Chrono Trigger and FF6: very, very overrated

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As a "softcore" gamer who started playing right when home video game systems became available to the masses-- the NES came out when I was four-- I don't even play new games at all. They suck. Some don't, of course, but all the ones I see do. They're too complicated, yet too easy at the same time.

RPGs was my genre of choice, and I can never forget the enthrallment I had as a child with the early Final Fantasys and Dragon Warriors. (Also loved that game Lufia and the Fortress of Doom for SNES, and all the Zeldas.) And then FFIII for SNES came out. And it was so wonderful. Revolutionary. Enchanting. At least that's what everyone else said. But I didn't like it so much. There was no challenge. Use one of many "tricks"-- Genji Glove + Offering, equip Gau with the Merit Award, etc.-- and boom, you've won the game. There were hundreds and hundreds of abilities that weren't necessary. To prove my point I once played through the game without using any Espers and it was not at all harder than with Espers, in fact it was easier because I didn't have to shuffle through so many useless extra menus with useless extra abilities.

They call this "revolutionary?"

And of course FF7 which came out a couple years later was a joke. A 4-year-old could beat that game it was so easy.

Chrono Trigger was even more of a disgrace. "Combo" abilities among the characters that are ALL THE SAME. The New Game + feature... where's the challenge in playing through the game with your levels maxed out? Sure the final boss was tough the first time but that doesn't redeem the game. Chrono Trigger wasn't altogether bad, and even if it did set the standards for future games, those standards suck. It just wasn't a four-star game.

Glory days are gone... except for the new Dragon Quests and Zeldas, there's not much to look forward to in the world of video games, except for how pretty the new ones are going to look, but that's not what games were originally about.

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I didn't see what the fuss was about Chrono Trigger.

I agree entirely with you on your thoughts on FF VII, Dragon Quests i play through on a regular basis, i know that my favorite series Tales of, is getting a little rundown and tired, but i still love it so, Chrono Trigger was a great game for its time, but now it shows its age, i think new gamers should have to play the old classics, aka Dragon Warrior III anyone? Though in all honesty DW I was the hardest hands down. Rogue Galaxy and Skies of Arcadia are amazing games though. Might want to check them out.

I agree that Chrono Trigger is overrated after playing it recently on the Wii Virtual Console.

You guys are not being fair with your reviews of the game. The game needs to be reviewed with the mindset of the people that played it during its time. Not reviewing it with your present experienced gamer minds.

Then, it was indeed a great game. Easy for casual gamers but still fun and long (with side-quests) for hardcore gamers. It had some simple game-changing mechanics, like no battle-mode screen needs to loaded. Also, mechanics like you can see your whole party as you walk around in the map. Other mechanics like area-of-effect spells that attacked more than one mob. And also, joint attack specialties involving more than one character's effort.

The games sound track and art gave the greatest soothing ambiance for its time. Which of course compared to modern game art/sound, for example, Fragile Dreams for the Wii, may be greater, but for its time, that game built a new standard.

Letting your overall emotion relate to how difficult the game is, is unfair. They are RPGs that allow you to build up your stats, with enough building any game of that genre feels easy. Though, just remember, a lot of the American publishers of these jrpgs altered the games to make them easier for america's casual gamer demographic.

Chrono Trigger seems pretty good by SNES standards, but "overrated" means its not one of the best RPGs ever like people often make it out to be.

I for one like both FF6 and Chrono Trigger. They came out at a time where the 16bit era was on its way out and you couldn't find much that better used the tech. Remember that for many gamers, sadly, they won't play a game unless it looks good. (It doesn't matter if it actually is good)

And really, CT and FF6 weren't really any different from FF4 and 5 before it. Both games, however, had their own compelling storyline that hooked me in and made the game worth playing until the end. In the end, out of the late SNES-era RPGs my heart still lies with Lufia II.

Nowadays, even though I have CT on the DS I do feel like it's mechanics have gotten stale over time. Square Enix has tried different combat systems, mostly derivative of the ATB system from that era and it really don't feel the same. Nowadays I've been gravitating more towards action-RPGs in that department.

(And honestly, FF7 despite it being a benchmark game for RPGs today is much more grossly overrated than FF6 or CT will ever be.)

Sure, the games are easy, but, I've played through those games more times than just about any other game in the world. I don't think they're overrated. Maybe you're just expecting too much.

For me, both of those games still have an entertaining story, great music, appealing visuals (even if they're dated), and overall are still fun to play. And yet, we have milestones games like Oblivion and Fallout which I could barely even play (because they're boring and not engaging for me).

We just see it differently, I suppose. If I want an entertaining story, great music and visuals, then I'd rather go watch a movie. A game is supposed to be a challenge that makes one think. Without this challenge, it doesn't deserve to be called a game. The main reason video games have lost their glitter is because they've become so easy.

