Did you have any problems when learning to drive?

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I know that there have been a couple of posts referrig to drivig recently, however I didn't feel that what I want to talk about fits exactly, so I have made this new post.

Some background information - information that I think is relevent to this post, but you might disagree. (Sometimes I ramble and write too much. I do find summarising hard - all the information seems important and relevant to me). Feel free to skip to the part where I describe the issues/problems that I have when learning to drive.

I am currently learning to drive. I had my first driving lesson on my 17th birthday (for free as my Step-Dad is a driving instructor), with weekly lessons following for a couple of months, however I only stayed around a little estate as my anxiety wasn't very good - I was suffering with Depression at the time. I was then hospitalised due to my depression, which meant that I wasn't allowed to drive for about 9 months; even if I was allowed, I didn't feel confident enough. Once I had recovered from my depression, I didn't resume driving because I wasn't interested/motivated. When I was 18, I started going out with my boyfriend. We lived 20 minutes away from each other, so I started driving from his house back to mine when my step-dad came to pick me up - I started driving then as it was 9pm onwards so the roads were quite empty. After a couple of months, I started driving to and from our houses then, and sometimes to 6th form if I wasn't feeling too tired. The driving practice was good but I wasn't having any lessons, which meant that I couldn't even do any manoeuvers as I hadn't learnt them yet, however I was driving on all roads which was better than when I was depressed.

Eventually I started proper weekly driving lessons (still free as they were from my step-dad) - I've had approximately 60. The first 40 were in 2 hour blocks which I didn't like as I was finding that I was starting to lose my concentration after 45 minutes, and my concentration would be pretty much completely gone after an hour and 15. This meant that the rest of the 45 minutes that I was driving, I was driving pretty dangerously. I persisted and he eventually agreed to do driving lessons 2 1 hour blocks per week, instead of 1 2 hour block per week.

Since having my driving lessons weekly, I have found that I have come across several issues with regards to my driving.
+ Taking things literally. If my step-dad asks me to "hold it there/stop", I just stop straight away, when really he didn't want me to stop in that exact position, he wanted me to come to a controlled stop. There are a lot more, but I'm struggling to think of any more.
+ Roundabouts! I find that I am too hesitant as I don't know when it's my turn to go. My step-dad says that I need to "look at the 'body language' of the cars - look at where the wheels are facing and the position of the car, and you'll clearly be able to tell where the cars are going." WRONG. I just get confused, and I often have to wait until the car is near its exit or it's started to exit the roundabout before I can decide if I can go.
+My step-dad tells me to try and give the other drivers eye contact. Does he know me at all?
+ Lack of concentration. I find that driving requires me to concentrate so much, and I get really tired quickly. When my concentration goes, I start to drive really dangerously and I can't change it.
+ Memory - manoeuvers. I found manoeuvers really hard to learn at first, and once I learnt them, if I didn't do them for a couple of weeks, I would have to completely re-learn them again. It wasn't just refreshing my memory, it took me the same amount of time to re-learn them as it did to learn them in the first place. This has happened more than 6 times.
+ Not being able to find reference points. Even now when I drive, I don't have a reference point. I must subconsciously as I always seem to drive in the same position, but not consciously as I couldn't find one. My step-dad asked me to try and line things on the car up with points on parked cars/kerbs as I was driving past, but my eyes couldn't 'draw a line' from my car to the parked cars/kerbs when I was moving, therefore I couldn't get one.
+ Judging speed/depth. I find this hard for some reason. For example, I'm hesitant when turning onto another road when I have to take the traffic on that road into account, as I don't know how far away they are. I think they're too close so I don't go, when really I could've gone.
+ My reflexes being slow. It took me a whole hour to get the 'Emergency Stop' quick enough. Also, once I got this right, if I hadn't used it in a few lessons, it'd be too slow, so I'd have to spend another lesson getting quick enough again.
+ I'm not flexible enough. My step-dad says "things aren't always so black and white!" He says this most lessons. For example, when I was learning the left reverse, I asked how much I needed to turn the steering wheel. My step-dad told me that all corners are different and that there isn't a set angle that you need to get around the corner, you need to "feel for it". I just couldn't do this as I had absolutely no idea how much to turn it. I have now realised that I need to turn the steering wheel 3/4 of the way to the left when I get to my exact point of turn, and then when I'm a certain distance away from the kerb (I know when it's right from using the left mirror), I can turn the steering wheel to the right again and carry on with the manoeuver.
+ I'm too exact/precise. For example, when I'm doing a parallel park, I make sure that that back wheels are in line with the car that I'm using to park behind by using my left mirror. If I'm slightly out, I have to correct it otherwise I won't be able to continue with the manoeuver, despite my step-dad telling me that it doesn't matter.
+ I am driving "too fast for the situation", despite not speeding. I often take bends faster than I'm supposed to, although it feels fine to me. I usually reply with "but I'm not doing over 30mph (which is the speed limit)" to which my step-dad will reply with "it doesn't matter, it's too fast for the situation." I will then ask how fast I'm meant to go, and he will say that there isn't a set speed limit that I can do as all bends are different, I need to feel what the right speed is.

