In Denial?

Post Reply New Topic

Please give me some feedback on this:

I think my 14 yr old AS son is in denial regarding his diagnosis. He appears to be spending all his time and energy in school trying to fit in and be "normal." Its to the point where he has been trying to fit in with the tough guys in school, to whom failing grades, detentions, and even suspensions are cool. He is trying to maintain a tough guy image, even though he really is a nice, sweet kid who couldn't and wouldn't hurt a fly. The funny thing is, all the teachers and school administrators know this. However, what's not so funny is that he is not doing any work in school and intentionally getting bad grades, even though he's totally capable of aceing any class he sets his mind to.

My questions for this forum are: Does my assessment of the situation make sense, particularly the "in denial" part? How do I help him get out of denial and accept himself for who he is? I feel that if I can accomplish this, then maybe he'll buckle down in school and pass his classes. Is this too simplistic? Thanks in advance for your feedback.

Looks like he thinks if he is like everyone else and fits in, he won't have AS. He probably doesn't want to be different and defined by the label. I used to have the same attitude.

I used to see kids in my class failing their work because they refuse to do it but I did mine so I felt happy and special. It took me nearly three years to accept my diagnoses. Before, I thought I could get rid of it.

Maybe the opposite -- hyper-aware of being different, and not wanting to be. Maybe it's a way to get away from the AS == "nerd" stereotype?

Bad as it is, at that age there is defintely a 'right' and 'wrong' way to be, and reinforced more so than any other time in life. (I know you probably know that, just thinking out loud here...) "Sweet kid" is just so not respected in males by peers at 14. Maybe among some rare friends, but I sure didn't have any like that at that age. You're supposed to be "putting away childish ways" and "manning up"... the messages are everywhere in the culture, reflected by other kids, etc. etc.

Being a sweet kid (especially male) at that age is probably the hardest kind of kid to be.

Maybe it's a matter of the idea that there are positive images/examples of masculinity that don't include flunking classes. That you can be respected (boys won't pick on you, and girls will like you) and get good grades at the same time. I feel clueless as how to convey that convincingly to a kid, tho.

I remember an interview of Dave Chappelle, where he described how in his high school only the boys with money had girlfriends, and the only way to get money was to sell crack. (My point is not to bash the girls; they were brainwashed, too.) There are just all these reinforcing, interlocking, cultural forces that conspire against kids in powerful ways.

Regardless of why he wants to hang out w/the knuckleheads I think my immediate concern would be that they would take advantage of his "niceness" & get him to do something bad that will get him in trouble.

Maybe take him down to the local jail & see if they'll let you do a "scared straight" routine w/him. He's got it in his mind that these goofs are "cool" but I'm not sure if that would be the case if he saw where that kind of life leads.

I guess this solves the riddle of "Is he failing on purpose or do I not just understand him?" Good luck with this. He sounds like a smart kid but the teenage years are filled with peril & drama. If you can get him through this, and into college & on his own he should be oK. It's getting him through the next few years without too much self inflicted damage that can be tough.

I have heard of kids doing this even without a diagnosis. Kids who want to fit in will fall to peer pressure and immitate the ones they think are popular. His diagnosis is most likely causing it in his case, but since vulnerable NT kids do this too, why not seperate the issues.

Don't connect this problem with getting him to accept his diagnosis. Just focus on all the reasons a parent would give an NT kid not to do this. HEe sounds very intelligent, so although it could take a while, you should be able to get it accross that this is a bad idea. A few examples of how it would go wrong for an NT kid might help, as might suggesting a more safe group within the 'normal' kids at school to try to play to.

Just my thoughts.

It sounds like he wants to fit in in some way (many AS kids do, even when they accept their diagnosis) but in a typical AS way has found what appears to be a solution, but really isn't. Let me ask you, ARE those kids accepting him now that he is doing poorly in school? I honestly doubt it. It's probably an illusion, but he doesn't see enough to understand what else bonds those kids. He sees the obvious, and assumes that if he copies it, he'll be a part of the group.

It sounds like you are solving the first mystery, however, on why he is doing so poorly, so I commend your progress. It is important progress. You can't solve what you don't understand, and I think you're onto something here.

Azharia is right, I think the issue should be addressed separate from accepting or not accepting a diagnosis. Talk with him about how he is or isn't like those kids. What their goals are and how they plan to meet them, IF they have a plan, and what his goals are. Ask what he knows about their families lives, everything. Ask how he feels being with them, and questions about how they treat him. Talk about his goals, and how this situation will affect them. Help him see how associating with these kids fits into everything else he values.

Well, I dont think your son is in denial. That would indicate that he doesn't think he has AS, and that your crazy for thinking that.