A similar phenomenon happened with the old Super Mario Bros. games. In Mario 1 and 2, extra lives were hard to come by, but in 3, there were all those stomping tricks that could net you 99 lives at the very beginning. This tradition has continued pretty much unabated since then. This didn't kill off action games' challenge so much as the multiple abilities did in RPGs that I mentioned earlier, but my earliest memories of video games consist of panicking over being on my last life, so... for me that's how action games ought to be.

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I can go either way with game difficulty; I think making a game hard without making it frustrating is a real balancing act and one that I appreciate. I happen to be a fan of both CT and FF6, not because they were particularly difficult games but because they had engaging stories and interesting characters and actually took some time to beat. I also liked the + feature as I'm one of those people who likes to go back and kick the crap out of bosses that were hard the first time, it's just my nature asserting itself. I must admit that I did enjoy the extreme difficulty of say, the Xbox Ninja Gaiden, as beating some of the bosses and levels on the harder modes in that one really gives you a feeling of having accomplished something.

You're one of the very few RPG fans that actually sees things this way...... and I think it's great.

I agree with you, and I applaud you for not looking at these games and going "Oh, but it's Square, they MUST be good" or "they were REVOLUTIONARY!!111".

FF6 wasnt bad, no.... but for me, it marked the point when, with Square, games became about being "flashy and cool" rather than, well, having good gameplay and design.

There really ARE alot of totally useless abilities and spells in the game. There's just SO MANY that you will never, ever use in battle. Stuff like Poison, or Break, various spells/skills that have dinky effects like that, or that have effects that nearly never hit (or are resisted by anything strong enough to actually warrant it's use). The skills and spells simply were not thought out well, or balanced well.

And the BIG spells.... like Ultima.... did you need them? Heck no. Even WITHOUT the many funky tricks in the game, AND without any grinding (because I dont do grinding), the game is STILL very easy. The game gives you those huge spells..... but it gives you no real incentive to use them. There are not bosses or enemies or areas where it's like, "oh, I'd have a higher chance of survival if I had this spell!". Instead, with this (and ALOT of Square's games since) it's "Oh, I'll kill the funky hell outta the boss FASTER and EVEN EASIER if I have this spell!". I never went through and got the giant spells or the rare items, because I saw no practical need for it (which is how I play alot of RPGs. I dont care about completion.... I care about practicality. Make me want the items, not just to HAVE them, but because they're USEFUL.... that's what I want to see in these games).



I agree with this as well.

Story is fine and all, but when it becomes basically everything the game is, well.... it's just not much of a game anymore. Alot of developers (Square in particular) have forgotten that games should be about gameplay FIRST, and everything else SECOND. If you wanna have a great deep story in there, hey, that's fine. But have the good, deep gameplay to back it up; make THAT the priority.

A good example: I dont play many RPGs these days, and this is mostly because alot of them are like that. Too easy, too simple, too BORING. Too much story, too much focus on cinemas and flashiness, not enough good gameplay. Yet every now and then, I'll find one that does what I want. Resonance of Fate, recently, is that one. Oh, there's a story, a pretty long story. But that developer puts the gameplay FIRST. The battle system is complex and interesting, and very enjoyable. The game is also HARD, and just grinding aint gonna save you, not with the way the stats and stuff work. The game is, as RPGs tend to be, filled with various hidden powerful weapons and stuff.... and unlike Square's games, THIS one makes me see a real USE for them. Because it IS hard, challenging.... it's just good overall. And the story doesnt try super hard to be emo, it doesnt do 15 minute cutscenes. When it does a cutscene, it's well-written and to the point. Alot of the scenes are funny, instead of "dramatic".

EVERYTHING about it is better than any Square RPG I have ever played. And it's not the only one. The problem these days though, is that you have to know where to look. But good games of the sort you speak of.... they ARE out there.

Oh, and as for Mario, I get what you mean with the "lots of lives" thing.... but that's just sorta a staple of the Mario series. Sure, Super Mario World might spit 90 1up mushrooms at you over the course of the game, but this is how I see it: If I play through the game, and I use 60 of those lives, well.... the game just kicked my ass. The point, I think, is to play through and see how few times you can die. The 1ups are.... more just for fun. Like "Wow, I've got so many Marios, haha" sort of thing.



Actually, I think they ARE being fair.

As a retro-gaming fan, I understand just what you mean; that reviewing older games, by comparing them to RECENT standards, is bloody stupid. I see people do that all the time, and it irritates me. To see them miss out on games they might otherwise love simply because "well it's old and stupid" is just sad.

But even thinking in the way you suggest.... by comparing them to other games of that time, and that mindset back then.... they're STILL not all that great.

I look at FF6 and often compare it to even older games, such as FF1. The very first game. That one was brilliant. Or Dragon Quest 1-3. Or various other games on the NES of the RPG type. And many that were on the SNES.

FF6 had alot of really wonky design flaws, as I mentioned up above... that type of thing isnt really good in ANY era of gaming. It was ALSO extremely buggy. Like, *really* buggy. that's just LAZY on Square's part. So yes, comparing them to other games of that time, I STILL find the other games to be better.