Wow, reading all of those things written down makes me seem like a really bad driver, and a nightmare to teach! :/

There definitely are more problems that I have when it comes to driving/learning to drive, but I can't think of any more at the moment. If I think of them, I'll add them in as an EDIT.

Do you think that these things are related to AS or something else? (I do have Chronic Fatigue Syndrome (CFS)/M.E which partly explains the fatigue issues).
Does anyone else share any of these issues?
Do you have other issues that I haven't mentioned?

Ummmmm........ I thought every single of one of those points (save one) was "inexperenced driver".

The reference point one is outside of my knowledge, I'm not exactly sure what you mean by that.

When learning to drive, I'm not aware of anyone who learned in 2 hour blocks, everyone I know learned in one hour blocks.

Oh, and Roundabouts were designed to be difficult, it's supposed to cut the speed and encourage good driving. I'd like to thank the brilliant person who brought them back into common use.

Thanks for your reply.

Interesting. I know what you mean by 'inexperienced driver', and I know that at some point when learning to drive, most people will struggle with learning to do manoeuvers/using roundabouts for example, but I think that the point I was trying to make is that according to my step-dad, I'm not like other people he's taught (he's been an instructor for 20 years), I take a lot longer than other people, and the issues that I have mentioned, I seem to struggle with more/for longer than his other learners.

I wondered if it's not specifically AS related, or if others who have an ASD might have some of the issues listed.

i didn't have exactly the same problems you did, but i learned to drive more slowly than my sisters did. i still don't parallel-park well.

I had problems learning to drive. I failed my first test, and it wasn't until I got to my 3rd driving instructor and had taken over 200 lessons that I finally passed. I still get a bit nervous driving and will only drive locally and routes that I know.

I have problems with people directing traffic knowing what they want me to do but I got my liscense easily enough just practiced a lot.

Yeah, the learning to drive part (far too much to focus on for my highly selective brain).

I was also a slow learner, used 37 lessons before I got my licence. I might compare this to my inability to learn how to dance or do complicated karate moves (katas). I truly suck and is the last one to learn stuff like this. This was also the case when I started learning to drive. (And to those in the US, stickshift is standard in Europe!) I could not understand how others learned to drive so quickly, while I still struggled with the basic stuff. Ifound that I had to rethink the whole concept of driving in my brain, going trough every turn and roundabout in my mind and even find one of my toy cars from childhood to double check. Luckily, I found a toy car with steering wheel on the roof, a Corgi School car (oh, the irony). I then became much more aware on where to place my car in traffic, how to parralell park, etc. It also helps alot to read up on how a clutch and engine really work toghether and truly understand this, at least my brain caught up with stickshift driving when I finally understood the mystery of the clutch.

But to comfort you, I have now been driving for more than 25 years without causing even the smallest accident. I am totally anonymous in the traffic, driving smoothly, not too fast not too slow and I can count on my hands the times someone honked at me.
I strongly believe the same thing will happen to you when you get over the first "ditch". When your body learn to drive and not only your stubborn "focus on everything irellevant" brain, things will go much more smoothly.

I relate to all of that. I have been trying to learn to drive since age 17 and I am now 30 and have pretty much given up as I think I might be a danger on the road even if I did eventually qualify. My last instructor also told me that he had never taught anyone 'like me' before. I am sure that there are those with AS who are brill drivers but I am not really one of them.

This sounds like a communication problem that is as much down to him as you. If he knows about your AS he needs to moderate his language to take account of your literalness. My first instructor was bad at this but the next one gave MUCH more clear and precise instructions e.g. "After the next lamppost I would like you to come to a controlled stop and then park the car." is vastly more informative than "Hold it there". Of course there are situations where an immediate and concise instruction is required so you probably need to establish pre-agreed and completely unambiguous meanings for certain phrases.



