Initial diagnoses and possible neurotransmitter relation

Post Reply New Topic

On Wednesday, I finally met with a specialist that diagnoses adult Asperger’s in Ridgewood, NJ. It was very educational and learned a lot about my self. Most of the questions were about my childhood ranging from birth (literally) to college. There were also questions about my current state. The specialist said that she would not have a formal diagnoses until January as she likes to look over her notes afterwards and consult with other specialist. She also wanted to speak to my wife and ask her some questions about myself. She did tell me that her initial impression that I have at least a mild case of Asperger’s. She was very professional and I felt very comfortable speaking to her. (I usually find it easier to talk to women than men anyway.)

A couple of interesting things did come up. I told her about the online Aspie test at http://www.rdos.net/eng/Aspie-quiz.php and she was very curious about it. The other interesting thing was that I mentioned the I had been seeing Dr Hoffman http://www.drhoffman.com (an holistic doctor) as my step father had highly recommended him to me and my wife. I discovered many things (non Aspie related) from him. There is one Aspie thing that did show up although I didn’t know it at the time. Dr Hoffman discovered that my neurotransmitters were all flat (Dopamine and Serotonin levels were the lowest and Norepinephrine was low as well.) One of the things I take under his recommendation is “5 HTP” with tyrosine. The tyrosine is used to allow the 5 HTP to penetrate the membrane surrounding the brain. Anyway, she was very curious about the 5 HTP and some people are using it to help Asperger patients deal with society and with concentration. The biggest thing it help with me is concentration as I don’t get distracted as easily when taking 5 HTP. My wife tells me I’m easier to deal with when taking 5 HTP as I have more emotion as I don’t react emotionally to things. (Just call me Spock.)

The specialist also wants to talk to Dr Hoffman as she was very interested in my results and case. I told her that the 5 HTP isn’t a cure drug or anything like that, it just helps me with my thinking. A side effect is that visually, I find colors more brilliant. According to my wife, when taking 5 HTP she is able to read me better and I haven’t had any side effects from it. She did tell me that it was inconclusive as to whether people with Asperger’s have low neurotransmitters or not. This is due to debate as whether the urine test used to measure neurotransmitters is accurate to the true levels of ones brain.


-Scott

I'm not sure about 5-HTP and Tyrosine helping one another. In THEORY, they would work AGAINST one another. There is something known as the blood brain barrier, and it lets things through almost single file. So if you are deficient in 5-HTP, the Tyrosine could delay its effect and vice versa.

Tyrosine can help mood, but it is best for memory. It is an ESSENTIAL amino acid. You NEED to get it from the outside.

5-HTP is a metabolite of Tryptophan. The MORONS in the FDA, to help the blithering idiots in japan that basically MURDERED people, decided to outlaw Tryptophan which is ANOTHER required amino acid. It also helps mood, seratonin, melatonin, niacin, etc..... levels. LUCKILY, 5-HTP is actually better for the brain because it crosses the barrier easier, and has already gone through the main metabolic step.

LUCKILY, the current established method to make 5-HTP is totally different from tryptophan. Of course, that japanese firm didn't even use the established method to create tryptophan.

They should feed cow manuer to all the people responsible for that tryptophan garbage, and getting them off. After all, by their reckoning, THAT is tryptophan, which is HARMLESS and required!

Anyway, I have taken both. Mainly, when I start to get a little depressed I would take 5-HTP. I am still taking tyrosine. The tyrosine actually LOWERED my pulse, etc.... That is ODD, as it is supposed to INCREASE it!

Logically, this would have NO effect on AS, other than to improve memory, make you think a little clearer, and be more rested/relaxed. It would do the same with an NT. It would probably have less effect with kids due to diet and requirements.

Steve

I think I understand all this!

HUH?

Jason, are you trying to imply something?

Steve

You are trying to make a valid point.

Hey guys,

I don't have as much time as I would like to respond to your messages right now, but think your information and experiences are very interesting. Your postings definately got my brain going (think...think...think). I wrote a short paper on autism and the neurochemical connections back in 1998 when I was attending a junior college. I'll have find it because I remember writing about the 5-HTP experiments with autism. They're old studies but perhaps something of interest will come from it. Also, people with autism/AS commonly react differently to medications, sometimes even having the opposite reaction to the drug. Personally, I know that I react really differently to drugs--it seems like I'm always the 1-3 % of people who has a bad reaction, not neccessarily an allergic, just adverse. Thanks for sharing your experience with the diagnosis process and the meds that are helping you out.

5-HTP isn't a drug. It is a metabolite of an essential amino acid. It also isn't the cure for autism. I guess it COULD increase the IQ a bit so the LFAs have a better chance of being HFA, and the HFAs might have a better chance trying to fit in, but it doesn't simply solve the problems. AND, of course, it is all mental. That COULD do things like help eyesight a bit, but the sensory skewing is STILL there.

I think the tyrosine COULD augment the effect in a way.

