The Golden Rule

Page 1 of 4 [ 61 posts ] Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4 Next

Previous topic | Next topic

iamnotaparakeet
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 31 Jul 2007
Age: 39
Gender: Male
Posts: 25,091
Location: 0.5 Galactic radius

30 Oct 2010, 11:32 am

Matthew 7:12 wrote:

So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets.

When following this rule is it more important that "what you would have them do to you" be what they would like or be what you think is best? Or something else? Discuss.

ruveyn
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Age: 88
Gender: Male
Posts: 31,502
Location: New Jersey

30 Oct 2010, 12:24 pm

Which Golden Rule. The Christian Golden Rule: Do unto others as you would have them do unto you

OR

the Jewish Golden Rule: Do not do unto others what you do not want them to do unto you?

ruveyn

auntblabby
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 12 Feb 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 114,555
Location: the island of defective toy santas

30 Oct 2010, 12:43 pm

aren't they just opposite sides of the same ethical coin? one who really believes in treating others as one's own self, would do both things automatically.

leejosepho
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 14 Sep 2009
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,011
Location: 200 miles south of Little Rock

30 Oct 2010, 1:04 pm

Quote:

Matthew 7:12 wrote:

So in everything, do to others what you would have them do ...

... what they would like?
... what you think is best?
... something else?

Something else:

Quote:

"So in everything, do to others what you would (or 'will/wish to') have them do unto you."

I "will to" (or "wish to") be treated fairly, honestly, equally and justly (including reproof and correction) in at least some form of "brotherly love", so I essentially damn myself if I do not treat others in just that way.

_________________
I began looking for someone like me when I was five ...
My search ended at 59 ... right here on WrongPlanet.
==================================

number5
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 15 Jun 2009
Age: 46
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,691
Location: sunny philadelphia

30 Oct 2010, 1:08 pm

auntblabby wrote:

aren't they just opposite sides of the same ethical coin? one who really believes in treating others as one's own self, would do both things automatically.

If you're talking about ruveyn's post, I think the difference is due to a rather unpleasant historical event :wink:

leejosepho
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 14 Sep 2009
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,011
Location: 200 miles south of Little Rock

30 Oct 2010, 1:35 pm

auntblabby wrote:

aren't they just opposite sides of the same ethical coin?

Yes, such as in "going the second mile" even though you would never even think of demanding even one from the other.

_________________
I began looking for someone like me when I was five ...
My search ended at 59 ... right here on WrongPlanet.
==================================

auntblabby
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 12 Feb 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 114,555
Location: the island of defective toy santas

30 Oct 2010, 1:44 pm

number5 wrote:

auntblabby wrote:

aren't they just opposite sides of the same ethical coin? one who really believes in treating others as one's own self, would do both things automatically.

If you're talking about ruveyn's post, I think the difference is due to a rather unpleasant historical event :wink:

i know i have not walked in that man's shoes. all i can say is that i try to try always, to display both sides of the aforementioned ethical coin. i am sure he does as well.

ruveyn
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Age: 88
Gender: Male
Posts: 31,502
Location: New Jersey

30 Oct 2010, 2:12 pm

auntblabby wrote:

aren't they just opposite sides of the same ethical coin? one who really believes in treating others as one's own self, would do both things automatically.

No. The Christian version is altruistic and redolent with self sacrifice. The Jewish version is rationally selfish.

ruveyn

iamnotaparakeet
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 31 Jul 2007
Age: 39
Gender: Male
Posts: 25,091
Location: 0.5 Galactic radius

30 Oct 2010, 2:29 pm

ruveyn wrote:

auntblabby wrote:

aren't they just opposite sides of the same ethical coin? one who really believes in treating others as one's own self, would do both things automatically.

No. The Christian version is altruistic and redolent with self sacrifice. The Jewish version is rationally selfish.

ruveyn

Well, even within the Christian paradigm, not doing to others what you wouldn't want to have happen to yourself would be included I'd think. Since if you're doing to others what you wouldn't want to have happen to yourself then you'd also be violating the intention of the Christian version. Ideally it ought to be such that both are included together.

leejosepho
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 14 Sep 2009
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,011
Location: 200 miles south of Little Rock

30 Oct 2010, 2:38 pm

ruveyn wrote:

... redolent with self sacrifice ... rationally selfish.

Is there really all that much difference?!

_________________
I began looking for someone like me when I was five ...
My search ended at 59 ... right here on WrongPlanet.
==================================

ruveyn
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Age: 88
Gender: Male
Posts: 31,502
Location: New Jersey

30 Oct 2010, 11:58 pm

leejosepho wrote:

ruveyn wrote:

... redolent with self sacrifice ... rationally selfish.

Is there really all that much difference?!

Yes. A rationally selfish person works on behalf of his interest but has appropriate respect for the life and and property of others, an altruist or self-sacrificer works and suffers for the sake of others and subordinates his own interests for the sake of others.

ruveyn

skafather84
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 20 Mar 2006
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,848
Location: New Orleans, LA

31 Oct 2010, 12:34 am

ruveyn wrote:

auntblabby wrote:

aren't they just opposite sides of the same ethical coin? one who really believes in treating others as one's own self, would do both things automatically.

No. The Christian version is altruistic and redolent with self sacrifice. The Jewish version is rationally selfish.

ruveyn

Human sacrifices are okay in Christianity so long as you're the one nailing yourself to the cross.

_________________
Wherever they burn books they will also, in the end, burn human beings. ~Heinrich Heine, Almansor, 1823

?I wouldn't recommend sex, drugs or insanity for everyone, but they've always worked for me.? - Hunter S. Thompson

Wombat
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 7 Oct 2006
Age: 76
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,051

31 Oct 2010, 12:55 am

ruveyn wrote:

ruveyn, as usual you are spot on.
People talk about "Jewdo/Christian" values but they are quite different.

Judaism is a religion of law and logic.
Christianity is all about "heart" and weakness.

Frankly, if someone hits me in the face I am going to hit them back, not "turn the other cheek"

I might choose to give to charity but why should I take my expensive overcoat off and give it to some wino in the street?

The_Dude
Tufted Titmouse

Joined: 28 Aug 2010
Age: 54
Gender: Male
Posts: 30
Location: England.

31 Oct 2010, 6:07 am

How about, "Love your neighbor as yourself" Leviticus 19:18

and these?

"What you do not want others to do to you, do not do to others" The
doctrine of the mean 13, 500bc, Confucius.

"Do not do to others what would anger you if done to you by others"
Isocrates, 375bc

"This is the sum of all true righteousness: deal with others as thou
wouldst thyself be dealt by" Mahabharata, 150bc, (Hindu).

bloodshot
Blue Jay

Joined: 29 Dec 2009
Age: 36
Gender: Male
Posts: 94

31 Oct 2010, 6:27 am

Wombat wrote:

ruveyn wrote:

Excellent point. A rationally selfish person is more moral than a true altruist. Because the latter is not only near impossible, but it can be easily manipulated by the immoral to further his selfish agenda. Whereas the former will not offer the immoral the same opportunity.

auntblabby
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 12 Feb 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 114,555
Location: the island of defective toy santas

31 Oct 2010, 6:44 am

iron rule versus golden rule topic

Page 1 of 4 [ 61 posts ] Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4 Next

Jump to:

The Golden Rule Post Reply New Topic

The Golden Rule