new scratch.

These mind-occupying process and the associated anger can ruin friendships. Due to mere introspection, I discovered that it is an Aspi thing. NT's however, may just ditch her after a couple of these scratches.

Last edited by Hermien on 29 Aug 2009, 12:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

My aspie female wife has a memory like an elephant & has a hard time forgetting a slight or offence, real or imagined. Another thing is after we've had a dissagreement she'll never be the first to try & patch things up so I always have to be the one to try & smooth things out. She'd sit there stewing mad for days at a time, all the while getting madder rather than (ever) being the "bigger person. Me? I've got stuff to do & a life to live so I can't waste energy on some stupid fight for very long.

In her credit I will say this though. Since she got her official dx & started on meds she is 100% better. Like a new person almost. For the first time in her life I can see her being able to let some of the little stuff go (rather than obsessing on it) and being much much better at being able to see another persons point of view or perspective.

I've been told I'm way too forgiving. I had to learn how to hold a grudge to keep repeat offenders from hurting me over and over.

even though I'm forgiving and tend to accept other people's quirks, I don't have deep lasting friendships because I don't make many friends, except for two I believe I would still be spending time with if I lived near them. we've stayed in touch over the years.

I guess the people I tend to make friends with are as quirky as me and we usually end up drifting apart when it's not convenient to stay in touch. I haven't had any real conflicts with friends. just certain family members and a few co-workers.

My NT wife has this as well, she can bring these ancient issues up in any argument we have. This isn't an AS thing at all IMO.

To add to the post, I have trouble letting go, too. Almost like attaching to something like a male angler fish to a female angler fish.

But then, when you can let go, it feels better than anything. Usually, I bottle up feelings to deal with them later. Then they explode in my face after I open the bottle. This is mainly the reason why I can start crying at random times. I just can't ever let go.

Last edited by Lung_Drac on 29 Aug 2009, 2:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I am a 100% idiot when it comes to friendship

I only ever manage to form 1 to 1 friendships - any other person gets involved, and invariably, they do - the whole thing falls apart very quickly.

I never form relationships with other men - even my step-father & I only really pass occasional words between us & he's been "family" for over 25 years - there's not really anything more I can (or want to) say on that subject.

If I'm trying to form a friendship with a woman...well, I'm never sure what goes wrong but my attempts @ "conversation-lite" are pretty feeble and disjointed: I rarely go out socially, I can never remember what was on TV last night, let alone who was in the show or the character's names or anything more than a brief outline of what went on; trying to talk about movies that I've seen is impossible for the same reasons, I can always remember what these things FELT like for me, the ambiance, the mood, the light and how they connected with me inside but these things are difficult to put into words (probably pointless too).

I can get into hours-long philosophical debates and really "connect" (?? - who knows - it's strange but, thinking about it, I prefer it if we take opposite sides??) on beliefs and issues but where shared interests are concerned, even if we have a lot in common, I find it difficult to sustain a meaningful conversation.

Usually someone far more interesting than me turns up, even when I think I'm getting somewhere and we are starting to bond, and the whole thing falls apart.

To be perfectly truthful though, when I say "We are starting to bond" what I mean is "I am starting to bond" - I have never yet been able to say whether someone likes me or not - the only way I can tell if a relationship is going somewhere is if a woman literally jumps on me and that has happened twice in my entire life; as for everyone else, the script is "well they're not ignoring me or telling me what an as*hole I am, so maybe..."

It used to be the cause of endless depressions and "what is wrong with me?" soul-searching for me but nowadays I shut out 99.9% of people emotionally - it's not as though I hate them for being normal - it's just far less traumatic for me.

The few people that get through to me nowadays can cause some major meltdowns for me though, for a start there's still the one or two that seem interested in friendship to begin with then move on as soon as they realize the kind of person they are dealing with - that still hurts for a week or so...

Then there's the very few that decide to hang around in spite of it all - silly buggers that they are - mostly I'm very laid back and forgiving of people's errors of judgement, but, particularily where people cause me problems on a mental / emotional level then I'd have to agree with Hermien, I have a long memory for people's mistakes and even when they are "forgiven", there's always that build-up of scratches and there's always one more elephant in the room with us - to the point where there is no room for "us".

Once that point has been reached - once the Rubicon has been crossed - the breakdown is frighteningly fast and, so far, has always been irreversable; the effects are devastating for me and can last months or even years.

To this point in my life, I have never had a diagnosis for AS, the truth of the matter is, the first time I even went to a doctor & said "Doc, I think I may have AS - I did these tests..." was this Thursday just gone; I've known all my life that I was "different" though.

Would it have ever helped so far? I don't know.

Would my relationships have been any different? I have no idea.

Will I be able to let anyone get close enough for me to know if knowing makes a difference? who can say.

Would I tell them? I reckon so.

Will they run a mile? ...

Did I answer your question? probably not.

I've never experienced the same kind of friendships as everyone else. People tend to benefit from their friendships, enjoy having them, view them as lifelines of sorts. Mine become distorted.
When I was a kid, I had friends I thought were fabulous, really liked being with them and, suddenly, they either moved or their parents created distance between me and them. Later, I was the one who created the distance because "friends" became control freaks who tried to wreck my life when I wasn't around or "mold" me into what they wanted.
My experience with more than one friend is: The two (or more) friends ignore and act all pissed off when I'm with them and talk to each other and treat me like crap. How rude! I put up with it for a while but I get to the point where I simply stop answering the phone when they call and forget I knew their name.
Anyway it becomes more of a chore than a benefit to have them. A source of great stress instead of comfort.

I'm so sorry to read that! Take care.

When I was 12-15 having friends was fairly simple, t'was about being immature and having fun, but as I got older (18 now) my "friends" seem to grow up without me and it got too complex with parties and social gatherings....The expectations on me as a person grew until I couldn't handle it anymore

The way I stopped being friends with them was just to casually ignore them until they stopped bothering...

I've had really close friends in the form of strange social outcasts such as myself but I lost contact with them

I don't even bother to seek companionship now unless the person has some sort of mental or social problem
That sounds prejudice but it's just simpler because they seem to be more on my "level" I suppose

Although friendship deterioration happens almost instantly when I'm friends with someone
It's always the same process as well.....rusting away into dismal nothingness

I would love to be friends with someone with AS like myself but I don't know of anyone near me with it and I never really leave the house

Sorry I'm a bit depressed currently

Cheers!