And note, that's not to say that FF6 or CT are bad games. They arent. They're decent enough. I enjoyed 6 well enough, when I played through that awhile back. But it just doesnt live up to other RPGs in my view. And WAY too many RPGs these days are even worse. Look at FF13.... ugh. It's more a visual novel than a damn game. It's a sad trend, as I see it.




Actually, the opposite is true. There actually IS quite alot... and I do mean ALOT..... of good to be found in gaming lately... the problem is that it's not the same as it used to be. I know what you mean.... alot of big-name games just arent..... all that interesting. I feel the same way. But..... that just means you have to look elsewhere. Look at some more obscure developers, or indie devs. Look on Steam, look on XBLA, look for games that not alot of people may know about. You can find alot of great gems there, that fit the sort of ideas you like in gaming. I know this because I do it myself that way. Alot of recent retail releases just bore me, so I learned to look in different places to find the sorts of games I want. And they're out there.... many of them.

It takes effort to find them now, but there are still tons of devs out there that know what a real "game" is and should be. Search them out.

I didn't really care for ff6, but then again I didn't get to REALLY play the snes version. I played it.. but I only rented then bought the psx version. The horrible load times and lack of an interesting story (only character I liked was Shadow.. and maybe general leo for a couple of minutes) just was kinda meh.

Now Chrono Trigger on the other hand was just an epic game.. sooo much to do, such an interesting premise with going back and time and changing things to get a different result later. Chrono Cross couldn't imitate that (don't get me wrong I love chrono cross, work of art).

Awesome cast.. each character more interesting than the next, awesome soundtrack for a snes game also. I didn't care for the plot itself totally.. but the tone and pacing set the story perfectly. Also the graphics for the time.. were just epic, Squaresoft was a true visionary (in my opinion once again).

Keep in mind tho I never played a ton of SNES rpgs other than those two games and super mario rpg.. also the final fantasy with Cecil (forget which one numerically).

I seriously have to disagree with this topic's statement. Chrono Trigger just happens to be one of my favorite RPG's. That game was pretty epic and not many games these days are epic enough for me sit there and play them for several hours on end. The last time I played through the game was two years ago and I beat it in like five days and lost a lot of sleep but it was so worth it. The game is so deep and it introduced a lot of concepts that are now standard in an RPG such as having multiple endings and a New Game +. Final Fantasy 6 is also an epic game primarily because of the world it takes place in. It was the first game in the series to take place in a modernized world where people who could naturally learn magic barely existed and those that could were used and exploited as tools of war. The premiss made for an epic story and very enjoyable characters though FF9 is at the top of my list for best characters.

I must say I find Final Fantasy VI to be fantastic and VII,X and XII to be grossly overrated.Chrono Trigger is also fantastic.
I agree people rave about them to much but for me the game play and story back up what people say about VI and CT while the Sphere Grid and Tidus killed X for me the battle system and Vaan killed twelve for me and people Sephrioth and Cloud fetish killed VII for me for now.

Those old RPG's were not renowned for their gameplay. The ones that came before it definitely weren't any better, gameplay OR storywise. FF1-3 were easy. 4 was easy if you grinded a bit.

I don't know if you figured out some FF6 exploit on your own or whether you looked it up but I never came across any of those 'tricks'. You don't have to use them either. It's your choice. Summons have never been that important in an FF game (unless you count Rydia..). You think that's proof that the games have unnecessary abilities? The Espers are there for FUN.

RPGs as a rule are not difficult. The only way that difficulty has really been achieved is by artificial means. For example, giving a monster instant death abilities or forcing the player to fight wave after wave of enemies with few resources and few savepoints. About Chrono Trigger you're getting way too worked up over combo abilities... they weren't that big a deal. What did you actually want to see from New Game + anyway? I agree that it's not much fun going through it overpowered but what did you want?

Zelda isn't even an RPG. I don't even know why you mentioned it...


In my opinion most RPGs are mediocre. When I play an RPG I want a good storyline and decent combat. I usually skip battles if they become easy/boring. Unfortunately most RPGs have bad storylines. The only good one I've played recently has been The World Ends With You (DS). All of the PS3 games I've played have been disappointing. FFXIII was a piece of s**t (good gameplay though). Star Ocean: The Last Hope is actually embarassing to play in front of other people because of the terrible dialogue and worse voice acting. I have White Knight Chronicles but I've heard it's just as bad.

I think the better ones you're going to find these days are on portable systems.


@Misery: You've got to be joking about FF1... that game sucked. Story was bad. Gameplay was bad (extremely easy, extremely repetitive).

I agree with Chrono Trigger, FFVI, not so much.

Chrono Trigger was too short, too easy, and had a fairly mediocre translation story-wise IMO. The characters were very, very flat. The awesome thing about the game was the time-traveling.

FFVI isn't near popular enough to be overrated, especially with FFVII floating around.