I think the more accurate description (assuming your assumption about him failing on purpose in order to impress other people is accurate) is that he is placing too high of a value on how he thinks others perceive him. He is acting under the assumption that his grades are of lower importance then his social standing. And I can entirely understand this view point. Grades in 8th grade are fairly pointless. They dont go on permanent records, they dont affect college applications or getting scholarships. Your employer's wont see them. It really is entirely a waste of time trying to get As and Bs. Whereas his current standing amongst his peers has immediate and measurable significance. If he fits in with a crowd, then other people will acknowledge, and respect him. And when everybody in your class treats you as an inferior second class citizen because you act weird, getting somebody to acknowledge and respect you is important. I certainly cant blame your son for coming to the conclusion that he did.

However, what he is likely doing is failing to completely understand the full implications of his priorities, and how they will affect things in the future. Getting poor grades now is no problem. But starting next year, grades actually count for something, and that is a bad time to be behind the class because you didn't pay attention last year. And if you start doing well next year, you will lose your friends, putting you back at square one. Also, being respected by your peers for acting like an idiot is a fairly hollow victory. You may wan to read my post on a similar topic I just posted:

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt111775.html

While your son may not be far off with his analysis, he has probably not considered all aspects of the plan through to completion.

All that to say(if your assumption about him failing on purpose in order to impress other people is accurate), you may want to sit down with your son and have a discussion about priorities. For example, what is important, and also WHY(capitalized for emphasis) is it important. Why should your son care about his grades? What is in it for him in the long run? Why is doing poorly in order to make friends a bad idea? What are the end results of his current course of action? What other alternatives are there for finding people who accept and respect you?

And as simple as this may sound, encourage your son to play games or do activities with other people that he is good at. If you are good at soccer, then generally people are impressed by you and your team mates are likely to accept you. In my case I enjoyed playing video games on an online server. I became very good at the game, and knew a lot of other players. We chatted, and I enjoyed playing with them, or against them in a friendly rivalry. My parents for some reason have the belief that if you can't physically see the person, then you can't talk to them, or be friends with them. I don't know why this idea exists, but I do know that for many years, the only people who actually accepted me and treated me like a person were my online friends.

So, find out what your son is good at, what he enjoys, and encourage him to get into a group with other people who have the same hobby, so that they can be mutual friends with each other, and perhaps fill some of your son's need for peer approval in a less dangerous way.

Hi everyone, I just wanted to say thank you for all of your thoughts on this. Its really helpful to be able to get a variety of perspectives.

During high school I did something very similar to avoid the "dork" label, in denial about my diagnosis despite my parents frequently reminding me how much of a ret*d I was (their words - not mine) popularity seemed like an unobtainable state of being reserved for those blessed with good genes, fashion sense, and familiarity with popular culture portrayed in music and television (both of which I never kept track of then, and well barely keep track of today either). Since a part of me knew I wasn't going to be popular no matter how much I tried, I decided that I was going to do the opposite - be as unpopular as I could be so people just left me alone.

Basically, rather then be "normal" I aimed for "sub-normal" which compliments of the brief Goth movement in the nineties made being distant, dark, and odd it's own somewhat acceptable social clique. In hindsight, it seems a bit weird that as long as you're advertising the fact that you're perpetually depressed, every day life is filled with mental angst, and your favorite color is Black or faded Black from too many washings - most people will simply accept whatever you show on the outside. Never mind that at the same time I was dressing up like the love child of Ozzy and Alice Cooper I was also a honor student that didn't do any drugs other then nicotine and alcohol (which was rather straight edge compared to what everyone else was doing during those years).
That I became popular due to being the mystical quiet guy that listens - is either some brilliant unintentional reverse psychology social experiment or an example of I will never totally understand NT's.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that even if you do your best to deny it, there's no escaping it. I deluded myself for years that I was simply "introverted", "shy", and "not a people person" - I could look up a thesaurus for more euphemistic phrases that sound milder then Aspergers but you get the gist. There is always that sense that you are different, you do not fit in, and how one responds to this varies from individual to individual. I'm not advocating that it's okay your son tries to implement a "tough guy" image, however if it were possible to do this without the accompanying school slack'dom... the best of both worlds?

What worked for me was figuring out that it's possible to incorporate my "dorky" self alongside the "tough guy" image I was using to masquerade as someone no one would want to piss off. Aside from the monochromatic wardrobe and trench coat collection, I wrote poetry and listened to Tori Amos in my free time - talk about super manly, huh? Also, come to think of it, if my parents ever bothered to pay attention to me I could have attributed this to some sort of teenage rebellion - but they were mostly " whatever, we don't have to worry about sorting colors too much when doing laundry."

Sitting him down to have a priority talk might work, although that might be tricky - telling him he's sliding into a downward spiral by skipping classes which will eventually result in the prestigious role of flipping burgers or serving latte's in the future might be hard to digest. Applauding the fact that he's making an effort to fit in social while being dismayed by how he's approaching this - there probably isn't a solution that will satisfy both of you. It might all come down to "you'll thank me later (hopefully)."

Not sure if this helps or not, but best of luck, Dave.