The way the wheels are facing can be helpful. If everybody were to "do" roundabouts according to the rules then it would be very easy as cars in the outside lane would only ever be taking one of the exits on the left (in the UK). However people don't do this and a lot of people make no effort to indicate so as he said paying attention to things like their wheels is helpful. If you struggle to do that then sometimes you do just have to wait until the other car actually starts to turn to exit the roundabout.



Aspie or not that is bad advice. If you are making eye contact with other drivers you're not looking at the road. The only places you need to look when you are driving are: the road, other road users (e.g. cars, bicycles, horses, motorbikes etc.), your mirrors and of course pedestrians and other potential hazards. Why on earth would looking at people's eyes be useful while driving? In fact some people are likely to respond by giving you the finger or shouting abuse - not a situation you want to find yourself in while driving especially as an aspie.



Have you perhaps advanced to driving on roads which require very high levels of concentration too quickly? When you are surrounded by large amounts of traffic with all the sensory inputs that entails AND you have to concentrate on a skill you are not totally competent at (driving) then you are definitely going to get exhausted quickly. If he has hurried you into that before controlling the car itself is second nature to you then he has failed as an instructor imo - having a "omg what do I do moment" at the same time as the sensory input from dozens of vehicles around you is a recipe for disaster.



When I was learning, once my instructor introduced me to maneuvers then we would practice each one at least once or twice in each lesson. Perhaps one of your lessons each week could be dedicated to the maneuvers i.e. parallel parking, bay parking, reversing round the different types of corners and turning in the road. The other lesson could then be driving practice. Just a suggestion. I think the general point I'm trying to make is that your step-dad needs to adjust his style of tuition to your style of learning; your AS isn't going away so he needs to be the flexible one here. If he doesn't understand that then maybe your mum could explain it to him if you can't?



Personally I don't use "reference points" and such; I'm not even entirely sure I understand the concept. I find that the position I drive compared to parked cars etc is just something I gradually learned as I went from driving round very quiet residential areas and progressed into busier and faster roads. Again, maybe you progressed a little too fast? I dunno.



Do you have difficulties crossing the road on foot when there is no pedestrian crossing? The way I started to learn to judge whether it would be safe to turn into oncoming traffic is if I would be able to cross the road on foot in the time it would take for the car to get there. I found that was usually a generous estimate and gave me a good amount of time to complete the turn safely. Again if you are very uncomfortable doing this then you may have progressed a little bit too far too quickly.



I'm not sure I can offer anything constructive about this part. I'm not sure if any exercises exist which can improve your reflexes. Personally I am convinced that years of playing Counter Strike at a moderately high level improved my reflexes quite a lot; in fact I think I learned a lot of skills that transferred to my driving from playing those kind of environment awareness/reaction based type games.



I'm not sure that he isn't the one who isn't flexible enough. My driving instructor gave me a guideline for certain types of corners exactly like the one you have discovered yourself e.g. turn the steering wheel 3/4 of the way (that is just a random example, don't use it) and then adjust as required. He also gave me reference in my rear windows to pay attention to when reversing round corners. I do it without thinking now so I'm not sure I can properly explain.



I believe the rule in the UK is that your car must be within 1 foot of the kerb when you are parallel parking. He's right on this one, it doesn't matter if the wheels line up. In fact, a lot of the time the wheels just aren't going to line up because the car you are parking behind may be a different width to your car. Additionally, if they have parked badly it is undesirable to have your wheels lined up with them. It *is* desirable to park in a relatively optimum fashion in a reasonable timeframe (I believe you get 2 minutes for that maneuver in the test?). Try to think that way although as another aspie I know how difficult it can be to change rigid thinking.



With this one I am inclined to agree with your step-dad. I made those exact same mistakes as a learner driver. The speed limit is exactly that: a LIMIT, it is not a goal for you to reach. You *never* want to put yourself into a position where you will need to brake harshly or take drastic evasive maneuvers - that is how you lose control of your vehicle. Personally I worked it all out by having a mental checklist of situations in which I needed to slow or alter my driving. Eventually the checklist became second nature. If he is an experienced driving instructor he will at least know what it takes to pass the test and so if he says you are going too quickly he is probably right. He needs to explain to you in detail precisely WHY you were going too quickly afterwards so that you can rationalise it to yourself. If he feels insulted by your questioning him to that level then again he needs to learn some more about aspies before he can teach you effectively. For example, you may feel comfortable turning a corner at, say, 27 mph. Or a bend in a 40mph zone at 40. However, you may have left yourself very little margin for error. If there is a hazard which you didn't see round that corner such as a wet patch of road, an obstruction or a child running into the road you will not have time to respond and may cause an accident.