Anyway, that said, I am taking acetyl L carnitine and tyrosine now. It works GREAT! The skewing is still there. The AS behaviour and ability is still there. If anything, it is stronger because... The amount of short term memory, and reliabilty is increased. Heck, I am even SLEEPING like I used to!

BTW if you want to sleep normally, you should probably take the 5-HTP late at night because it has a calming effect, and tyrosine in the morning because it has a stimulating effect.

ALSO, don't take much tyrosine. Most recommend LESS than 1 gram.

Steve

That's ok!

I'll be around for a great deal of the time!

Meg623.

If you were alergic to 5-HTP you would go crazy and die! No human could survive without it.

The only way that you could have an allergic reaction is if you were allergic to the grifonia seeds. But thy DO claim it is 99.9% pure.

The only problems I found with it were when seratonin should not be increased.

Steve

This is how I am. Lots of people take 5-HTP to go to sleep, but when I take it, even a little bit, it's horrible. It's like speed to me. I get irritable, full of energy that I don't know what to do with, which makes me more irritable, my hands tremble, I get hot and red in the face and sweat a lot.

I can take a very small amount and just get an "energy boost" from it, but I have to take less than a quarter of what a normal person would take.

Hot and read in the face sounds like niacin, one of the byproducts. Have you tried taking less?

Steve

I've tried two different brands, and I can only tolerate about 20mg. That's hard when the smallest pill they make is 50mg, so I have to open each pill up and dump out more than half of it.

I really think it's the increased serotonin that's doing it to me because taking SSRIs like Zoloft or SNRIs like Cymbalta (even in half doses or less) does the same thing to me. Additionally, anything with a "stimulant" effect is bad, bad news for me. I can't take most decongestants (pseudoephedrine is the devil), I can't drink caffeine, etc.

He gave me the impression that the tyrosine enables the 5-HTP to work better and be more affective. I take it in a liquid form (it comes in different flavors from Chocolate to Ginger.) I take a tablespoon in the morning 30 minutes before breakfast and another tablespoon in the evening 30 minutes before dinner. According to the bottle, the amount of Tyrosine is greater than 5-HTP. It contains 5mg/ml of 5-HTP and 50mg/ml of tyrosine. Since 1 tablespoon = 15 ml, I'm taking 75mg of 5-HTP and 750mg of Tyrosine twice a day.

I do seem to sleep better at night when I do take it despite the Tyrosine in it. My non-aspie wife also takes it when she is burned out from a project (which is a lot these days) under the advice of Dr Hoffman. However it has the opposite effect on her sleep and keeps her awake at night. Therefore she can only take it in the morning.

The fact that 5-HTP is NOT a drug is what makes it so attractive to forms of medication which I try to stay way from if possible.


-Scott

I guess you like the new laws then! People are "smurfing" pseudoephedrine to make methamphetamine, so it is now against the law to sell pseudoephedrine "over the counter". They have to give it to you after getting your ID, so it is easier to avoid.

Maybe your right, but that isn't an allergy. BTW you mentioned SSRIs you aren't taking THOSE within a couple weeks of the 5-htp,RIGHT? If you do, it is DANGEROUS, and THAT is probably your problem. The worst that could happen from a thing like that is COMA or DEATH, so it isn't good. cymbalta works by disabling the ability to clean up the seratonin(so it lets you retain more). 5-HTP works by helping you to make more.

tallfreak,

YEP, as I said, I take it also. I cut back on the 5-HTP simply because, for me, the other stuff was working so well. If it works for you, GREAT!

Steve

Sorry Steve,

I understand about the 5-HTP and am glad you cleared that up. I didn't have much time to respond yesterday so my sentences were very general. To be more specific, I meant medications and supplements--even vitamins and natural herbs, roots, etc. can elicit a different or opposite reaction in people with autism and AS. There were actually two different ideas/comments in my first post. To have made myself more clear, I should have made a new paragraph when I started the sentence, "Also, people with autism/AS commonly react differently to medications..."
Anyways, it's all good--I enjoy reading your comments as you seem extremely knowledgable on this subject.


Mnemosyne,

I just wanted to share that niacin also causes my face to become red and flushed. My hands shake and turn red and white. I even get dizzy/lightheaded sometimes--it's not comfortable and it is pretty much the same reaction that I have if I ingest too mch caffine. I can tolerate a little caffine and niacin which I sometimes use for energy.

I have been taking 5HTP for a week and am already feeling much better; calmer in my thinking, more logical, more energy and am sleeping better than I have done before. I have great difficulties with sensitivity issues and scored 17 in the HSP test that is another thread. My mind is permanently full of worry about how people treat me, situations at work etc to the extent that I am constantly mulling over what people have done and are likely to do. I also am permanently depressed from thinking over past situations that I simply cannot let go at all. The last week has been real progress for me; I am no longer permanently hungry or craving the boost that sweet food brings.

Yoyo