If this is a pretty comprehensive picture you've given us then I think the biggest problem here is a communication difficulty between you and your stepdad/instructor. Your AS means you are going to have a different style of learning to almost any of the other pupils he has taught. From the sounds of things he needs to be more flexible. I learned to drive before I was diagnosed with AS and even still my driving instructor managed to adapt the way he taught me to my weaknesses and strengths which he caught on to very quickly and intuitively. He was an ex-army sergeant and driving instructor and so when he was so empathetic, understanding and flexible I was suprised. I went from struggling a LOT like you at the beginning to progressing VERY quickly, passing my test first time and, if I do say so myself, I'm now a very good and safe driver. The right instructor made ALL the difference to me. If you two are, after trying, unable to develop a communication and style of working together which enables you to make good solid progress then, as difficult as it might be considering he is your stepdad, you might want to get another instructor.



I had pretty much all of the issues you described when learning to drive. I also have AS and an undiagnosed chronic pain/fatigue type thing which may well turn out to be CFS, I dunno - I'm seeing a rheumatologist soon to try to find out what. So I have great sympathy as all of this is very familiar to me. I think it's all about the tuition being catered to your style of learning. I also was lucky enough to get on really well with my driving instructor and we would laugh and joke while during the lesson which helped relax me. edit: Forgot one thing: because like you I would lose concentration toward the end of the lesson we would do the parts involving the most difficult roads first and then practice my maneuvers which are slower and therefore safer toward the end.

Last edited by invisiblesilent on 30 Dec 2012, 4:55 pm, edited 3 times in total.

Yes parallel parking and driving in reverse gave me some problems and so did driving on the highway for the first time (it included being pretty apprehensive about driving on the highway for the first time, but maybe that is most everyone).

Actually now I just really do not parallel park and if my only option is to park between two cars I will drive around until I find an alternate place. I am not able to park by reversing into a parking space like most people do and if I was asked to do this I would be extremely wary of bumping into the cars on either side of me.

^^^ This ^^^ (but I do understand what you mean about the reference points).

You just need more practice. Some people learn more quickly than others, some more slowly.

I started learning when I was 21 - I had 40 hours of lessons before my first test (with no additional driving practice as I had no access to a vehicle). I failed on reversing round a corner. Then I didn't try again until I was 27 - I had another 40 hours of lessons and plenty of additional driving practice with my (now) husband. We particularly spent lots of time practising manoeuvres and roundabouts. With my instructor I spent about 4 hours of lessons approaching one major roundabout in the city I live from every direction and leaving at every exit. I still hate that roundabout and still hesitate. Actually, I don't really like driving at all and although I went through a few years where I drove a lot, I now barely drive at all.

I don't drive, and I never plan on learning. I'm afraid something horrible will happen if I did drive.

Learning to? WEll, at first I had issues because I needed glasses. But learning to drive, after that, not so bad..
My problem was the driving test ( practical, not written, that one is a breeze). But my first true attempt at the full test was a flop. The tester freaked me out. Also, one of those Sterotypical DMV types. I thought they were only in the movies & on TV. But no.. I found the archetypal evil examinar.
Took it a second time, passed. More recently, I let my license expire. Back to the driving range. Flunked Parrallel parking ( misjudged a cone-automatic fail). The examinar was an ex-neighbor of mine, very sympathetic. Lots of practice, second time again.
Moral: Just do not give up. Also, be ware the DMV!

Sincerely,
Matthew

When I described my experiences of learning to drive, my therapist said "I am glad you don't drive." I have many difficulties, but the one that I think really keeps me off the road is that if I watch the road, I lose track of things on the road. If I watch the things on the road, I lose track of the road. I can only watch one thing at a time.

I am unable to drive with one exception--I can drive on a thruway (or any other long, straight stretch of road) just fine, as doing so is quite simple...if you've passed one vehicle, you've passed them all. There's no trying to figure out what should happen at intersections or whether or not a street is one-way, etc.

The result is that I don't sit behind the wheel at any time during the year apart from trips we take in the car. Then I contribute hundreds of miles.